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Thread: Help me pick a new pump!

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    Help me pick a new pump!

    Hi everyone, I'm a new home/pool owner as of last summer and over the winter my Hayward 1hp Single Speed Super Pump started making a lot of noise (LOUD whine). I don't know how old it is, but instead of repairing it, I see it as a good excuse to buy a more efficient and quieter 2 speed pump. I plan on only using the low speed unless I'm vacuuming.

    So, since I'm new to this I was hoping I could get some input on a proper pump for my setup. Right now my leader is the 2 speed Pentair Superflo 1hp.
    http://www.poolsupplyworld.com/Penta...30V/340042.htm

    Please tell me what you would recommend and why.

    Thanks!

    Here are some pictures to help show my setup.







    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Welcome to TFP!

    That is the pump I chose for myself.

    You could save some money by just buying a new 2 speed motor for you current pump. Then no plumbing changes are required. Assuming the wet end is in good shape.

    Posted from my Droid with Tapatalk ... sorry if my response is short
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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  3. Back To Top    #3

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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    Welcome to TFP!

    That is the pump I chose for myself.

    You could save some money by just buying a new 2 speed motor for you current pump. Then no plumbing changes are required. Assuming the wet end is in good shape.

    Posted from my Droid with Tapatalk ... sorry if my response is short
    I considered that myself, I would say the wet end is in "OK" shape, but the cost doesn't seem to be more more for a whole new pump.

    Also, I should add that the current pump seems to be wire for 120v, and all of the 2 speed pumps seem to be 220v. Is that true? Is my only option to rewire for 220v?
    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Actually the Superflo 3/4 hp 2 speed is 120v. The smallest Whisperflo 2 speed is also.

    If you have no high flow needs, the Superflo should be good and cheaper.

    Posted from my Droid with Tapatalk ... sorry if my response is short
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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  5. Back To Top    #5

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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    If you have no high flow needs, the Superflo should be good and cheaper.
    I only use the pump for filtration/cirulation, and vacuuming. Will a 3/4hp pump still operate the skimmer and vacuum efficiently?

    If so, this would work: http://www.sunplay.com/Pentair-Super...1-p/341111.htm
    Best price I could find was only $10 cheaper, but if it would still work well in my setup and keep me from having to run 220 all the way back to the panel it might be worth it.

    Also, I found this: http://www.poolsupplyworld.com/Penta...15V/012485.htm
    I'm really interested in this one because it is 1hp and only 115v. I was able to confirm that it is 115v on Pentair's spec sheet. It's $100 more than the equivalent Superflo, but it seems like a better pump with better flow rates.

    Any thoughts anyone?

    Thanks!
    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Well, HP is only part of the story. You have to also look at the Service Factor.
    For the Superflo (SF-N2-3/4A) it is 3/4HP with a 1.67 SF making the motor effectively 1.25 SFHP.
    For the Whisperflo, they play with the numbers the WFDS-24 is a 1HP with 1.25 SF = 1.25 SFHP. But the WFDS-3 is a 3/4HP with 1.67 SF = 1.25 SFHP. The 2 Whisperflo pumps are IDENTICAL, but they play with the numbers for marketing.

    As you can see all 3 of those pumps are 1.25 SFHP, but that is only part of the story as well. The Whisperflo is a larger pump and designed for larger (2+" pipe). The Superflo line is the equivalent to the Super Pump line that you currently have.

    Why do you want the higher flow rates of the Whisperflo? The more water you move, the more electricity it takes. I would suggest the 3/4 HP Superflo 2-speed as it is cheaper to buy, cheaper to run, and uses union fittings for the install which is easier.

    I am surprised that it costs that much. I paid around $400 for my 1HP 2 speed. Maybe the 3/4HP are not as available. I may search a bit myself.

    EDIT: just a note that looking at the performance curves, the 3/4HP Superflo is VERY similar to the 1HP Super Pump that you currently have. So you should expect the same flow on high speed. On low speed the flow rate is about 1/2, but the electrical usage is about 1/4.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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  7. Back To Top    #7

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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    Well, HP is only part of the story. You have to also look at the Service Factor.
    For the Superflo (SF-N2-3/4A) it is 3/4HP with a 1.67 SF making the motor effectively 1.25 SFHP.
    For the Whisperflo, they play with the numbers the WFDS-24 is a 1HP with 1.25 SF = 1.25 SFHP. But the WFDS-3 is a 3/4HP with 1.67 SF = 1.25 SFHP. The 2 Whisperflo pumps are IDENTICAL, but they play with the numbers for marketing.

    As you can see all 3 of those pumps are 1.25 SFHP, but that is only part of the story as well. The Whisperflo is a larger pump and designed for larger (2+" pipe). The Superflo line is the equivalent to the Super Pump line that you currently have.

    Why do you want the higher flow rates of the Whisperflo? The more water you move, the more electricity it takes. I would suggest the 3/4 HP Superflo 2-speed as it is cheaper to buy, cheaper to run, and uses union fittings for the install which is easier.

    I am surprised that it costs that much. I paid around $400 for my 1HP 2 speed. Maybe the 3/4HP are not as available. I may search a bit myself.

    EDIT: just a note that looking at the performance curves, the 3/4HP Superflo is VERY similar to the 1HP Super Pump that you currently have. So you should expect the same flow on high speed. On low speed the flow rate is about 1/2, but the electrical usage is about 1/4.

    Jason, thank you for that great info!! I guess I was falling for the "More is Better" marketing. It seems like the 3/4 Superflo is the best way to go.

    Now to just find a good price on one...

    Thanks!!
    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    I would not dismiss just replacing the motor for a 2-speed (depending on cost).

    Also, you could go with the Hayward Super Pump 1HP 2-speed (SP2607X102S) which would line up with your current plumbing ... although they are screw in pipe fittings so it is not quite that simple ... unless you were able to just add unions in your current plumbing.

    EDIT: Nevermind, the Hayward 2-speed appears to be 230V ... you could like still find a different motor though.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    I don't even know where to look for a 115v 3/4hp 2 speed motor only. How do I know if it will fit my Super Pump?
    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Yeah, it might be tricky, I have not had luck yet. I find 1HP 2-speed motors, but they appear to be 230V.
    It is 56J frame, C flange (round), threaded shaft.

    Although most of the motors do not have speed selection switches (I did see an add-on for a rear cover with a switch for $35). But, I am pretty sure all the Superflo pumps come with a switch built in (my 1HP did) ... so that may be the easier route.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    Yeah, it might be tricky, I have not had luck yet. I find 1HP 2-speed motors, but they appear to be 230V.
    It is 56J frame, C flange (round), threaded shaft.

    Although most of the motors do not have speed selection switches (I did see an add-on for a rear cover with a switch for $35). But, I am pretty sure all the Superflo pumps come with a switch built in (my 1HP did) ... so that may be the easier route.
    Ok, I think I'm going to get a whole new pump. Let me know if you can find a better price on the Pentair SuperFlo 3/4 HP Two Speed Pump 341111

    Thanks again!
    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    Well, HP is only part of the story. You have to also look at the Service Factor.
    For the Superflo (SF-N2-3/4A) it is 3/4HP with a 1.67 SF making the motor effectively 1.25 SFHP.
    I think Pentair has a typo on their web site. Part numbers that end in A are up rated so that pump should have a 1.25 SF and it will be slightly smaller than your current pump.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Thanks. So the Superflo would be a 0.93 SFHP.
    From what I see the Super Pump is a 1HP, 1.1 SF = 1.1 SFHP.

    Comparing the flow curves (if they are to be believed from the websites), they look pretty close together, although the Superflo is slightly less.

    Mark, are you aware of any 115V 2-speed motors they could use on the existing pump?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    The B973 is a larger diameter motor but most Superpump housings have a spacer at the back of the motor that can be removed to accommodate the larger diameter. Just make sure the housing has this removable piece. Otherwise you will have to modify it yourself.

    The B2973 is a higher efficiency version that is also in the larger diameter.

    A google search will produce a lot of hits on any of these but this place usually has good prices:

    http://electricmotorwarehouse.com/56Jframe.htm
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    Thanks. So the Superflo would be a 0.93 SFHP.
    From what I see the Super Pump is a 1HP, 1.1 SF = 1.1 SFHP.

    Comparing the flow curves (if they are to be believed from the websites), they look pretty close together, although the Superflo is slightly less.
    Right now I'm planning on buying the 3/4 Superflo. Does everybody agree that the 3/4 Superflo is powerful enough to keep 30,000g clean?
    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Do you guys know how to figure out how long I need to run the 3/4hp pump on low speed in order clean all 30,000 gallons?
    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Imo, it is on the small side, but should work since it would be ~24 gpm on low speed and fairly restrictive plumbing. This would calculate out to ~34000 gallons a day. However, most likely you will not need to do a full turnover to keep the pool clean. The only thing that you might want to consider is if you decide to go with a larger sand filter, then this pump would likely be too small to properly backwash it. You might consider the 1 hp superpump model SP2607X102S
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

  18. Back To Top    #18
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Hmm ... well the constraint was really sticky to 115V ... are you sure that Super Pump 1HP is not 230V? Plus according to the curves it is only SLIGHTLY bigger as the service factors are different.

    The other possibility would be the 3/4HP Whisperflo 2-speed, which is more powerful.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Jbliz, I think you are right, the manual suggested that up to 2 hp they were switchable (but the manual did not specify 2-speed...or 1-speed for that matter), but when I looked online, they seem to be only listed as 230V Man does Haywards website stink, why can't they just list their specs

    Maybe the pentair whisperflo WFDS-24 (also known as the WFDS-3) would be a good choice. That one is 115V.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Help me pick a new pump!

    Quote Originally Posted by linen
    Jbliz, I think you are right, the manual suggested that up to 2 hp they were switchable (but the manual did not specify 2-speed...or 1-speed for that matter), but when I looked online, they seem to be only listed as 230V Man does Haywards website stink, why can't they just list their specs

    Maybe the pentair whisperflo WFDS-24 (also known as the WFDS-3) would be a good choice. That one is 115V.

    Pentair's website has lots of typos and incorrect info as well. Does everyone agree that the WFDS-24 being 115v is NOT a typo? It's the only 1hp 2 speed that is 115v capable, and that seems weird to me.
    30K gal, 18x40 IG vinyl, 2 Speed 3/4hp Pentair Superflo Pump, Hayward S-244T Sand filter, BBB, TF-100

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