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Thread: BBB for Beginners

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    pdcreason's Avatar
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    BBB for Beginners

    This is an amazing forum and I'm so glad I found it! I just came back from a 3 day road trip on Tuesday and found myself with a green pool. I shocked it and added an algaecide, swept the entire pool and got rid of algea. I spent two full evenings cleaning the pool, plumbing, filter, and water.

    Today I tested my cloudy water, and entered the numbers in the pool calculator. Then I drove to the $ store and picked up the BBB items. I treated the water an hour ago IAW the calculator and will test the water again in the morning. (Oh, i did have to add 3 lbs of stabilizer, that I already had, inside a sock in the skimmer)

    My questions at the moment are: Does using the BBB method negate the use of a chlorine tablet floater in the pool? Will the water take longer to clear up using the BBB?

    Thanks, everyone!

    Preston
    6400 gl, 18'x4' AG, Krystal Clear model 635T cartridge filter pump 1500 gph w/timer, home-built pvc aerator/fountain, 2nd season open, K-2006 test kit

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by pdcreason
    My questions at the moment are: Does using the BBB method negate the use of a chlorine tablet floater in the pool? Will the water take longer to clear up using the BBB?Preston
    Maintaining proper chlorine levels negates the use of chlorine tablets. That means adding liquid chlorine or bleach as frequently as necessary to keep your FC from falling below the minimum based on your CYA levels per the Chlorine/CYA charts. http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...ya_chart_shock

    What test kit did you use to test and what were your numbers? Without a kit containing an FAS/DPD chlorine test, you won't know when to stop SLAMing (shocking) your pool..you need to keep going untill CC is 0.5 or lower; You pass an OCLT (ie overnight FC loss test shows a loss of 1.0 ppm or less); And the water is clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by pdcreason
    I shocked it and added an algaecide, swept the entire pool and got rid of algea. I spent two full evenings cleaning the pool, plumbing, filter, and water.
    Did you properly shock (AKA SLAM) it or did you just add product with the name shock? http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...king_your_pool

    *PS* It is preferred to hang the sock in front of the return jet, then don't have to worry about losing any stabilizer that's still in the filter when you backwash.
    12500 gallons, 24 foot round above ground
    Hayward Sand filter, Pentair OptiFlo 1HP 2-Speed pump

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Hey, wait a minute. You've been a member longer than I have. You should be answering my questions!

    Guess I can't say welcome to the forum....

    Congrats on your first post
    12500 gallons, 24 foot round above ground
    Hayward Sand filter, Pentair OptiFlo 1HP 2-Speed pump

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Does using the BBB method negate the use of a chlorine tablet floater in the pool?
    No, but that's a very common misconception. BBB means understanding the consequences and side effects of tabs and then managing your pool water properly to control the excessive CYA that tabs will often give you.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Thanks for the replies. I've been lurking here for a year, just reading and trying to learn.

    My pool is small....18ftX4ft round above ground, with the standard cartridge filter system. I'm currently using 6 way test strips, which I know aren't accurate, but it's what I have on hand. I ran this pool last summer with no problems except for temperature control in August.

    This year I had the green algea after 3 days of no maintenance. I shocked it with a bag of Shock and Swim on Tuesday morning and again on Wednesday morning, all the while brushing and cleaning. The water is clean and slowly clearing up. The bottom of the ladder is still a little blurry, but after killing the algea I initially couldn't see the past the first rung, it was so milky. The water temp when I discovered the pool condition was 92 F, and the pump was off. We had a thunder storm while I was away that may have tripped the pump circuit.

    My numbers as of 7:30 this morning are:
    TH 200
    FC 2 (was 3 last night)
    PH 8.4
    TA 120
    CA 100 (I removed the sack of stabilizer after test)
    Water temp is 86 F. My pool sits in full sunlight for about 11 hours a day.

    I added bleach to raise the FC to 8, I don't have any muriatic acid to add in at the moment, but my water level is low so I will test that again after topping off. Should I raise to shock level (25) again? As far as the floater goes, I guess I need to pull it out until my CYA drops?

    Thanks.....
    6400 gl, 18'x4' AG, Krystal Clear model 635T cartridge filter pump 1500 gph w/timer, home-built pvc aerator/fountain, 2nd season open, K-2006 test kit

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by pdcreason
    Thanks for the replies. I've been lurking here for a year, just reading and trying to learn.

    My pool is small....18ftX4ft round above ground, with the standard cartridge filter system. I'm currently using 6 way test strips, which I know aren't accurate, but it's what I have on hand. I ran this pool last summer with no problems except for temperature control in August.

    This year I had the green algea after 3 days of no maintenance. I shocked it with a bag of Shock and Swim on Tuesday morning and again on Wednesday morning, all the while brushing and cleaning. The water is clean and slowly clearing up. The bottom of the ladder is still a little blurry, but after killing the algea I initially couldn't see the past the first rung, it was so milky. The water temp when I discovered the pool condition was 92 F, and the pump was off. We had a thunder storm while I was away that may have tripped the pump circuit.

    My numbers as of 7:30 this morning are:
    TH 200
    FC 2 (was 3 last night)
    PH 8.4
    TA 120
    CA 100 (I removed the sack of stabilizer after test)
    Water temp is 86 F. My pool sits in full sunlight for about 11 hours a day.

    I added bleach to raise the FC to 8, I don't have any muriatic acid to add in at the moment, but my water level is low so I will test that again after topping off. Should I raise to shock level (25) again? As far as the floater goes, I guess I need to pull it out until my CYA drops?

    Thanks.....


    Re-read Pool School. We've got to get to the basics and start SLAMing the pool correctly.

    Disclaimer***: I don't like giving advice from test strip results because we know they aren't reliable. The following is assuming those numbers can be trusted.

    First, get pH down pronto. I know you know your pH is too high, but most pH testers stop 8.2, so if you're reading 8.4, who knows how high it is.

    Second, CYA doesn't drop on it's own. It only goes down when water leaves the pool through draining, backwashing, or splashout. If it really is that high, you're going to need to bite the bullet and drain half of the pool to get the CYA to manageable levels. Most tests stop at 100, so again, your CYA might be much higher, and a shock level of 25 might not work.

    Finally, in order to SLAM the pool correctly, you'll need more accuracy and precision, particularly on the FC tests, so you need the FAS-DPD test. If money is an issue, look at the TF-50, but otherwise the investment in a TF-100 or a Taylor K-2006 will pay itself back many times over in the long run.
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
    The most important article on this site - The ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Just remember, 3 treatments of shock and swim may have not completely killed ALL the algae. Keep an eye on how fast your chlorine is dropping. Even little bits of alage will consume your chlorine faster than you expect and then start multiplying when you get back to 0 FC. It might even be able to multiple with low levels of chlorine just because of your high CYA.

    Depending on your water source and price... a partial drain should be considered.
    12500 gallons, 24 foot round above ground
    Hayward Sand filter, Pentair OptiFlo 1HP 2-Speed pump

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    Mod Squad zea3's Avatar
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    No more stabilized chlorine for you! Liquid chlorine only from here on out. It will be more difficult to manage the pool with a CYA of 100, and odds are the CYA is actually much higher. You should drain and replace some of the water to lower the CYA. You can use the Pool calculator to determine how much water to replace to drop the CYA to 30ppm.

    If you decide not to drain the pool then the first thing you should do is lower the pH to 7.2. If you do drain, after refilling test the pH and adjust if needed.

    You still need to SLAM the pool. Read through the SLAM process for more information. You also need a high quality test kit such as a Taylor k2006 or the TF100 to complete the slam process. Either of these kits will allow you to test the chlorine at the high levels needed to complete the SLAM process.
    TFP Moderator
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Ok....the pool school says "If you have a SWG or very high levels of direct sunlight, CYA is typically kept between 70 and 80." I have very high levels of direct sunlight, so is 100 that bad? Or does it just mean I need to run higher levels of chlorine? I am going to add roughly 300 gallons of fresh water to the pool when I top it off, so that could possibly (maybe) get me closer to the 80 mark. The pool calculator says 60% needs to be drained and replaced. I can do that, but it taxes my water system, which is a well pump and it's not filtered at the outside faucets. And the reason I removed the stabilizer and floater is so the CYA wouldn't get any higher.

    Numbers at 9:15 AM today
    TH 200
    FC 5
    PH 7.5
    TA 120
    CYA 50 -100

    The color for CYA is not quite matching either 30/50 or 100 levels. I totally understand what you mean about reliability of the strips. And I used them all last summer and had no troubles. I'm thinking if I had planned my absence better and hadn't had the pump quit running I wouldn't have developed this problem and be all out of whack now.

    I'm going to town in a little while, so i will check and see if I can find the recommended test kits.
    6400 gl, 18'x4' AG, Krystal Clear model 635T cartridge filter pump 1500 gph w/timer, home-built pvc aerator/fountain, 2nd season open, K-2006 test kit

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by pdcreason
    i will check and see if I can find the recommended test kits.
    Most likely you won't be able to find them, k-2006 is your only shot (be sure you're getting FAS-DPD). TF100 is only at TFTestkits.net -- shipping is very fast and orders are always filled immediately.
    Aaron
    [ Vogue Vectra 24' AG | Hard plumb: Hayward Power-Flo Matrix 1HP 2-speed, 27" sand filter & Pentair MiniMax 100 NG | Taylor K-2006 | Central IL ]
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    The 70-80 ppm for the SWG and very high levels of sunlight is for places like Arizona. Lots of sun over long days in southern latitudes so the sun is more directly overhead -- plus it's hot to boot. For most pools in sunny weather, 50 ppm CYA is a better choice. The reason mostly has to do with what happens if there is a problem and you need to SLAM the pool. The amount of chlorine needed at a higher CYA level is proportionately higher. Also, in your case, your CYA may be higher than 100 ppm -- test strips are very unreliable, especially for the CYA test. Get yourself a proper test kit -- either the TFTestkits TF-100 or the Taylor K-2006.
    16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    I'm in Oklahoma, Mid to high 90's last week and the coming week, heat index over 100. And I do mean "full sun", all day long...

    Numbers at 9:15 AM today Numbers at 12 Noon
    TH 200 200
    FC 5 3
    PH 7.5 7.8
    TA 120 120
    CYA 50 -100 50-100

    Added 6% bleach to raise FC to recommended normal range of 4 to 8 ppm. The water is looking pretty good. I dropped the hose in to start topping off. Will test and adjust again afterwards.

    Didn't see any kits besides the strips. Guess I'll hit up the web.
    6400 gl, 18'x4' AG, Krystal Clear model 635T cartridge filter pump 1500 gph w/timer, home-built pvc aerator/fountain, 2nd season open, K-2006 test kit

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Alright....here are the current results of my water testing using the Taylor K-2006:

    As of 40 minutes ago
    6400 gallons, 88 F

    FC 4.8 CC 0.6
    PH 7.8
    TA 100
    CH 150
    CYA 50 - 60

    Remarkable difference in the test strip readings, and I did the CYA test twice just to be sure. So. now what? I've been using the BBB, except for the baking soda to avoid raising the PH because we've had a lot of rain lately. Had to continue with the test strips, but tested with 3 strips and went by the averages. I'm using 6% bleach and adding according to the Pool Calculator. Haven't had any problems except the water is cloudy.
    6400 gl, 18'x4' AG, Krystal Clear model 635T cartridge filter pump 1500 gph w/timer, home-built pvc aerator/fountain, 2nd season open, K-2006 test kit

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Well since the CC was more than 1 drop ... time to SLAM the pool properly. [slam:3fuu9aql][/slam:3fuu9aql]
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    So, I add enough bleach to shoot up to 24 ( 2 gal by the Pool Calc). I do that say at 6 am tomorrow and test FC when I get home at 4 PM and push it up again to 24 overnight, then test Thursday morning for CC level, and also see how much the FC dropped. Is this correct?
    6400 gl, 18'x4' AG, Krystal Clear model 635T cartridge filter pump 1500 gph w/timer, home-built pvc aerator/fountain, 2nd season open, K-2006 test kit

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    You need to maintain shock level as consistantly as possible. When the CC are gone (no more than 1 drop) and the water is clear, then you can check the OCLT.

    BTW, there is no need to use the 25ml sample for the FC and CC test ... just use the 10ml where each drop is 0.5ppm and save your reagents.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    You need to maintain shock level as consistantly as possible. When the CC are gone (no more than 1 drop) and the water is clear, then you can check the OCLT.

    BTW, there is no need to use the 25ml sample for the FC and CC test ... just use the 10ml where each drop is 0.5ppm and save your reagents.

    Gotchya.
    I will start this first thing in the morning then, and report back when I get it straightened out. And thanks for the tip on the FC/CC test....
    6400 gl, 18'x4' AG, Krystal Clear model 635T cartridge filter pump 1500 gph w/timer, home-built pvc aerator/fountain, 2nd season open, K-2006 test kit

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Why not start tonight when the FC is not being lost to the sun and can solely work on whatever is in your water?

    The pump should be on 24/7 during this process as well.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    Uuuummmm....good point, Jason. I was thinking too literally, as in the twice a day boost to shock level. And I only shut off the pump to clean/change the filter....it runs constantly.
    6400 gl, 18'x4' AG, Krystal Clear model 635T cartridge filter pump 1500 gph w/timer, home-built pvc aerator/fountain, 2nd season open, K-2006 test kit

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    Re: BBB for Beginners

    If you can test and dose more often than twice a day, that would be better (especially at the beginning of the process).
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
    The most important article on this site - The ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry

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