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Thread: Possible air in the plumbing???

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    Possible air in the plumbing???

    Since my pool was opened I keep getting a little air coming up from the spa jets, my handy valve is set to return about 80% pool and 20% spa (it has been set like that and cannot be manually adjust to pool only). The pool jets have good force and I do not see any air coming from there but the spa jets always let out a few bubbles. Also after the filter has been off for some hours it loses all of its prime and the basket is completely empty, then it takes about a minute to prime by itself.

    Side issue and maybe I should post this elsewhere but my filter doesn't go up in pressure at all, just stays at 10psi. If I backwash it goes to 8 and then after DE it goes up to 10 but never higher...I took apart the filter and cleaned and everything seems to be good inside but still no change.
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
    Nature2 thingy disabled
    Polaris 280
    Aqualink RS4

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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    When the pump is running, do you see air in the pump strainer basket?
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Just a few small bubbles
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Anyone?
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
    Nature2 thingy disabled
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Do you always get air out of the filter when you open the relief valve on top with the pump running? If so, the little air you see in the pump could be accumulating in the filter and then getting passed to the spa ... this would indicate a suction side air leak.

    Also the pump should not lose prime when it turns off ... so that too points to a leak in the system somewhere.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    If I turn the relief valve it gives a quick pop and flows water right away. If the pump is off for some time it loses prime and the basket goes empty. This happens over the whole day as I run the pump at night. It gets prime back in about a minute.
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
    Nature2 thingy disabled
    Polaris 280
    Aqualink RS4

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    So when the pump is off, the filter and pump drain and are filled with air. When the pump comes back on, all that air has to be purged. Since I doubt you are opening the relief valve every time the the pump turns on, I would think that air is then being pushed out to the pool.

    Do you still get air bubbles coming into the spa AFTER you have purged all the air out of the filter?

    If you purge all the air while the pump is running and air is not building up in the filter while the pump is on, then that lowers the likelihood of a suction leak. But, the fact that the pump drains mean that somewhere air is allowed into the system when the pump is turned off (could be the pressure side).
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    I try and purge all the air out when the pump turns on but yes both filter and basket are full of air between cycles. Once the pump is good and primed and running there are small bubbles constantly coming into the spa jets. I know I have a bad oring on the stand pip inside the filter cause it was torn when I took it apart, I'm ordering one now.
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
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    Polaris 280
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    The O-ring will have nothing to do with an air leak. Airleaks occur only on the suction side of your plumbing, between the pump and the skimmers. Tracking down that leak can be tortuous but necessary to solve your issue.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    I have two skimmers and two main drains, the two main drains can also serve as returns if the valves are correctly to do that. On the suction side I have my power jandy for the spa/pool suction and a manual for skimmers/main and one more to switch between the two skimmers, I also have my booster pump. How should I check for air leaks? I looked in the basket just now and there is definitely a little air coming in, not much but it's there.
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
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    Polaris 280
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    So I tried switching between mains and skimmers today...when I close the skimmers the rush of air coming in is very apparent so I'm fearing the worst. There are small bubbles coming in even when the mains are off. Next step is to hire a leak detection company?
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
    Nature2 thingy disabled
    Polaris 280
    Aqualink RS4

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    What type of valves do you have? With the main off see if running a hose over the valve will get the small bubbles to stop ... could just be that the valve is leaking. Or try a bunch of shaving cream to see if it gets sucked in.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    I'll try that tomorrow.
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
    Nature2 thingy disabled
    Polaris 280
    Aqualink RS4

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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Nothing really happened when I poured water over the valves
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Have you tried resealing the drain plugs on the pump?
    It doesn't surprise me that there is more air when you're drawing from just the main drains. It increases the suction head a little so it would make an air leak worse.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    I haven't, I'll do that when I get home from work.
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
    Nature2 thingy disabled
    Polaris 280
    Aqualink RS4

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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Quote Originally Posted by AdrenalinPlease
    Since my pool was opened I keep getting a little air coming up from the spa jets, my handy valve is set to return about 80% pool and 20% spa (it has been set like that and cannot be manually adjust to pool only). The pool jets have good force and I do not see any air coming from there but the spa jets always let out a few bubbles. Also after the filter has been off for some hours it loses all of its prime and the basket is completely empty, then it takes about a minute to prime by itself.

    Side issue and maybe I should post this elsewhere but my filter doesn't go up in pressure at all, just stays at 10psi. If I backwash it goes to 8 and then after DE it goes up to 10 but never higher...I took apart the filter and cleaned and everything seems to be good inside but still no change.
    Given the pump drains when off, it is likely you have an air leak but air from spa jets should be normal if you have venturi jets. Since only 20% of the flow is directed at the jets, the bubbles will be small. If you put the valves in spa model (100% spa), do you not see more bubbles?

    Also, what do you remember what your clean filter pressure was from last year?
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Megan the spa is 100% then the air bubbles are small.

    Last year I think starting pressure was about 10 and then would go up until backwash, this year starts at 8 and goes to 10 but never higher.
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
    Nature2 thingy disabled
    Polaris 280
    Aqualink RS4

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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Sorry, not Megan....I meant "when"
    I/G Concrete w/spa 29k Gallons (I think lol)
    DE
    Nature2 thingy disabled
    Polaris 280
    Aqualink RS4

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Possible air in the plumbing???

    Sorry, I misunderstood what you were saying but that is not what your original post said and I still think I am confused. Your post said the valve was set to 20%/80%. So I am not sure what problem you have. Spa jets are suppose to have air bubbles so any flow rate through the jets may create bubbles. Do you want more bubbles or less bubbles and when do want them?
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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