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Thread: Trouble w/niche light...

  1. Back To Top    #1

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    Trouble w/niche light...

    I have a smaller fixture in my spillover spa, and a normal size fixture in my pool. Neither work.
    I removed the fixture from the niche in my spa, and there was no slack to allow me to get it the surface. Nor was there a waterproof type connector on the back of it that would allow me to disconnect it to bring it to the dry.
    Pressing blindly forward, I removed the retaining ring for the clips on the backside of the light and tried to pry the cover off. No go. I was thinking it was vacuum locked, but then I noticed some white caulk around the ID of the ring, between it and the lens.
    So, I'm thinking the previous owner had some fixture flooding problems and decided to seal it with some goo. Great.

    There is a set of pvc pipes with an electrical cover of some sort that comes up in a nearby garden bed. This is the only one I've seen, so I assume that's the lights' shared elect. conduit. I'm thinking I should disconnect the wiring, and pull it through toward the niche so that I can get the fixture in the dry to either replace or repair it.
    What do you guys recommend to attach to the wiring so I can pull it back through after I'm done? Parachute cord? HI test nylon like trotliners use? Any tips? I've never pulled wiring before.

    If it helps, according to the fixtures nearly ruined label, it's 120V, and I think the bulb is a halogen type, due to the warnings about not touching it.

    I sure hope I don't find the same problems with my pool niche.

    Thanks.
    7x7 spa drains>16K IG, Gunite/Plaster, Compool 3600, Purex Triton Minimax Plus 350, Sand Filter, 8 Gal Liquidator

  2. Back To Top    #2

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    duraleigh's Avatar
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    Hi, Shell,

    I'd suggest about 3/8 polypropelene rope when you pull that wire. Depending on how many 90's you have, that pull can be close to impossible. It can also be a piece of cake...depending. Make sure you put enough rope on there that one guy can't break it and make sure your rope/wire connection is iron-clad.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

  3. Back To Top    #3

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    First trun off the power going to the lights then take the wire nuts off the wires at the box in your flower bed.
    Take one wire from the three and make a loop at the end then take what you are going to use (ahonther pice of wire works best but i am sure para cord will do the job) and loop the in side the loop in the light wire then get the loop as small as you can. Take some tape and tape all of the wire together and the loops try to get it as tight as you can.





    Hope this helps you
    6,000 gal. IG FG pool Sta-Rite max-e-pro 3/4hp
    Sta-Rite system 2 cart. filter
    Sta-Rite 200k BTU heater
    Tiger River Bengal spa

  4. Back To Top    #4

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    twisties,

    A pox on pool builders who leave the cord too short to place the pool light up on the deck for repair.

    I would consider replacing this light fixture for this very reason - a new light fixture will have the proper length cord. If you don't replace this light fixture, you will be faced with this hassle every time the bulb needs replacing.

    If you do buy a new light fixture, use the cord from the old fixture to pull in the cord for new fixture.

    Here are some hints that might help you in your repair efforts. http://www.poolrepair.com/archive/lights.html

    Titanium
    24,000 gallon inground freeform pool/spa circa 1983 (113 ft perimeter, 625 sq ft) with 350 gallon attached spill-over spa
    2007 2 HP, three-phase Hayward TriStar pump which is powered by an Ikeric VS-200 variable speed drive system
    1983 Laars XE Pool/Spa Heater Type ES 400,000 BTU, 1998 Hayward Super Star-Clear C-4000 cartridge filter (400 sq ft, 4 separate cartridges)
    1998 Polaris 380 pressure-side cleaner w/ 3/4 HP booster pump
    One skimmer :( and one PoolSkim :), One Supervision Galaxy LED pool lamp, Second story solar panels
    Hayward/GoldLine AquaLogic PS4 (replaced 1983 vintage dual circuit Intermatic timer)

  5. Back To Top    #5

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    X2 on the pox and thanks for the link.
    It is an American fixture, not sure what I'll replace it with yet. Something in the color-shifting LED flavor.
    7x7 spa drains>16K IG, Gunite/Plaster, Compool 3600, Purex Triton Minimax Plus 350, Sand Filter, 8 Gal Liquidator

  6. Back To Top    #6

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    Some of the LED lights out there come as a complete unit - light fixture and LED bulb altogether. The LED bulb isn't screwed in either - it is hardwired. So if the LED bulb fails, you have the pleasure of replacing the whole unit

    Other LED lights come as an LED bulb that you can then screw into a standard pool light fixture. I think there is something to be said for the relative ease of replacing just a bad LED bulb as compared to the entire fixture as described in the previous paragraph.

    Let us know what you end up doing.

    Titanium
    24,000 gallon inground freeform pool/spa circa 1983 (113 ft perimeter, 625 sq ft) with 350 gallon attached spill-over spa
    2007 2 HP, three-phase Hayward TriStar pump which is powered by an Ikeric VS-200 variable speed drive system
    1983 Laars XE Pool/Spa Heater Type ES 400,000 BTU, 1998 Hayward Super Star-Clear C-4000 cartridge filter (400 sq ft, 4 separate cartridges)
    1998 Polaris 380 pressure-side cleaner w/ 3/4 HP booster pump
    One skimmer :( and one PoolSkim :), One Supervision Galaxy LED pool lamp, Second story solar panels
    Hayward/GoldLine AquaLogic PS4 (replaced 1983 vintage dual circuit Intermatic timer)

  7. Back To Top    #7

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    Hi Shell,

    I have the colorlogic LED's and I know another guy in town that has the SAM lights. Let me know if you want to see the SAM's I can probably take you over there to see them. My pool won't be filled until June for the colorlogic's...I'll be home from offshore in two weeks.

    Jim
    Fortune favors the well prepared

    The build...
    viewtopic.php?t=3974
    Freeform 24' x 38' IG gunite. 3 1/2' to 8' deep. 28,500 gallons. AutoPilot Total Control SWCG. Pentair Intelliflo VF. Pentair CCP520 cartridge filter. Colorlogic LED lights. Tahoe Blue Diamond Brite. 1200 sq ft stamped concrete deck.
    More details as they happen...

  8. Back To Top    #8

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    Thanks for the tips.

    I was originally hoping to be able to screw in an Edison(screw-in) type LED retrofit bulb into both my fixtures, so yeah, I agree, there's something to be said about that much convenience. However, if the service life of the colorlogics and the SAM's are sufficient, than I can see how they could be viable.
    I'm just now beginning to research light fixtures, so I need to figure out my options. At this point, I don't even have a good grasp on pricing, much less all the other nuances.
    Are the screw-in type LEDs as bright as the stand-alone units mentioned above?

    Give me a shout when you get in Jim, I should be home until June 17th or so if Sat XI sticks to the "schedule". With any luck, there should be a housewarming party around June 7th or so if you're interested. 8)
    7x7 spa drains>16K IG, Gunite/Plaster, Compool 3600, Purex Triton Minimax Plus 350, Sand Filter, 8 Gal Liquidator

  9. Back To Top    #9
    DMAN11's Avatar
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    belldiver,

    I'm getting an inground vinyl and a single Colorlogic. Can you give a little info on yours??? Our pool is gonna be 16 X 32 rectangle, do you think 1 light will be enough to light it sufficiently? What is your opinion on placement, centered on the side, or centered on one end? Where is your placed? Do you have the stainless ring or the polymer ring?

    We also had the option of the SAM too. Our PB installs the colorlogic if you want them, but they put in the Pentair SAM if you go with a SWG. They said that they have had issues with pools that have SWG and the colorlogic lights. Something about the lights corroding out or having leaks??? Have you had any issues as of yet?

    Shell,,,

    Any final decisions yet?? Sorry if I am hijacking your thread, just wanted to get some info....

    Thanks,,,,,

    DMAN
    Attached Images Attached Images
    17,500g ; 16X32 Inground Vinyl
    Hayward 1hp ; SWG
    3/4hp booster on Polaris 280
    WHO DAT!
    GEAUX TIGERS!!

  10. Back To Top    #10

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    No worries, no hijack IMO.
    I'm trying to get some feedback on the 252 LED bulbs common to Ebay, I may try one out on my main pool since it's niche light has the normal Edison type lightbulb threads.
    As for placement, my pool is 35x15, and the niche is in the middle of the 35' span. I assume these lights diffuse fairly well, rather than throw a focused beam. That being said, it would make sense that the pool would be lighted more evenly by placing the bulb where mine is, rather than at one end or the other, due to the fact that the light would only need to travel roughly 15' in all directions to hit the other wall. Long story short, I think if you place it on one end, the other end will be dimmer. Can you run one on each end?
    7x7 spa drains>16K IG, Gunite/Plaster, Compool 3600, Purex Triton Minimax Plus 350, Sand Filter, 8 Gal Liquidator

  11. Back To Top    #11

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    DMAN,

    I'm still in construction phase myself. I asked around quite a bit and it seemed that two was going to be right for me. My pool is roughly 20 x 38 freeform. I have one light in the shallow end and one in the deep end, facing away from where the pool is viewed at night. I wish it was full of water and could give you an accurate report. I think it will depend alot on what color the inside surface of the pool is. From what I understand, light finish colors reflect the light better and dark finishes absorb it.

    As far as placment goes, definately facing away from your viewing area at night, so you are not staring at the lightbulb itself, just the lit up pool. And centered on one end or the side really depends on the shape. With a 16 x 32 I think you will be right on the edge of one or two lights. I've heard the colorlogics aren't quite as brite as the SAM's, but the bulbs last a long time. I know a few people that have had to change bulbs and/or the color lens motor in the SAMs. I have stainless niches and stainless rings. I'm not honestly too worried about the corrosion. If it happens, I'll deal with it.

    The link to my pool build is in my sig if you want to see anything about mine. I'm hoping to be home in another week to finish things up.

    Jim
    Fortune favors the well prepared

    The build...
    viewtopic.php?t=3974
    Freeform 24' x 38' IG gunite. 3 1/2' to 8' deep. 28,500 gallons. AutoPilot Total Control SWCG. Pentair Intelliflo VF. Pentair CCP520 cartridge filter. Colorlogic LED lights. Tahoe Blue Diamond Brite. 1200 sq ft stamped concrete deck.
    More details as they happen...

  12. Back To Top    #12
    DMAN11's Avatar
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    Shell, thanks for the help. I think I want to put ours in the middle of the side also on the side closest to the patio like belldiver suggested so we can see the light effects and not the light bulb. I just am not sure if the light is strong enough to spread/reflect all the way to the ends of the pool from the center. I have heard that the LED's are not as strong as regular lights. ANDDD yes, we coulllldddd do one on each end to be sure, but man, we are kinda stretching to put this one in instead of the regular light for like $300 less. As a matter of fact, we could put 2 regular lights for a little more than one LED, but man those colors are some pretty right???hehehe. HMMMMM, do you think we might oughta put the 2 regular lights?? man,,,,i hate to give up them colors.....hehe

    Jim, thanks for the info. I definitely agree with you on the placement being on the side facing away. I too have read about others having to change stuff with the SAM's, but that is one of the options we have. Since the PB told us that they were having issues with the ColorLogics in pools that had SWG's in them,,,, they only put SAM's in those SWG pools. Don't know what to make of that....

    As for your link to your build, I have definitely been there a few times already. I really like the tile you chose, and as for that concrete stamping,,,,man I might need to get your contractor's name. I have been trying to convince my wife that it would look even better on our deck and patio than it does on yours.....hehe. Matter of fact, I told her I was gonna get your address and next time we pass that way on our way to Church Point, we might have to pass by and check it out in person....hehe.

    Well, thanks for the help guys and if you guys want, you can check our list of equipment at this link here.....


    http://www.troublefreepool.com/about6209.html

    Let me know what yall think....

    Thanks,,,,,,

    DMAN
    17,500g ; 16X32 Inground Vinyl
    Hayward 1hp ; SWG
    3/4hp booster on Polaris 280
    WHO DAT!
    GEAUX TIGERS!!

  13. Back To Top    #13

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    I'm with ya. Wouldn't want to give up the colors either.
    7x7 spa drains>16K IG, Gunite/Plaster, Compool 3600, Purex Triton Minimax Plus 350, Sand Filter, 8 Gal Liquidator

  14. Back To Top    #14

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    DMAN,

    One option to consider...is to install the second light niche, and just leave it empty for a little while until the finances are back in order, or just a plain white light for now, and upgrade it later. The PVC conduit from the niche to equipment pad is left above grade and you can just pull another wire through later as long as the run isn't too long.

    I'll be home from June 10th to the 22nd if you want to see the big mess in my back yard. Send me a PM if your interested.

    Jim
    Fortune favors the well prepared

    The build...
    viewtopic.php?t=3974
    Freeform 24' x 38' IG gunite. 3 1/2' to 8' deep. 28,500 gallons. AutoPilot Total Control SWCG. Pentair Intelliflo VF. Pentair CCP520 cartridge filter. Colorlogic LED lights. Tahoe Blue Diamond Brite. 1200 sq ft stamped concrete deck.
    More details as they happen...

  15. Back To Top    #15

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    I have a 16x32 free form with 1 500 watt light and I'm satisfied. That said one side of the pool (the deep end) is clearly brighter than the other. But if you go with LED lights, I'd definitely spring for 2 since they're more efficient.

    Tada...





    HTH

  16. Back To Top    #16

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    Also,

    I did a comparison of the lumen output of a 500 watt incandescent bulb (like 8000-10000) and some of these LED bulbs that actually have rated lumen output rate at like 300-500. So a very very very big difference. If you want to be sure, look at my pics with a 500 watt bulb and get the actual lumen output of whatever LED bulb you buy. Then you can have some assurance.

  17. Back To Top    #17

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    That Lumen ratings info is great tech, thanks!
    7x7 spa drains>16K IG, Gunite/Plaster, Compool 3600, Purex Triton Minimax Plus 350, Sand Filter, 8 Gal Liquidator

  18. Back To Top    #18
    KirstenHW's Avatar
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    Re: Trouble w/niche light...

    Shellsingleton - What kinds / brands of LED replacement bulbs or fixtures exist for std lights?
    18x36 Spartan vinyl inground ca. 1981
    1HP Hayward SuperPump & Perflex EC65 DE Filter

    Lower Hudson Valley, New York

  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Re: Trouble w/niche light...

    Kirsten, I picked up my 120V color changing LED bulb on ebay. Was listed as a 272 LED pool light. Happy so far.
    Was less than half the price of my local pool supply houses.
    7x7 spa drains>16K IG, Gunite/Plaster, Compool 3600, Purex Triton Minimax Plus 350, Sand Filter, 8 Gal Liquidator

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