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Thread: Faded Liner

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    Faded Liner

    We installed a new inground vinyl liner pol in fall Sept 2010, did not open (that is add salt, turn on the SWG), until Spring 2011. In less than 2 yrs, the liner has faded to the point of needing replacement.

    It is a SWG pool, we watch chemistry fairly closely, but not religiously...no unusual chlorine ppm or other PH levels.

    We also installed a solar blanket, which we use always at night and cloudy days, sometimes several days at a time.

    We're still trying to figure out what went wrong?

    The fading was all below the water line..so not sun/UV related don't think.

    Does anyone have any science on the effect of high % use of solar blankets on SWG vinyl pool fading?

    Could this entirely the cause of the accelerated fading or completely unrelated to blanket usage?

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Faded Liner

    Welcome to tfp, agm247

    Quote Originally Posted by agm247
    Does anyone have any science on the effect of high % use of solar blankets on SWG vinyl pool fading?
    I am not aware of any correlation.

    Quote Originally Posted by agm247
    Could this entirely the cause of the accelerated fading or completely unrelated to blanket usage?
    I would think so, since if anything, the blanket should reduce the amount of uv light that gets to the liner.

    Please post a full set of test results...see: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...efore_you_post
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Faded Liner

    The other reason I suspect fading related to solar blanket is that I have a friend who installed a pool same time as myself (but different liner), also had same solar blanket, and his pool liner also faded over similar time period.

    So what are the chances 2 completely different pool chemistries/liners, faded over same period, with commonality of solar blanket usage?

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Faded Liner

    Quote Originally Posted by agm247
    So what are the chances 2 completely different pool chemistries/liners, faded over same period, with commonality of solar blanket usage?
    If yours were the only two pools in the world with solar covers and fading, then there might be a correlation..but yours is not a common experience on this board, my pool being one example.

    Where do you live? How much sun does the pool see?
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Faded Liner

    How are you testing chlorine and how often?

    What has been the highest chlorine you have tested? When?

    What is your CYA?
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Re: Faded Liner

    Toronto, Canada

    Testing every couple weeks (testing pool store), but using test strips weekly as sort of rough starting indicator.

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    Re: Faded Liner

    highest ppm 4-5 once, CYA always 80-100 ppm

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    Re: Faded Liner

    Does the liner have anyone sort of texture to it now? Possibly scaling and not fading?
    15x32 vinyl liner, 14,400 gal, 1.4hp Centurion pump, 3/4 hp booster pump, Hayward Pro Series S244T Sand Filter, Hayward H200 heater (digital readout)
    Aqua Rite Electronic Chlorine Generator, Hayward Phantom cleaner, TF 100 test kit
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    Re: Faded Liner

    No texture, complete fading...some areas, ink almost gone.

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    Re: Faded Liner

    If you and your friend got the liners at the same time from the same place, it's possible there was a manufacturing defect. Not sure what sort of warranty there might be to cover that sort of thing, but it wouldn't hurt to check.
    15x32 vinyl liner, 14,400 gal, 1.4hp Centurion pump, 3/4 hp booster pump, Hayward Pro Series S244T Sand Filter, Hayward H200 heater (digital readout)
    Aqua Rite Electronic Chlorine Generator, Hayward Phantom cleaner, TF 100 test kit
    Pool School, Pool Calculator

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    Re: Faded Liner

    Same liner supplier, but completely different liners.

    Yes, liner was replaced under warranty, but NO CONCLUSION as to why...I don't want to repeat the same fading!

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    Re: Faded Liner

    I've never heard of this happening in other stories on here. Typically, fading is caused by high concentrations of FC over time. If that is not what is happening, it could be that it was simply a manufacturers defect.
    15x32 vinyl liner, 14,400 gal, 1.4hp Centurion pump, 3/4 hp booster pump, Hayward Pro Series S244T Sand Filter, Hayward H200 heater (digital readout)
    Aqua Rite Electronic Chlorine Generator, Hayward Phantom cleaner, TF 100 test kit
    Pool School, Pool Calculator

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    Re: Faded Liner

    It's possible that the liner print is simply cheap and not chlorine resistant but, by far, the most common issue is excessive chlorine....doesn't seem to be your situation. I have no clue.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Faded Liner

    I'd pretty much bet on a dye issue. Either the dye itself or the process during the application. It could be the vinyl formulation but it's rare that they wouldn't find that before the liner was welded together.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
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    Re: Faded Liner

    Sound like a defective liner to me too, but I would suggest from now on to switch to a good quality drop based test kit, strips really are unreliable.
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
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    Re: Faded Liner

    One of the main reasons I am proposing the solar blanket is that BOTH the vinyl liner distributor and an actual liner manufacturer (CGT here in Canada) both specifically asked if I used the solar blanket at night and day time...they both said that having solar blanket on continuously could fade liner?

    Now why would they say that? I thought I read somewhere about off gassing of chlorine in SCG pools, and other detrimental effects of not letting pools "breathe"?

    Is there any scientific basis to this or just folklore?

    With regard to comment above " Typically, fading is caused by high concentrations of FC over time", byt FC, this is the ppm that is measured by drop kits/test strips...if this is true, wouldn't I have seen very high and constant chlorine PPM levels?

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Re: Faded Liner

    Theoretically speaking, if a pool was constantly covered and the SWG was doing it's normal thing..pumping out FC every day, then lack of sun penetrating through a solar blanket covered pool (or extended cloudy days) result in ever increasing FC ppm?

    Isn't this a practical reaslistic scenario, or the light passing through a solar blanket is plenty to break down FC?

  18. Back To Top    #18
    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Faded Liner

    What FC level were you maintaining and what was your cya level?
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Re: Faded Liner

    FC level in the 3 +/- 1 range, CYA around 80. Can these levels produce fading?

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Faded Liner

    It seems like you are not going to be happy until we say, "Yes"

    Fact of the matter is, there is nothing you have described that would point to fading the liner. At a CYA of 80ppm, you would need FC on the order of 30-40ppm before we would say you were at risk for fading the liner.

    Sure, with the cover on and running a SWG, the FC could climb, but if you were testing it, you should have noticed that and lower the SWG output. You have not indicated that the level ever got that high (although test strips are generally not to be trusted). The cover could result in a build up of some higher CC levels due to less sun, but again ... unless ridiculously high, they would not fade the liner.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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