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Thread: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

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    Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    Hello,

    I am excited to be able to join this forum, as I recently purchased a home with a pool. This is my first entry into pool ownership, but I have been reading everything I can. Unfortunately my excitement has been dampening as we found an issue with significantly elevated levels of copper in the pool. We also have two little kids (under 4!) and the metals are very concerning to me. I have poured in 4 Liters of metal free, but still have copper (purple on the accucheck per Leslie's pools, which they stated was very high, but did not give me a #). I bought my own copper strips, which should be arriving tomorrow, so I can measure at home, and hopefully get a ppm measurement. Regardless, it was "purple" before 4L of metal free and after. I have also backwashed the DE filter following the metal free administration.

    I would prefer to remove the copper, rather than sequester/chelate it, and from what I understand there are no products that definitively do that (I also purchased a CULator, which claims to and should be arriving in a few days). Ideally I would replace the water, but I have a vinyl liner, and don't know how much can be safely drained. It is a 22,000 gallon kidney shaped pool. Can we take out half the water, or is there signfiicant risk of the liner floating up with that load?

    FYI: I believe the copper came from an old pool heater, that has since been bypassed, so hopefully there is no new copper coming into the water.

    Are there any other options on how to remove the copper?
    How much water can we remove?
    Anyone have any advice...I would greatly appreciate it.

    Thanks,
    12.5K gallons, AG - 15x30 oval, 2 hp 2 speed Pump, 22" Sand Filter, 25 sq ft Cartridge filter, AstralPool VX7S Salt Chlorinator, TF-100

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    Welcome to TFP.

    How do you normally chlorinate the pool?
    what is the source of your fill water?
    The only reliable way (known to us at this time) to reduce the copper (or metals in general) is to replace the water with metal free water.
    If the water table in the area isn't an issue, you can drain the pool down until there's about 1 foot of water left in the shallow end.
    If the metals are as high as indicated you may have to do a couple of drain/refills to get it down to acceptable levels.

    Since you've already ordered the CULator, you can try it if you'd like. There are a couple of threads here about those, but no definitive results other than it removes something.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    Thanks for the welcome, and the reply....

    I would chlorinate through a Hayward chlorinator, but was told by the people @ Leslie's pools not to bother with adding any chemicals until the copper issue is resolved. Is that incorrect? I have not added chems in some time due to this issue (I know the pH is extremely low).

    The source of the fill water would be brought in by a water company in a tanker. We unfortunately live in an area with well water, so I cannot replace on my own. It is surprisingly not that expensive, so I would be willing to do it, but am concerned about causing pool damage when draining the pool.
    How would I know if the water table is an issue? I have read about vinyl liners, or even pools floating up after emptying/draining the water, so I am concerned about that issue.
    12.5K gallons, AG - 15x30 oval, 2 hp 2 speed Pump, 22" Sand Filter, 25 sq ft Cartridge filter, AstralPool VX7S Salt Chlorinator, TF-100

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    Depending on where you're located you can check with the county agent and they can probably tell you if the water table is an issue. Since you're on a well the local drillers will probably know as well.

    I assume you top off the pool with well water. Does it have copper in it?
    Do you have a softener for the house?

    I strongly recommend that you get yourself a good test kit and use it to maintain your pool. Since you have to truck water in you don't want to have to drain and refill any more than you have to. If you'll read and apply the method here you'll never have to drain water because the CYA gets too high. You'll also learn how to maintain the proper balance of all the chems.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    Thanks Bama....again...admittedly a newbie to the pool world. What exactly should I ask the county about the water table?
    12.5K gallons, AG - 15x30 oval, 2 hp 2 speed Pump, 22" Sand Filter, 25 sq ft Cartridge filter, AstralPool VX7S Salt Chlorinator, TF-100

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    You just want to know how high it is. If it's below the level of the pool you don't have to worry about the pool floating. They'll probably give you the level in either feet below the ground or in elevation.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    Spoke with the health department. We have a septic system, so the water levels due to leach fields, etc, are relatively high. He said ground water is 50" below the ground, and even 19" below ground you get some mottling.
    The pool does sit above the neighboring ground, so I am not sure how reliable that is. It is sort of bricked off, and you have to go down 2 steps to get to actual ground level.
    Does that seem worrisome though, in terms of consideration of replacing water?
    Would a partial replacement, like 25% be safe, or is that so little that the utility is decreased?
    12.5K gallons, AG - 15x30 oval, 2 hp 2 speed Pump, 22" Sand Filter, 25 sq ft Cartridge filter, AstralPool VX7S Salt Chlorinator, TF-100

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    If your pool sits above the surrounding round level you're probably pretty safe draining it down to a foot left in the shallow end.

    When they installed the pool did the hole fill with water as they dug it? Do you have a well point near the pool?

    If the answer is no to both those questions, you're pretty safe in draining it a couple of feet.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Isaac-1's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    You mention that you have well water, do you know for sure that your well water is high in metals? Many wells do, but what matters is does yours have metals, I too have well water, but no issue with metals. This is something that can vary from location to location, I have a neighbor with a pool less than 1/4 mile away that has problems with sulfur and copper in their well water, yet when mine has been tested it shows only a faint trace of Iron.

    Like the others have said, you are generally safe draining down to about 1 ft of water over the shallow end with a vinyl liner pool, and there are things other than metals that can build up in pools and require water replacement, most commonly this is CYA (caused by over use of stabilized chlorine products like trichlor pucks, and dichlor shock powder) and CH, Therefore I strongly suggest reading the pool school ink in the upper right (most people get more out of it the second or third time through) and ordering one of our suggested test kits, I use the TF-100 (see my signature for the link).

    Ike
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
    I use and endorse TFtestKits TF-100 from http://tftestkits.net
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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    Actually I hope its not the well water! There was an older pool heater on the property, that may have been leaking copper. We have since bypassed the heater, and are working on the rest! I would love to replace the water and rid myself of this headache, but as a new pool owner, I am worried about doing major damage to the pool...
    12.5K gallons, AG - 15x30 oval, 2 hp 2 speed Pump, 22" Sand Filter, 25 sq ft Cartridge filter, AstralPool VX7S Salt Chlorinator, TF-100

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing water in inground pool with vinyl liner

    I would take a sample of your well water to the pool store and have them test it for metals.
    There should also be a assay on the well when it was drilled. That may have been so long ago that you won't have a copy of it.

    The previous owners could have also been using products with copper in them.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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