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Thread: Pump losing, suction power.

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    Pump losing, suction power.

    Hello everyone.

    My name is Phil, and earlier this year I bought my first house complete with my first pool. I tried to get all the right information into my signature as per the rules, but even those simple questions are tough to answer.
    I have ordered a proper test kit, but it wont be here for a few days, and although the pool isn't crystal clear (some green algae settles to the bottom, but seems to come right out with vacuuming, although my robotic cleaner seems to just spread it back into the water) managing the Chemicals is not the current issue.

    The current issue I'm having is, trying to keep the pump running. Process I've been using;

    1 Fill pump strainer housing with water
    First issue is all the water I put into the pump seem to drain right back into the pool it fills up enough to cover the suction pipe that leads to the filter, but not all the way.
    2 Put lid back on strainer
    3 Open air relief valve on the filter
    4 Manually turn on filter
    5 After water is coming out of the relief valve close it.

    At this point the pump will start out strong, but over a period of time, sometimes 10 minutes sometimes an hour, the pump will come to a crawl, there will be very little water coming into the strainer housing, and that of course leads to very little going back into the pool. The pressure in the filter remains constant between 18 and 20. There is a skimmer basket and a another opening that goes to the filter right above one another and the return line is on the other side.

    Also note, there are no ball valves, or stopcocks on any of the plumbing by the filter with the exception of a ball valve to drain the filter.


    I have taken apart the filter, and cleaned the fingers, and changed out the DE. with no changes. I have been fighting with this pump trying to get it going for a handful of days.

    Any suggestions greatly appreciated.


    Picture of pool included, and can also take a picture of the filter/pump set up if it would be helpful.


    Thanks again.
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    A picture of the equipment would help.

    You are getting air in the pump basket?
    Check, clean and lube the pump basket o-ring.
    Check the skimmer to see if it's creating a vortex sucking in air.
    Check the weir to see if it's working freely and correctly.
    Check the pump drain plugs and reseal them.

    Does the gauge go to zero when the pump is off?
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bama Rambler
    A picture of the equipment would help.
    Will snag one and get it on here
    You are getting air in the pump basket?
    i can't seem to get air out of the pump basket, even when i fill it using a 5 gallon bucket, it wont stay full to the top no matter how quickly I can close it and hit the start button
    Check, clean and lube the pump basket o-ring.
    The o ring is in great shape, no cracks, and well lubed
    Check the skimmer to see if it's creating a vortex sucking in air.
    When I first turn on the pump and its working well it does, as the water going into the pump lessens so does the suction
    Check the weir to see if it's working freely and correctly.
    No idea what a weir is I will google lol
    Check the pump drain plugs and reseal them.
    Just replaced the plugs on opening day, will readjust them although not showing any signs of a leak

    Does the gauge go to zero when the pump is off?
    yes it goes to zero when the pump is off.

    Thanks.
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    After googling Pool weir, I now know what it is, and can safely say I don't have one!
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tskstorm
    i can't seem to get air out of the pump basket, even when i fill it using a 5 gallon bucket, it wont stay full to the top no matter how quickly I can close it and hit the start button
    That's normal, but once you get the pump primed and runnig correctly it will empty the basket of air and it will be full of water.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tskstorm
    When I first turn on the pump and its working well it does, as the water going into the pump lessens so does the suction
    If it's creating a vortex then there's at least part of your problem. It should not suck in air when the pump is running.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tskstorm
    No idea what a weir is I will google lol
    The weir is the flapper door in the mouth of the skimmer. It, along with the skimmer basket, helps keep the skimmer from forming a vortex and sucking in air.

    How high is the water level in the pool? I'd raise it almost to the top if the skimmer opening and see if that helped.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bama Rambler
    Quote Originally Posted by Tskstorm
    i can't seem to get air out of the pump basket, even when i fill it using a 5 gallon bucket, it wont stay full to the top no matter how quickly I can close it and hit the start button
    That's normal, but once you get the pump primed and runnig correctly it will empty the basket of air and it will be full of water.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tskstorm
    When I first turn on the pump and its working well it does, as the water going into the pump lessens so does the suction
    If it's creating a vortex then there's at least part of your problem. It should not suck in air when the pump is running.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tskstorm
    No idea what a weir is I will google lol
    The weir is the flapper door in the mouth of the skimmer. It, along with the skimmer basket, helps keep the skimmer from forming a vortex and sucking in air.

    How high is the water level in the pool? I'd raise it almost to the top if the skimmer opening and see if that helped.
    I found a universal skimmer weir in the garage, and pushed it into the skimmer, seems to always stay in the open position right now (where the water is basically flowing over the weir and straight into the pump.

    The water level was at the top of the skimmer, but on a neighbor's advise I had about 3 inches removed, he said it was too high, currently its about half way up the skimmer box. Will fill it up now. Pictures of the pump/filter will be up in a moment.
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.









    The water on the pump cover is from water shooting out the air relief valve when I turned it on before taking pictures.

    Also my skimmer does not have a cover. Could that have anything to do with it ?

    Piecing together someone else's mess with little knowledge, stinks!
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    When the pump is on, the weir will stay open ... this allows the water to be pulled from the surface and prevents the dirt from flowing back out.
    The skimmer cover has no effect on the water movement.

    Do you see a large vortex in the skimmer still?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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  9. Back To Top    #9

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    This is what I'm seeing http://s42.photobucket.com/user/tsks..._0703.mp4.html

    Pictures and Video's do make things easier though, trying to explain everything would stink as well!
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    TTT anyone else have any idea's?
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    I could not get the video to work for me ...

    {And please do not "bump/TTT" posts}
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    I'm unsure why the video isn't working ... works for me when i click the link is there a better way to post it?
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    Could be my firewall ... although pics usually work on that site. You could upload to YouTube and even embed it into the post.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

  14. Back To Top    #14

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    http://youtu.be/YTpnOhlGjMY



    here is a link to the youtube I can not figure out how to embed it properly.
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    That's exactly what it's supposed to look like. Was it sucking in air before you added the weir?

    If it was, I think you've fixed at least part of the problem and maybe all of it.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    The pump strainer housing definitely looks a little better after installing the weir however still after 15 minutes or so it's losing its power. And getting little to no suction or return.
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    When you say little suction/return are you seeing a buildup of air in the pump?

    When is the last time you cleaned the filter? What is your clean filter pressure?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    You have more air leaks to find. It will be on the suction side of the pump somewhere. Check the skimmer again to see if it creates a vortex after a few minutes.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    When you say little suction/return are you seeing a buildup of air in the pump?

    When is the last time you cleaned the filter? What is your clean filter pressure?

    The entire filter was rebuilt and installed on Memorial day, since then I have cleaned it nearly everyday and am cleaning out a significant amount of algae.

    I'm not sure what the clean filter pressure is, from what I can remember it went straight to 17/18 after I cleaned it last.

    Yes a buildup is occurring. When starting the pump, I am able to get the air out with the relief valve, and get a good flow going. After a few minutes the air gets back in there.
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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    Re: Pump losing, suction power.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bama Rambler
    You have more air leaks to find. It will be on the suction side of the pump somewhere. Check the skimmer again to see if it creates a vortex after a few minutes.

    I don't see a vortex any longer. Any other suggestions where to look for leaks? How would one check for leaks in the underground plumbing thats the only place I can think of I haven't checked.
    About 20000 gallons IG Vinyl pool, Pool is oddly shaped, with slopes on the bottom.
    Hayward perflex ec 65a Hayward super pump 1600

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