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Thread: Review of my results please

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Caledonia, IL
    Posts
    22

    Review of my results please

    FC = 4.5
    CC = < .5
    Ph = 7.5
    Alk = 150
    CYA= 20

    So things are looking much better with my pool this year. Last year I had a CYA of 120 (yikes!) and a partial refill during the winter closing did the trick.

    I feel I have a good grasp on what I'm doing now. My water has never looked better I've even trained another person on using the BBB method and finding that training others really reinforces what I've learned here. A big thank you to everybody!

    That said I do have a few questions:

    1. My current usage is about one gallon of 12.5% bleach a day which I buy from the pool store for $11.30 for a case of four. With tax that's roughly $3 a bottle. So that's $90 a month ($450 for five months) in chemical usage to run the pool and I'm wondering if that's good, bad or indifferent compared to others with a similar pool size (25k gallons)? This does not include any extra I'd need if I have to shock again.

    2. My plan is to get my CYA to 30 by using some pucks. Should I test daily, weekly, bi-weekly for CYA? ie... how long will it take for pucks to move my pool from 20 to 30? and when I say 20 I'm guessing because I fill the entire tube up and can still see the black dot. However I only drained half the pool last year with a cya of 120 so there should be still some in there.

    3. I understand the cya chlorine relationship, but if somebody has a high CYA and requires a higher range of bleach, I've read on TFP that it is safe to swim in all the way up to shock level, which could be 39ppm in some instances where cya is over 100. Is this still true and how can it not hurt you at that level? I'm asking as that was one answer I didn't know how to explain to somebody.

    4. Being I have a sand filter I wanted to see what adding DE would do for me. With my water clear, I followed the procedure here: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-..._a_sand_filter and at first was able to get two cups in. About 3 hours later the heater turned off from low pressure and the pump was working hard so I did a backwash and noticed quite a bit of dirty water. So I lowered it down to one cup and it did about the same this time but not as much dirt. So I went down to 1/4 cup and it did the same after about 5 hours again without much visible dirt during the backwash. So my question is am I doing this right? I changed my sand out this year, inspected my laterals and refilled with new pool grade sand so I know the sand filter itself is good. Any recommendations?

    Thanks again,
    Jamie
    _________________
    18' x 40' 24,000 GL pool. In Ground Vinyl.
    Taylor K-2006C Test Kit
    2HP Hayward Pump / sand filter, Polaris 360, Stenner 45M2 injection pump, 15 GL drum
    Midwest / Started BBB opening of 2012

  2. Back To Top    #2
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    SWSuburban Chicago, IL
    Posts
    11,965

    Re: Review of my results please

    I think you will be able to use less liquid per day if your CYA is raised to 50. The average daily loss of FC is in the area of 2-4 ppm (varies depending on a number of factors) so if you are going through more than that a day you should verify why. Is your FC holding overnight?

    You can see how much the tablet raises it by using the "Effects of Adding Chemicals" section of the Pool Calc. Put "7oz trichlor" as that is a rough estimate of the weight of the tablet. I would test CYA every 2 weeks if you are going through a lot of tablets.

    The Chlorine is bound to the CYA - the CYA acts like a buffer. Somewhere there is a very detailed description by Chem Geek that give the scientific explanation ... I'll try to find it.

    Yes you are doing the DE right - probably too much at first LOL but that's okay trial and error is a good way to learn, no harm no foul. The fact that its filtering better shows that perhaps something is going on which goes back to my earlier question - is your FC holding overnight?
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

  3. Back To Top    #3
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: Review of my results please

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxAcceleration
    FC = 4.5
    CC = < .5
    Ph = 7.5
    Alk = 150
    CYA= 20

    So things are looking much better with my pool this year. Last year I had a CYA of 120 (yikes!) and a partial refill during the winter closing did the trick.

    I feel I have a good grasp on what I'm doing now. My water has never looked better I've even trained another person on using the BBB method and finding that training others really reinforces what I've learned here. A big thank you to everybody!

    That said I do have a few questions:

    1. My current usage is about one gallon of 12.5% bleach a day which I buy from the pool store for $11.30 for a case of four. With tax that's roughly $3 a bottle. So that's $90 a month ($450 for five months) in chemical usage to run the pool and I'm wondering if that's good, bad or indifferent compared to others with a similar pool size (25k gallons)? This does not include any extra I'd need if I have to shock again.
    That works out to 5 ppm/day. That seems awful high. Does the pool get a lot of usage? Lots of sweaty, dirty children? If not, it sounds like the sun is taking more than its fair share and raising CYA a little will help. Which leads to...
    2. My plan is to get my CYA to 30 by using some pucks. Should I test daily, weekly, bi-weekly for CYA? ie... how long will it take for pucks to move my pool from 20 to 30? and when I say 20 I'm guessing because I fill the entire tube up and can still see the black dot. However I only drained half the pool last year with a cya of 120 so there should be still some in there.
    Pool Calculator can tell you how much CYA each 8 oz. puck will add. (It's 1.3 for your pool) so you can work backwards from there and see how many pounds/pucks you can add safely. How long depends on how long it takes them to dissolve. Be aware they also affect pH. See Effects of Adding Chemicals on Pool Calculator.

    3. I understand the cya chlorine relationship, but if somebody has a high CYA and requires a higher range of bleach, I've read on TFP that it is safe to swim in all the way up to shock level, which could be 39ppm in some instances where cya is over 100. Is this still true and how can it not hurt you at that level? I'm asking as that was one answer I didn't know how to explain to somebody.
    Yes, it is safe. Consider the FC to be active and reserve for want of a better term. With super high CYA, most of the FC is in reserve. 25FC@100CYA has less active FC than 10FC@0CYA. But who'd want to go swimming in that muck anyway? And who would try to shock at that CYA level?

    4. Being I have a sand filter I wanted to see what adding DE would do for me. With my water clear, I followed the procedure here: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-..._a_sand_filter and at first was able to get two cups in. About 3 hours later the heater turned off from low pressure and the pump was working hard so I did a backwash and noticed quite a bit of dirty water. So I lowered it down to one cup and it did about the same this time but not as much dirt. So I went down to 1/4 cup and it did the same after about 5 hours again without much visible dirt during the backwash. So my question is am I doing this right? I changed my sand out this year, inspected my laterals and refilled with new pool grade sand so I know the sand filter itself is good. Any recommendations?

    Thanks again,
    Jamie
    What's happening is that you're catching all the super fine stuff that gets through the sand filter. You did it right the first time. The later attempts shortchanged the amount of DE. Expect frequent overloading at first, then it should go longer between backwashes, and then finally you will have filtered anything bigger than 4 microns or so out and it will go almost as long as just plain sand between backwashes.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  4. Back To Top    #4

    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Caledonia, IL
    Posts
    22

    Re: Review of my results please

    Thank you for your answers, I read them thoroughly. I didn't know to use the "Effects of Adding Chemicals" section to find out how many pucks to add to affect CYA, so thanks for that. Thanks for the confirmation of my DE results as well - it's comforting to know that what I'm experiencing is normal.

    Ok, tonight I will do the OCLT to make sure I'm not losing any chlorine. I did one during my original opening and I was good.

    Now that I look at it closer, I'm only required to add 62oz of chlorine each day (goal = 4ppm) but I've been adding the entire 128oz jug. But I've only doing that because each morning I end up with a FC of 1.5ppm. So looks like I'm losing about 5ppm a day (as Richard said).

    No sweaty kids or anything like that and we've only swam once so far this year. I do have a 16mil solar blue solar cover on it, not sure if that makes a difference or not.

    One other thing I noticed is I still have small amounts of "dust" I like to call it where the seams of the liner are that I haven't vacuumed out yet. Does that stuff have to go to waste or can I backwash it? I've tried both and don't really know if the sand filter catches it or not because it kinda disappears once I vacuum it.

    I'll report back tomorrow with the results of the OCLT.
    _________________
    18' x 40' 24,000 GL pool. In Ground Vinyl.
    Taylor K-2006C Test Kit
    2HP Hayward Pump / sand filter, Polaris 360, Stenner 45M2 injection pump, 15 GL drum
    Midwest / Started BBB opening of 2012

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Re: Review of my results please

    You have a cover on it and are losing 5 ppm of FC a day?
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

  6. Back To Top    #6

    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Caledonia, IL
    Posts
    22

    Re: Review of my results please

    Quote Originally Posted by anonapersona
    You have a cover on it and are losing 5 ppm of FC a day?
    Yep I have a solar cover on it. My typical routine is wake up, check FC (usually at 1.5), add 128oz of 12% bleach, run the pump for 12 hours, go to bed. When I check the following morning it's back to 1.5. My CC is < .5 each morning. so I don't shock. That's without anybody swimming.

    Now I do have to add that I recently added (about 10 days ago) the use of the solar cover and it was dirty from sitting outside during the Midwest winter. Is it possible the FC is cleaning up the dirt on the solar cover?

    I'm going to do the OCLT tonight and see if I'm losing over 1ppm overnight and will post the result here in the morning.
    _________________
    18' x 40' 24,000 GL pool. In Ground Vinyl.
    Taylor K-2006C Test Kit
    2HP Hayward Pump / sand filter, Polaris 360, Stenner 45M2 injection pump, 15 GL drum
    Midwest / Started BBB opening of 2012

  7. Back To Top    #7
    frustratedpoolmom's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    SWSuburban Chicago, IL
    Posts
    11,965

    Re: Review of my results please

    Yes it is possible. I would do the OFCLT without the cover to see if it is the culprit.
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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