Green water - moved topic from introductions
- Thread starter mmcgirr
- Start date
Alrighty,
Got the Taylor 2006 kit today - what a world of difference!
Anyway, new numbers:
FC: 8.8 (I added 2 quarts and 2 cups of 8.25% per the calculator to bring FC to 12 for continuing shock - it was a busy day today, so I wasn't able to "hawk" it like I have the past few days.)
CC: .2 ppm
TA: 80 ppm
CYA: haven't retested yet, as the stabilizer hasn't become completely dissolved at this point in time - probably retest that this coming sunday for a full week of incorporation). I'm assuming it's likely in the 30-40 range, based on the stabilizer I added and pool volume.
Now, one quick question - should I perform the overnight test tonight, or should I wait a bit more (e.g. when the bottom of the pool is visible) to perform that?
Other random data:
Water Temp: 66 deg.
Outdoor Temp: 61 deg. Cloudy with scattered showers
Filter PSI: 11 (just backwashed this morning, as it was at 17 - nominal seems to be 10 psi for this particular filter)
Water is still cloudy, but I can make out shadows on the bottom of the pool. I've extracted probably 90% of the organic materials in the pool via slow and steady skimming (I need a vacuum). So, it's progressing slowly but surely - my wife (who was skeptical of BBB at the beginning, by the way, having been brought up in "pool store" climate with relatives) commented on how well the pool is coming along!
Haven't taken a picture as it's not progressed much past the last picture I took except for clarity purposes. When I can see bottom I'll snap another photo (And again when it's all sparkly and stuff
).
Again, I'd like to thank all you kind folks for helping me out with this - this place truly is invaluable, and when I can figure out why the donate button doesn't work for me, I'll become a supporter.
Thanks!
-Mike-
Got the Taylor 2006 kit today - what a world of difference!
Anyway, new numbers:
FC: 8.8 (I added 2 quarts and 2 cups of 8.25% per the calculator to bring FC to 12 for continuing shock - it was a busy day today, so I wasn't able to "hawk" it like I have the past few days.)
CC: .2 ppm
TA: 80 ppm
CYA: haven't retested yet, as the stabilizer hasn't become completely dissolved at this point in time - probably retest that this coming sunday for a full week of incorporation). I'm assuming it's likely in the 30-40 range, based on the stabilizer I added and pool volume.
Now, one quick question - should I perform the overnight test tonight, or should I wait a bit more (e.g. when the bottom of the pool is visible) to perform that?
Other random data:
Water Temp: 66 deg.
Outdoor Temp: 61 deg. Cloudy with scattered showers
Filter PSI: 11 (just backwashed this morning, as it was at 17 - nominal seems to be 10 psi for this particular filter)
Water is still cloudy, but I can make out shadows on the bottom of the pool. I've extracted probably 90% of the organic materials in the pool via slow and steady skimming (I need a vacuum). So, it's progressing slowly but surely - my wife (who was skeptical of BBB at the beginning, by the way, having been brought up in "pool store" climate with relatives) commented on how well the pool is coming along!
Haven't taken a picture as it's not progressed much past the last picture I took except for clarity purposes. When I can see bottom I'll snap another photo (And again when it's all sparkly and stuff
).Again, I'd like to thank all you kind folks for helping me out with this - this place truly is invaluable, and when I can figure out why the donate button doesn't work for me, I'll become a supporter.
Thanks!
-Mike-
I'd hold off on the OCLT until you can see the drain clearly, not just a blurry spot. You'll have to keep it at shock level until the water is clear anyway, right?mmcgirr said:
That's what I was thinking as well, but I figured I'd ask anywho just in case.
Can you folks recommend a good (pref. cheap, but long-lasting haha) AG vinyl pool vacuum / hose combo for me? I've tried wading through all the gunk on amazon, et al, but I can't make heads or tails of what's good, what isn't, and what pool types certain vacuums are for, etc.
Thanks!
-Mike-
Can you folks recommend a good (pref. cheap, but long-lasting haha) AG vinyl pool vacuum / hose combo for me? I've tried wading through all the gunk on amazon, et al, but I can't make heads or tails of what's good, what isn't, and what pool types certain vacuums are for, etc.
Thanks!
-Mike-
I bought my stuff at Lowes with a discount coupon. The vacuum head lasted about two years, but I didn't store it out of sunlight either. The hose is still good.
For a vinyl pool you want a head with brushes, not wheels, or it might tear.
For a vinyl pool you want a head with brushes, not wheels, or it might tear.
Well, I went out and got a vacuum head, sank it (or tried to) in the pool, turned on the pump, and tried to charge the vacuum line with water. I hooked it up to the skimmer plate, and tried to vacuum, but the pump lost prime.
Note that I tried to do this a whole bunch of times, tried to sink the line manually, and a whole bunch of other stuff. No love, wasn't able to keep the pump primed at all after an hour of effort - I am supremely frustrated at this point in time.
Note that I tried to do this a whole bunch of times, tried to sink the line manually, and a whole bunch of other stuff. No love, wasn't able to keep the pump primed at all after an hour of effort - I am supremely frustrated at this point in time.
Seems to me that once the pole fills with water it ought to stay down.mmcgirr said:
I usually set my vacuum on the floor, then walk the hose down into the pool by hand so it fills with water all the way to the top. Then I keep it submerged and shove it through the skimmer opening and plug it in. If any air gets in, it's not even half a strainer basket and the pump might make some noise but never loses prime and recovers fast.
well, I was trying a bunch of different methods.
Let me describe the process in great gory detail so I don't misspeak.
First, I attached the hose to the vacuum head, and pushed it down to the bottom of the pool. Then, I fed the hose in to the pool to try and get as much water in it as I could. I turned on the pump and put the skimmer end of the hose over the return. Then, after doing what I thought was prime (The vacuum head bubbled for a while, then stopped bubbling), I pulled the skimmer end over to the skimmer.
Problem now is, I have a straight skimmer plate adapter, so, how to get the skimmer end of the hose on to the adapter without getting air in. I tried a number of things, and thought that I did a pretty good job, but apparently not, as no matter what I tried, I could never keep the pump primed (bear in mind, I've been at this now for about 1.5 hours - lose prime, reprime, repurge hose, yadda yadda).
I should also add, that no matter what I did, it seemed like the hose never sank completely - there'd always be one or two sections that would come back up. I'm assuming the hose doesn't have any natural buoyancy of it's own (apart from being filled with water and having a trapped air bubble or something)?
I guess I could try attaching the hose to the skimmer plate first, and using the vacuum head end as the suction line in the pool - if I could establish vacuum that way, then I could just let it "suck on" the actual vacuum head itself. But by golly, this is not a fun process - is there a better way without spending hundreds of dollars on an automated one?
-Mike-
Let me describe the process in great gory detail so I don't misspeak.
First, I attached the hose to the vacuum head, and pushed it down to the bottom of the pool. Then, I fed the hose in to the pool to try and get as much water in it as I could. I turned on the pump and put the skimmer end of the hose over the return. Then, after doing what I thought was prime (The vacuum head bubbled for a while, then stopped bubbling), I pulled the skimmer end over to the skimmer.
Problem now is, I have a straight skimmer plate adapter, so, how to get the skimmer end of the hose on to the adapter without getting air in. I tried a number of things, and thought that I did a pretty good job, but apparently not, as no matter what I tried, I could never keep the pump primed (bear in mind, I've been at this now for about 1.5 hours - lose prime, reprime, repurge hose, yadda yadda).
I should also add, that no matter what I did, it seemed like the hose never sank completely - there'd always be one or two sections that would come back up. I'm assuming the hose doesn't have any natural buoyancy of it's own (apart from being filled with water and having a trapped air bubble or something)?
I guess I could try attaching the hose to the skimmer plate first, and using the vacuum head end as the suction line in the pool - if I could establish vacuum that way, then I could just let it "suck on" the actual vacuum head itself. But by golly, this is not a fun process - is there a better way without spending hundreds of dollars on an automated one?
-Mike-
Welcome to tfp, mmcgirr 
Just thought I would chime in and mention that a 27' dia 4' deep pool is about 15000 gallons, this is because you are not filling to 4 feet, usually the nominal depth is 3.5".
For filling you vacuum tube, hold it tight against the return to force out all of the air, then while the end is still under water, put your had over it to keep air from going in and then quickly place it on the skimmer plate. You may get a little air, but you should be alright.
Just thought I would chime in and mention that a 27' dia 4' deep pool is about 15000 gallons, this is because you are not filling to 4 feet, usually the nominal depth is 3.5".
For filling you vacuum tube, hold it tight against the return to force out all of the air, then while the end is still under water, put your had over it to keep air from going in and then quickly place it on the skimmer plate. You may get a little air, but you should be alright.
I will give that a shot linen, thanks for the tip.
HAHA, I completely neglected to factor in for the other 6" below the rim - I'll change that directly.
HAHA, I completely neglected to factor in for the other 6" below the rim - I'll change that directly.
I found the source of my issues for the vacuum - ran water over the joints on my suction line, when it came over the basket cover, the air churn stopped. So, I've got a new o-ring and lube on order. Once I get those in, I should be able to solve that issue (unless the top cover is warped, but I hope it's just a shot o-ring (the o-ring does look a little compressed on the sides, so I'm wagering that's what it is.)
I think the combination of the suction-side leak, and a lower water level (fixed that yesterday) is the entirety of the issue on the vacuum, we'll see.
Now, for a question: my current FC is 13.5, and CC is 0. This has been this way for the past day - solid, so it seems like all organics are killed off in the pool. However, due to the lack of vacuum, the water is still cloudy, as I've not been able to suck out all the dead algae and what not, so the water is cloudy blue.
The question is this: can I reduce the FC level at this point in time, even though the pool is still cloudy? The way I understand it is that the pool seems to have passed the OCLT (even though I didn't purposely perform the test, the numbers have stayed steady for a day (luckily it was overcast the past two days, so UV hasn't really factored in to FC loss, and I added some bleach last night at around 5pm - the level has not dropped at 6AM this morning).
If possible, I'd like to stop running the pump constantly and just do "turn-over" filtration, but I've left the pump running until I hear from you kind folks.
Thanks!
-Mike-
I think the combination of the suction-side leak, and a lower water level (fixed that yesterday) is the entirety of the issue on the vacuum, we'll see.
Now, for a question: my current FC is 13.5, and CC is 0. This has been this way for the past day - solid, so it seems like all organics are killed off in the pool. However, due to the lack of vacuum, the water is still cloudy, as I've not been able to suck out all the dead algae and what not, so the water is cloudy blue.
The question is this: can I reduce the FC level at this point in time, even though the pool is still cloudy? The way I understand it is that the pool seems to have passed the OCLT (even though I didn't purposely perform the test, the numbers have stayed steady for a day (luckily it was overcast the past two days, so UV hasn't really factored in to FC loss, and I added some bleach last night at around 5pm - the level has not dropped at 6AM this morning).
If possible, I'd like to stop running the pump constantly and just do "turn-over" filtration, but I've left the pump running until I hear from you kind folks.
Thanks!
-Mike-
If you are confident you have passed the FC overnight loss test... you can take the chance and let the FC drop to normal levels. We don't normally recommend that.
I would however continue to run the filter 24/7 after all it's the filter that will clear the water. You can try DE in the Sand Filter or a clarifier - to help the filter catch the finer stuff.
I would however continue to run the filter 24/7 after all it's the filter that will clear the water. You can try DE in the Sand Filter or a clarifier - to help the filter catch the finer stuff.
This site is farkin' awesome - I'd like to thank all you guys / gals for your help over the past week.
Update: the pool is coming along nicely! Still just slightly cloudy, but with scrubbing and vacuuming for the past three days, it's almost clear. I added a little DE to the filter to speed the filtering process along, and I think that helped quite a bit.
Anyway, here's some images:
[attachment=1:3saxrqp6]5-12-2013-getting there 1230pm (2) (Small).JPG[/attachment:3saxrqp6]
and this
[attachment=0:3saxrqp6]5-12-2013-getting there 1230pm (1) (Small).JPG[/attachment:3saxrqp6]
I'll tell you what, the taylor R-0871 reagent, while you're shocking and testing - does not last long, even doing .5 ppm measurements - I've ordered a 2oz bottle of the stuff, but wow, it goes quick!
I wish I could figure out what the issue with Paypal was concerning becoming a supporter here - is there some other way to make a donation for supporter status?
Thanks!
-Mike-
Update: the pool is coming along nicely! Still just slightly cloudy, but with scrubbing and vacuuming for the past three days, it's almost clear. I added a little DE to the filter to speed the filtering process along, and I think that helped quite a bit.
Anyway, here's some images:
[attachment=1:3saxrqp6]5-12-2013-getting there 1230pm (2) (Small).JPG[/attachment:3saxrqp6]
and this
[attachment=0:3saxrqp6]5-12-2013-getting there 1230pm (1) (Small).JPG[/attachment:3saxrqp6]
I'll tell you what, the taylor R-0871 reagent, while you're shocking and testing - does not last long, even doing .5 ppm measurements - I've ordered a 2oz bottle of the stuff, but wow, it goes quick!
I wish I could figure out what the issue with Paypal was concerning becoming a supporter here - is there some other way to make a donation for supporter status?
Thanks!
-Mike-
Attachments
Contact Jason the site administrator with regard to becoming a supporter....
Nice job
Nice job
Will send Jason a PM directly, and see what we can work up.
Thanks! I couldn't have gotten the pool squared away without y'alls help, it's been a lifesaver (mostly with the wife of course )
-Mike-
Thanks! I couldn't have gotten the pool squared away without y'alls help, it's been a lifesaver (mostly with the wife of course
)-Mike-
Pools open
Here's my latest numbers (as of this morning):
[attachment=1:3rzlx841]passed-oclt-5-16-13 (1) (Mobile).JPG[/attachment:3rzlx841]
and this:
[attachment=0:3rzlx841]passed-oclt-5-16-13 (3) (Mobile).JPG[/attachment:3rzlx841]
A few final questions:
1) Clarity - I think it's "shiny", but I've never owned a pool before - do you folks think I need to do anything further to it? I'm thinking of now fiddling around with borax to make it sparkle / algaecide, etc. but I wanted to get your opinions of the water clarity first.
2) I'm not sure (since I've been running the pump 24/7 for the past week and a half) how long I have to run it to maintain a turn-over per day. If someone could help on that as well, that'd be super. I don't have a flow meter, but the pump / filter specs are below.
3) The pool is hit with sunlight pretty much from sunrise to sundown, so I'm wondering if my CYA level should be higher to mitigate that, or is it ok where it is?
Thanks again for all your help - super stuff!
-Mike-
Here's my latest numbers (as of this morning):
- FC (last night): 9.2
[/*:m:3rzlx841] - FC (this morning): 8.7
[/*:m:3rzlx841] - CC: 0
[/*:m:3rzlx841] - TA: 80
[/*:m:3rzlx841] - CH: 70
[/*:m:3rzlx841] - CYA: 60 (this one is weird, I might've still been able to see the dot, but it was getting cloudy in the water)
[/*:m:3rzlx841] - PH: 7.6[/*:m:3rzlx841]
[attachment=1:3rzlx841]passed-oclt-5-16-13 (1) (Mobile).JPG[/attachment:3rzlx841]
and this:
[attachment=0:3rzlx841]passed-oclt-5-16-13 (3) (Mobile).JPG[/attachment:3rzlx841]
A few final questions:
1) Clarity - I think it's "shiny", but I've never owned a pool before - do you folks think I need to do anything further to it? I'm thinking of now fiddling around with borax to make it sparkle / algaecide, etc. but I wanted to get your opinions of the water clarity first.
2) I'm not sure (since I've been running the pump 24/7 for the past week and a half) how long I have to run it to maintain a turn-over per day. If someone could help on that as well, that'd be super. I don't have a flow meter, but the pump / filter specs are below.
3) The pool is hit with sunlight pretty much from sunrise to sundown, so I'm wondering if my CYA level should be higher to mitigate that, or is it ok where it is?
Thanks again for all your help - super stuff!
-Mike-
Attachments
I am just a little confused by your FC results. How did you get 8.7? The test is in increments of 0.2 or 0.5 depending if you use a 25 or 10 ml sample size (by the way, 10 ml is adequate and saves reagents).
No on algaecide...it really is only needed when you cannot maintain proper FC levels.
Borates...I would wait until you get some runtime without and then decide. It will give the water a different sparkle, but the clarity should be obtainable without.
Pictures sometimes do not do the water justice...but with just a proper FC level, you should be crystal clear...how would you characterize yours?mmcgirr said:
No on algaecide...it really is only needed when you cannot maintain proper FC levels.
Borates...I would wait until you get some runtime without and then decide. It will give the water a different sparkle, but the clarity should be obtainable without.
Can you post a model number for you pump? You could start with 4 hours a day and then move up or down from there. See: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-school/pump_run_timemmcgirr said:
Leave it...Unless you have a swg. YOur cya is actually a little high for your region, but as long as you maintain an appropriate FC level, you should be fine.mmcgirr said:
lol, sorry about that - I took two tests and averaged them this morning, just to make sure they were in the same general vicinity (and I wasn't doing something stupid). The 8.7 is the average of the two.
I don't know how I would characterize it. I think it looks fine, but then again, I don't really have a point of reference to go from, as the only swimming I've really ever done in pools has been in poorly maintained indoor pools or the ocean - so I'm not real sure what it's "supposed" to look like. It's sparkly in the sunlight, but I don't know if it's sparkly enough if you get what I mean.
The algaecide thing I mentioned was a reference to borax acting as an algae preventative and water softener that I read in the "things chemicals do" (or whatever it's called) section of pool school. I figured since there aren't any borates in the water currently that adding them couldn't hurt, and I would love to feel "soft water" while swimming I think (see above for why I'm not sure).
The CYA figure is puzzling, and I'm going to re-do that test tonight, as I think I did something there incorrectly. The pool was at 0 when I started this escapade, and I added a 4lb tube of stabilizer to the water - which should've brought me to around 30-40ppm - so this measurement was out of bounds from what I've expected. In addition (and what makes it weird to me) is that I've not added tablets or anything else that I've read adds CYA to the water. The only thing I've done is add water in from backwashing, so I would expect CYA to be lower than projected rather than higher. I'm pretty sure it's just human error on the CYA so like I say, I'll retake that one after work and make double sure I do it correctly.
RE: The pump, here's the information that's on the nameplate:
SP1510-Z-1-XB
Part: 7-187872-21
And here's a picture of the nameplate:
[attachment=0:cqmmgos4]5-5-2013 (7) (Small).JPG[/attachment:cqmmgos4]
Thanks!
-Mike-
I don't know how I would characterize it. I think it looks fine, but then again, I don't really have a point of reference to go from, as the only swimming I've really ever done in pools has been in poorly maintained indoor pools or the ocean - so I'm not real sure what it's "supposed" to look like. It's sparkly in the sunlight, but I don't know if it's sparkly enough if you get what I mean.
The algaecide thing I mentioned was a reference to borax acting as an algae preventative and water softener that I read in the "things chemicals do" (or whatever it's called) section of pool school. I figured since there aren't any borates in the water currently that adding them couldn't hurt, and I would love to feel "soft water" while swimming I think (see above for why I'm not sure).
The CYA figure is puzzling, and I'm going to re-do that test tonight, as I think I did something there incorrectly. The pool was at 0 when I started this escapade, and I added a 4lb tube of stabilizer to the water - which should've brought me to around 30-40ppm - so this measurement was out of bounds from what I've expected. In addition (and what makes it weird to me) is that I've not added tablets or anything else that I've read adds CYA to the water. The only thing I've done is add water in from backwashing, so I would expect CYA to be lower than projected rather than higher. I'm pretty sure it's just human error on the CYA so like I say, I'll retake that one after work and make double sure I do it correctly.
RE: The pump, here's the information that's on the nameplate:
SP1510-Z-1-XB
Part: 7-187872-21
And here's a picture of the nameplate:
[attachment=0:cqmmgos4]5-5-2013 (7) (Small).JPG[/attachment:cqmmgos4]
Thanks!
-Mike-
Attachments
Oh, and never mind about the CYA number. I redid the test and it's just north of 40 - it must've been the lighting conditions when I did it this morning. Re-tested outside in daylight as recommended in pool school / forum posts, and it came out where I calculated it should have.