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Thread: New test kit, horrifying resutls

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    New test kit, horrifying resutls

    My new test kit came and some of the results I got were a bit disturbing.

    Ph 6.8
    TA 110-120
    CL a bit low, but I can fix that
    CH couldn't get a handle on this one. Either it's way too high, or I'm doing it wrong.
    CYA 180 is my estimate. I could only get about a quater inch of water in the tube before I couldn't see the black dot anymore. 150 is as high as the indicators on the tube read.

    Am currently waiting on an order of chemicals. We don't have a pool store here, so I'm getting by with what I have. I've been using some bleach to offset the amount of tri-chlor pucks I use, but the CYA is so high that I fear I may have to drain most of the pool to get it back under control.

    Also am using Borax when I can get it to raise the PH. Some weeks I get some, some weeks I don't. Have been out of PH up/soda ash for some time now. I've also rigged a garden hose with a sprayer so I can aerate the water as I fill it. I'm hoping this raises the PH as well.

    The algae is getting bad. The black algae is the worst. I have to go in on scuba and scrub it with a wire brush, then come back and rub chlorine directly on what's left. I think the CYA is so high that the chlorine is nearly ineffective and the algae is taking over. Currently have nothing to treat it with.

    The filter grid also has a hole in it and we've run out of replacements. They've been going at regular intervals now. I fear that the water chemistry is so harsh that it's burning them up. Either that or after five years sitting around they're a bit weak. New ones are coming on the order, whenever that gets here. Been waiting since October.

    Any advice would be quite welcome. Thanks for taking the time to read this.
    46,000 gallon in ground concrete/crystal crete, filter is Pentair Pack Fab 60 DE, freshwater.
    2hp pump. Flow Rate ? 4 return jets, two of which are closed due to a leak in the plumbing
    Water is replaced/replentished using RO water

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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    Dilute by 50% (1:1) with tap water on the CYA test and run it again. It that doesn't get you to a real number dilute further (1:2 or 1:3) don't forget to multiply by the dilution rate to get your real CYA number.

    Until you have a good CYA number ... not much we can help with.

    once you have a good CYA number you can use the calculator to see how much of the water has to be drained to get it under control.

    on the CH - if the CYA is that high odds are the CH is through the roof as well, fortunately its the same solution - drain and fill.
    TFP Moderator Chris V. ~16K Pool & Spa, 48NSF DE, IG Plaster Circa 2000, Intermatic PE653, Challenger pump with a 2 speed B2984, 20gal stenner chlorine injection, Houston, TX
    One cannot follow Islam and Christianity at the same time, nor can one follow pool store methods and TFP at the same time.
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    What kit did you get?

    Does it have separate FC and CC tests that are not limited to 5ppm?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    What kit did you get?

    Does it have separate FC and CC tests that are not limited to 5ppm?
    Excellent question - I assumed the TF100 (bad assumption)
    TFP Moderator Chris V. ~16K Pool & Spa, 48NSF DE, IG Plaster Circa 2000, Intermatic PE653, Challenger pump with a 2 speed B2984, 20gal stenner chlorine injection, Houston, TX
    One cannot follow Islam and Christianity at the same time, nor can one follow pool store methods and TFP at the same time.
    Pool School -- Pool Math -- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    Plan on draining and re-filling once you get a good CYA number. Have you thought of switching to a Salt Water Pool? It would seem to be a better choice given that you have to ship chemicals in and that can be unreliable.
    20,000 IG WetEdge Satin Matrix Northshore Plum, Filled 8/24/12

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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    I am using a TF-100 kit. I've diluted the water by 1/2 and was still well off the chart, so went back and diluted into thirds. Still off the chart, but I can estimate maybe around 400ppm on the CYA. I am going to try to talk the boss into draining the pool during hurricane season when we are closed this fall.
    46,000 gallon in ground concrete/crystal crete, filter is Pentair Pack Fab 60 DE, freshwater.
    2hp pump. Flow Rate ? 4 return jets, two of which are closed due to a leak in the plumbing
    Water is replaced/replentished using RO water

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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    With a CYA at 400 your target CL is between 34 and 48 - if your CL is at 4 that is 30 GALLONS of bleach ... not to mention you will sear the skin off anyone that gets in the pool.

    I would encourage the boss to drain and fill now. Giving SCUBA divers ear infections from a bad pool is really bad for business.

    Chris
    PADI AOW since 1994
    TFP Moderator Chris V. ~16K Pool & Spa, 48NSF DE, IG Plaster Circa 2000, Intermatic PE653, Challenger pump with a 2 speed B2984, 20gal stenner chlorine injection, Houston, TX
    One cannot follow Islam and Christianity at the same time, nor can one follow pool store methods and TFP at the same time.
    Pool School -- Pool Math -- TF-Test Kit

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    Quote Originally Posted by karmabiker
    With a CYA at 400 your target CL is between 34 and 48 - if your CL is at 4 that is 30 GALLONS of bleach ... not to mention you will sear the skin off anyone that gets in the pool.
    No you won't!!!! Because the CYA is so high.
    A FC of 40ppm at a CYA of 400ppm is the same as a FC of 10ppm at a CYA of 100ppm ... or a FC of 5ppm at a CYA of 50ppm.

    Back to Pool School!!!
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    Quote Originally Posted by karmabiker
    With a CYA at 400 your target CL is between 34 and 48 - if your CL is at 4 that is 30 GALLONS of bleach ... not to mention you will sear the skin off anyone that gets in the pool.
    No you won't!!!! Because the CYA is so high.
    A FC of 40ppm at a CYA of 400ppm is the same as a FC of 10ppm at a CYA of 100ppm ... or a FC of 5ppm at a CYA of 50ppm.

    Back to Pool School!!!

    ARRRRRRGGGGGHHHHH.



    I think I got it - so no searing of skin just TONS of bleach to get to a level that actually sanitizing the pool? I think the part of the equation I missed was that the FC is the only reactive component.
    TFP Moderator Chris V. ~16K Pool & Spa, 48NSF DE, IG Plaster Circa 2000, Intermatic PE653, Challenger pump with a 2 speed B2984, 20gal stenner chlorine injection, Houston, TX
    One cannot follow Islam and Christianity at the same time, nor can one follow pool store methods and TFP at the same time.
    Pool School -- Pool Math -- TF-Test Kit

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    Quote Originally Posted by karmabiker
    I think I got it - so no searing of skin just TONS of bleach to get to a level that actually sanitizing the pool? I think the part of the equation I missed was that the FC is the only reactive component.
    Well, most of the FC is bound up with the CYA. The "active" chlorine is much less than the FC. See this chart which show just how much more harsh a public pool with 2ppm FC and 0CYA is compared to the levels we recommend:
    http://richardfalk.home.comcast.net/~ri ... l/HOCl.htm
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    Just so you know, technically the chlorine bound to CYA is teensy-weensy reactive -- about 1/150th as much as hypochlorous acid. We generally ignore this because the FC levels aren't usually that high. Nevertheless, even accounting for this, 40 ppm FC with 400 ppm CYA would still be quite a bit less strong than commercial/public indoor pools with 1 ppm FC and no CYA.
    16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    To save your reagent when CYA is high just mix a small amount of the water you are testing, 50/50 with reagent. You don't need to mix a full sample since 10 ml (5 and 5) will yield results on anything above 60 ppm and 20 ml anything above 35.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, Hayward H400 & Heliocol Solar heating, A&A infloor system, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit

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    Re: New test kit, horrifying resutls

    I Love this forum!
    TFP Moderator Chris V. ~16K Pool & Spa, 48NSF DE, IG Plaster Circa 2000, Intermatic PE653, Challenger pump with a 2 speed B2984, 20gal stenner chlorine injection, Houston, TX
    One cannot follow Islam and Christianity at the same time, nor can one follow pool store methods and TFP at the same time.
    Pool School -- Pool Math -- TF-Test Kit

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