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Thread: New to the board, and have some questions.

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    New to the board, and have some questions.

    Hello,
    I'm new to the board, have basically just been reading and learning, but now I have a couple of questions to see if I'm on the right path.

    1) I've used an online calculator to try and figure the volume of the pool (see signature). It's 18x36', 3.5' shallow end, 8' deep end. Do I have the amount about right? 27k gal
    2) I found something one time to calculate how much each bottle of bleach added for your ppm chlorine. I currently use Walmart brand bleach, 121 fl oz at 8.25% (I think it use to be 6%, but now it says "33% more concentrated). What's the formula for calculating how much chlorine you're adding?
    3) My main steps get a constant build up of debrie(sp?), I don't have a return at the steps so it just seems like a great place for things to collect. Is there a way to help prevent this? Seems like the only way is to brush the steps daily. My pool growing up had 1-2 returns at the steps and it seemed like that kept them clean.
    4) I just purchased "The Pool Cleaner" w/ a dedicated return for it (4-wheel side pressure). Does it hurt to leave it in all the time? During shocking, etc? I've read you should take it out, but then I've also read it probably isn't hurting it since the chlorine levels aren't staying up for very long. On a side note, so far I'm loving this thing. Previously I had the Polaris 280 (I think) and it just wasn't very reliable. So I'm hoping this one is an upgrade. I've read great things about it.
    5) I feel like leaves and other things occassionally clog up my drain in the deep end. Can I unscrew it, take it off to clear out, and put it back down? I have a vinyl liner and I'm just worried it might mess up the liner if I do.
    6) My pool is 6 years old. On the sides of the shallow end, it seems like the vinyl is fading significantly. Is this normal? Or could something be causing it?
    7) My steps in the deep end are stuck. I've removed the bolts, sprayed WD-40 around the housing, gently tapped with a mallet, and I still can't get them up. Any suggestions? I thought about calling the people that installed the pool to see if they could get them out, but I'd have to pay to do that and would rather not.
    8) I read about algae buildup, and if you're having a problem you may need to take out the light, make sure it's clean, etc. Do you just unscrew it and pull it out to brush off / wipe off?
    9) My diving board occassionaly will get black stains on top, probably from rain, leaves, etc that might get on there. I'll usually just poor some bleach on it and let the sun clean it. Is that hurting it? I've only had to do it 2 times so far.

    Thanks in advance everyone! Really have enjoyed and learned a lot about pool care.

    MOD EDIT: split from: http://www.troublefreepool.com/bbb-f...ers-t5208.html to give the post more attention. moderator linen
    Thanks,

    Ryan

    36x18' rectangle in-ground pool, Vinyl, approx 28k gal; Sta-Rite (S7D75) 37 Sq. ft DE filter -currently trying ZeoFiber DE replacement powder; Sta-Rite Dyna-Glas 1.5 HP (uprated) pump; electric timer, 3 hr on / off cycle; BBB method; The Pool Cleaner (4-wheel side-pressure).

  2. Back To Top    #2
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    1 & 2: The Pool Calculator (link in my sig)
    3. Without returns brushing everyday kinda your only option.
    4. If you follow BBB you should hardly ever, ever, have to shock so leaving it in shouldn't be a problem. I have friends who leave their Polaris in all the time and they do replace some of the parts every so often - belts get stretched, etc.
    5. If debris is getting passed the cover you may want a new cover with smaller openings - I can't really answer the rest of the question...
    6. Liner fading is usually due to water being out of balance (high FC)
    7. ? not sure
    8. Yes
    9. Hurting it? not sure but diluted bleach solution should work as well with less risk...
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  3. Back To Top    #3
    linen's Avatar
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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    Welcome to tfp, RyanBC01

    FPM beat me, but here are my thoughts:

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    1) I've used an online calculator to try and figure the volume of the pool (see signature). It's 18x36', 3.5' shallow end, 8' deep end. Do I have the amount about right? 27k gal
    I get about 24000 gallons. I used poolcalculator.com to calculate this. Poolcalculator.com is the one we use on this forum and it has a ton of good stuff in it.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    2) I found something one time to calculate how much each bottle of bleach added for your ppm chlorine. I currently use Walmart brand bleach, 121 fl oz at 8.25% (I think it use to be 6%, but now it says "33% more concentrated). What's the formula for calculating how much chlorine you're adding?
    Use poolcalculator.com

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    3) My main steps get a constant build up of debrie(sp?), I don't have a return at the steps so it just seems like a great place for things to collect. Is there a way to help prevent this? Seems like the only way is to brush the steps daily. My pool growing up had 1-2 returns at the steps and it seemed like that kept them clean.
    You may need to just brush the crude into the pools current. If you do not have a circular flow pattern right now, adjusting your returns may help you get that.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    4) I just purchased "The Pool Cleaner" w/ a dedicated return for it (4-wheel side pressure). Does it hurt to leave it in all the time? During shocking, etc? I've read you should take it out, but then I've also read it probably isn't hurting it since the chlorine levels aren't staying up for very long.
    What does your water look like? If you need to do the shocking process, I would take it out. Here is a link to the process: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...king_your_pool

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    5) I feel like leaves and other things occassionally clog up my drain in the deep end. Can I unscrew it, take it off to clear out, and put it back down? I have a vinyl liner and I'm just worried it might mess up the liner if I do.
    I think you can remove the drain cover to clean it.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    6) My pool is 6 years old. On the sides of the shallow end, it seems like the vinyl is fading significantly. Is this normal? Or could something be causing it?
    Is the fading above or below the water line? If above, that is going to happen since the sun is hard on vinyl. If it is below the water line that could be a sign of pool pool chemical maintenance.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    7) My steps in the deep end are stuck. I've removed the bolts, sprayed WD-40 around the housing, gently tapped with a mallet, and I still can't get them up. Any suggestions? I thought about calling the people that installed the pool to see if they could get them out, but I'd have to pay to do that and would rather not.
    I don't understand. Is your pool and inground pool? If it is, most igp steps are part of the hopper and removing them will drain the pool.
    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    8) I read about algae buildup, and if you're having a problem you may need to take out the light, make sure it's clean, etc. Do you just unscrew it and pull it out to brush off / wipe off?
    Yes, light niches are coming algae hideouts. It depends on the niche, but some to in fact have a screw you remove then you can pull the light and place it on the pool deck. That allows chlorinated water into the niche.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    9) My diving board occassionaly will get black stains on top, probably from rain, leaves, etc that might get on there. I'll usually just poor some bleach on it and let the sun clean it. Is that hurting it? I've only had to do it 2 times so far.
    I would guess not, but I am not sure.

    It sounds like you are having an algae problem? If so, then please read this poolschool article: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...efore_you_post. We need reliable test values to help.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

  4. Back To Top    #4
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    lol I got 31000 gallons. That whole average depth business throws me every time. I was told by the builder of two of my pools that are 20x36 that they are 35000 gallons... I dunno.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by frustratedpoolmom
    lol I got 31000 gallons. That whole average depth business throws me every time.
    I took the easy route and use the average of 5.75 ft for depth...that is usually pretty close. BUT...I put in 32 feet instead of 36 So now I am getting about 27000...oops I also assumed rectangular...is it?
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    BoDarville's Avatar
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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    Welcome to TFP

    Well, I guess I'm the slow typist of the group as FPM and linen beat me to it. I'll post since I have it all typed up.

    My first suggestion is to post a full set of test results. This will allow us to help you more effectively.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    1) I've used an online calculator to try and figure the volume of the pool (see signature). It's 18x36', 3.5' shallow end, 8' deep end. Do I have the amount about right? 27k gal
    I get 27,900 gallons using the Pool Calculator with the setting on "rectangular".

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    2) I found something one time to calculate how much each bottle of bleach added for your ppm chlorine. I currently use Walmart brand bleach, 121 fl oz at 8.25% (I think it use to be 6%, but now it says "33% more concentrated). What's the formula for calculating how much chlorine you're adding?
    Enter 8.25 in the "% bleach" field which is in the top row of the yellow-banded FC section of the Pool Calculator. It will tell you how much bleach to add to go from your current FC level to your target FC level.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    3) My main steps get a constant build up of debrie(sp?), I don't have a return at the steps so it just seems like a great place for things to collect. Is there a way to help prevent this? Seems like the only way is to brush the steps daily. My pool growing up had 1-2 returns at the steps and it seemed like that kept them clean.
    I sometimes get some silt that builds up there after a good rainstorm. Short of installing returns there, brushing with the filter running is the answer.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    4) I just purchased "The Pool Cleaner" w/ a dedicated return for it (4-wheel side pressure). Does it hurt to leave it in all the time? During shocking, etc? I've read you should take it out, but then I've also read it probably isn't hurting it since the chlorine levels aren't staying up for very long. On a side note, so far I'm loving this thing. Previously I had the Polaris 280 (I think) and it just wasn't very reliable. So I'm hoping this one is an upgrade. I've read great things about it.
    I have gotten in the habit of taking it out when not in use. Based on my experience, the issue is not so much the day-to-day FC level (but would take it out if shocking), but rather cold water temperatures can make the internal mechanical parts brittle. The first year I had my pool, I left the cleaner in virtually all the time. That first spring I had to take it in for repairs and was told that leaving it in the cold water was the culprit. Since then, it is in the pool only when in use and I have had no further repairs. I would store it inside a garage or shed when it is not in the pool.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    6) My pool is 6 years old. On the sides of the shallow end, it seems like the vinyl is fading significantly. Is this normal? Or could something be causing it?
    Most likely either abnormally and persistently higher than needed FC and/or the use of cal-hypo chlorine granules. If you are not the original owner of the pool, its hard to know how the pool was managed previously.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    8) I read about algae buildup, and if you're having a problem you may need to take out the light, make sure it's clean, etc. Do you just unscrew it and pull it out to brush off / wipe off?
    Yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    9) My diving board occassionaly will get black stains on top, probably from rain, leaves, etc that might get on there. I'll usually just poor some bleach on it and let the sun clean it. Is that hurting it? I've only had to do it 2 times so far.
    I would first try diluted bleach, as opposed to full-strength, and see if that gets the job done.

    On item 5, I'm not sure about unscrewing the drain and the possible impact to the liner from doing so. However, I can tell you that you want to do all you can to keep debris (especially organic matter which includes leaves and the like) out of the pool. Doing so will reduce the chlorine demand.

    On item 7, I'm not sure what else you can do. Maybe someone else can chime in on that one.
    Gold Supporter, TFP Lifetime Supporter, 26,680 gal Plaster IGP 3.5 - 10' depth / Attached Waterfall Spa, Manually Chlorinated, Triton Sand Filter, 1.5 HP * 1.1 SF = 1.65 SFHP 1-speed Pentair WhisperFlo WF-26 Pump, 400K BTU NG Teledyne Laars Series One Heater, Polaris 360, Test Kit Comparison, Chlorine/CYA Chart, SLAMing Your Pool, OCLT
    A good test kit is an investment, not an expense.

  7. Back To Top    #7

    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    So for volume I'm going to assume approx 28k. It's a rectangular In-ground pool for whoever asked.
    The steps are your typical steps for the deep end. The rails essentially slide into metal or plastic "housings" that are in the concrete, and there is a bolt at each one that when you undo, allows you to lift the steps out and get them out of the pool. From what I've read online, sometimes they will rust or calcification and get stuck, but a little WD-40 and rubber mallet is what most recommended. Well I've tried that and they won't budge. I was thinking of trying CLR incase it's rusted to see if that helped loosen them up. I really don't want to pay someone $50 to come over and see if they can get them. Any thoughts?
    I just changed the direction of the returns to see if that helped. So I'll check tomorrow to see how it's working. I saw where someone mentioned placing ping pong balls in to see the current. What would I be looking for if I did?
    My water is fine right now. I've been gone for 10 days away on vacation and had some algae build up around the top of the slopes. But I added a bottle of bleach and brushed and it seems fine now.
    When I tested the pool this morning FC 5, PH 7.4, TA 100, CYA approx 30. I'm using Taylor K-2006 kit.
    By the way, where can I get replacements for it?
    I was just asking about shocking the pool and the cleaner in case I needed to do it.
    What's the best thing to do to your pool if you plan on being out of town for 3-10 days?

    Appreciate all the help.
    Thanks,

    Ryan

    36x18' rectangle in-ground pool, Vinyl, approx 28k gal; Sta-Rite (S7D75) 37 Sq. ft DE filter -currently trying ZeoFiber DE replacement powder; Sta-Rite Dyna-Glas 1.5 HP (uprated) pump; electric timer, 3 hr on / off cycle; BBB method; The Pool Cleaner (4-wheel side-pressure).

  8. Back To Top    #8
    linen's Avatar
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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    I wasn't aware that you can remove igp steps while a pool is filled. I will have to defer to others with more experience than I on this.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    I saw where someone mentioned placing ping pong balls in to see the current. What would I be looking for if I did?
    A circular flow pattern that is getting around to much of the pool surface.

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    I've been gone for 10 days away on vacation and had some algae build up around the top of the slopes. But I added a bottle of bleach and brushed and it seems fine now.
    If you had visible algae, then we would suggest doing the shocking process. Since it sounds like you believe you pool is clear of algae, I would suggest raising you pool to your shocking level ( 13 ppm FC for 30 ppm cya per poolcalculator.com) and do a OCLT: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...rnight_fc_test Also, what is your CC level?

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    When I tested the pool this morning FC 5, PH 7.4, TA 100, CYA approx 30. I'm using Taylor K-2006 kit.
    Those results look pretty good, again post your CC level (and CH if you have it).

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    By the way, where can I get replacements for it?
    tftestkits.net

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanBC01
    What's the best thing to do to your pool if you plan on being out of town for 3-10 days?
    For 3 day, you can probably just raise the pool to your shocking level. For longer, it is best if you can have someone add bleach/liquid chlorine a few times while you gone.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

  9. Back To Top    #9

    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    Retested last night.
    FC 4.0
    CC 0.0
    CH 100
    PH 7.6-7.8
    TA Not tested since it was fine last time
    CYA 30

    I'm assuming since the FC didn't drop much in 24 hours, and there's no CC, then the pool should be good right now. It's pretty clear and I don't see any build up of any algae or anything. I've got the pool cleaner in it right now picking up most everything that might be in it.

    I'm going to throw a couple of ping pong balls in there tonight to see what the circulation looks like.

    Last question I have...

    I noticed on one of the pool schools posts, it stated that 1 gallon of 6% bleach will raise chlorine 6 ppm per 10,000 gallons.

    So if my math is right, 1 gallon (96 oz) of 6% bleach should raise my chlorine to 2.14 ppm (6 / (28k / 10k) - assuming 28,000 gal pool, correct?

    Well the complicated part is the fact that the bleach I buy, is 8.25% and it's 121 oz. I hate that they can't just sell all of it as 96 oz and just change the concentration.

    It seems to make sense that if an 8.25% gallon of bleach would increase chlorine 2.95 ppm for a 28k g pool based on the assumption in pool school. So if you're using 1.26 g of bleach (121 oz / 96 oz) x 2.95 which is 3.71 ppm chlorine per bottle.

    Does that sound about right for you math / chem people? Or am I off on that?

    I know I can reference the pool calculator, but then that requires plugging numbers in, figuring out # of oz to add to the pool, etc. I'd rather just know how much each bottle of bleach bumps up my chlorine levels, and go from there. That way typically I will add about 1/2 - 1 bottle of bleach to maintain chlorine levels, and add about 3 1/2 - 4 bottles to shock the pool if needed.
    Thanks,

    Ryan

    36x18' rectangle in-ground pool, Vinyl, approx 28k gal; Sta-Rite (S7D75) 37 Sq. ft DE filter -currently trying ZeoFiber DE replacement powder; Sta-Rite Dyna-Glas 1.5 HP (uprated) pump; electric timer, 3 hr on / off cycle; BBB method; The Pool Cleaner (4-wheel side-pressure).

  10. Back To Top    #10

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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    The pool calculator is calculating 2.3 ppm rise in for a pool size of 28,000 gallons and using a 96 oz bottle of 8.25% bleach. The easiest way to see the exact amount is to measure the FC before you add the bleach and then an hour after adding the bleach measure the FC again.

    At first I used the pool calculator to get my needed chemical numbers and used then used a measuring cup to put the right amount of chemicals in. After a little while, I learned about how much of each chemical to pour straight in to the pool to get the numbers I wanted without being so precise.

    I also have the pool cleaner, and I just replaced my tires last week. It is 2.5 years old and spends most of the time in the water. The tires were worn down to the suggested replacement marks, but they were also starting to deteriorate. I will be removing the cleaner more often from now on.
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
    Hayward Aqua Rite T-15 SWCG, Jandy LXi 400k BTU NG heater, 350 sq.ft. of Sun Star solar panels, TF-100 Test Kit, Dolphin s300i Cleaner
    Test Kits . Pool Math . Chlorine/CYA Chart . The SLAM Process

  11. Back To Top    #11

    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by ping
    The pool calculator is calculating 2.3 ppm rise in for a pool size of 28,000 gallons and using a 96 oz bottle of 8.25% bleach. The easiest way to see the exact amount is to measure the FC before you add the bleach and then an hour after adding the bleach measure the FC again.
    Where did the information come from regarding "One gallon will raise 10,000 gallons of water approximately the percentage of the bleach in FC (i.e, one gallon of 6% ultra bleach will raise 10,000 gallons approx. 6 ppm FC)" ?

    Because my calculation is based on that statement, and if it's not right, then of course my calcuation regarding the 8.25% bleach is going to be wrong as well.

    I'll try adding 1 bottle of bleach and testing the FC before and after. You say I only need to let the water circulate for 1 hour before I test again. I imagine if I wait 1-2 hours at night I should get a fairly accurate measurement as long as there isn't significant organism (algae or whatever) in the pool.

    Appreciate at the help!
    Thanks,

    Ryan

    36x18' rectangle in-ground pool, Vinyl, approx 28k gal; Sta-Rite (S7D75) 37 Sq. ft DE filter -currently trying ZeoFiber DE replacement powder; Sta-Rite Dyna-Glas 1.5 HP (uprated) pump; electric timer, 3 hr on / off cycle; BBB method; The Pool Cleaner (4-wheel side-pressure).

  12. Back To Top    #12

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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    One gallon is 128 oz, not 96 oz.
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
    Hayward Aqua Rite T-15 SWCG, Jandy LXi 400k BTU NG heater, 350 sq.ft. of Sun Star solar panels, TF-100 Test Kit, Dolphin s300i Cleaner
    Test Kits . Pool Math . Chlorine/CYA Chart . The SLAM Process

  13. Back To Top    #13

    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by ping
    One gallon is 128 oz, not 96 oz.
    Ha, well that's an important piece of information... I don't know where I got 96 oz from!

    Thanks again! I'll have to redo my math.
    Thanks,

    Ryan

    36x18' rectangle in-ground pool, Vinyl, approx 28k gal; Sta-Rite (S7D75) 37 Sq. ft DE filter -currently trying ZeoFiber DE replacement powder; Sta-Rite Dyna-Glas 1.5 HP (uprated) pump; electric timer, 3 hr on / off cycle; BBB method; The Pool Cleaner (4-wheel side-pressure).

  14. Back To Top    #14

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    Re: New to the board, and have some questions.

    I have the same steps in the deep end you've mentioned. Ensure the bolts that are used on the stair clamps (imbedded in the concrete) are loosened all the way up. The clamping portion may be stuck so try to pry it back with a screwdriver so it's not locked onto the stairs. CLR may work but I'd try some penetrating oil and let it soak for awhile. Then try to pull straight up and wiggle it around a little bit.

    I take mine out every fall and they stick a bit but always come out with some muscle!
    16 x 32 inground vinyl pool (21000 gallons) (new liner installed 2014)
    Hayward max flo pump w/ 1 HP AO Smith motor (new motor 2014)
    Hayward C1200 cartridge filter (new 2014)
    Hayward H150 heater

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