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Thread: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some advice

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    Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some advice

    Hello Everyone, I am new to the pool building process and would like some feedback. Please someone chime in and offer some advice. I would like some advice on these quotes that I have received and tell me what you would change or add and why? I am new to the pool scene but I grew up with one about 10 years ago. I am in Richmond, TX. Please give me your advice. I want to do it right the 1st time and not wish I had done something that I didnt do. We started out with salt system but we quickly found out that it is not recommended with natural stone (we want a natural stone waterfall with over hang to produce grotto effect). Also, would you recommend Pebble Tec or something similar vs just a darker plaster?

    Pool Builder #1:
    General Specifications
    Pool Perimeter: 93 Depth: 3.5’-6’ Area: 511SF
    Liability Insurance N/A Pool Permit Assist HOA Forms if needed
    Excavation of Pool Start-up Pool School (teach operations)
    Steel and Plumbing:

    Steel: 8" O.C., 4 Bar Beam Plumbing Sch. 40
    Pool Returns: 5 Main Drains: 2 Anti-Vortex Skimmers: 2
    Fill Line: Manual 100’ Overflow Line: yes Gas to Heater: 145’
    Clean/Purify:

    TigerShark QC Robotic Filter: 525 Cartridge Purification: Chlorine
    Tile and Coping:

    Tile: Standard 6" Coping: Travertine Bullnose 1.25” - Went to chisled flagstone coping

    Spot Tiles: n/a Color grout: Standard
    Decking:

    Decking: 633 sq.ft. Seamless Stamp Concrete Top Existing: None - We have decided to go with Spray Deck
    Laterals: None Tie-Down Spouts: n/a Deck Drains: 13’ Decko
    Electrical and Pumps:

    Electrical: 290’ Inc. Sub Panel: no ($425IF) Pool Light: ColorLogic LED
    Pool Pump: 1.5HP TriStar2spd Booster: 2HP for WFall Cleaner Pump: no
    Interior:
    Benches: 2-6’ Swimouts: no Tan Ledge: First Step
    Table: n/a Beach entry: n/a Plaster: PebbleTec (Tier 2 BLKPRL)
    Mastic: to be applied between decking/coping
    Accessories:
    Maintenance: Test kit, brush, leaf skimmer and pole.

    Hayward Ecommand Basic Unit to operate Pump
    Water Features:
    5 Ton Mossrock Waterfall with 10’ Weeping Wall
    Spa:
    7’ x 7’ Spa, 12” Raised, 1.5hp Blower, ColorLogic LED, 400K Gas Heater, 12” Dam Wall

    7’ Stacked Flagstone Spillway, 6 Twirlybyrd Jets
    Misc.:
    Sod replacement, sprinkler capping and re-routing, tree and stump removals by bid (not included).

    Total: $ 54,930.00 Home Owner’s Association Deposit not included where necessary
    Draw Schedule of Balance to: 40% Excavation, 40% at Gunite, 15% at Deck Form, 5% At Plaster
    Options:



    Change to AquaLogic PS8 with Floating Remote $1,920.00

    Change from Chlorine to AquaPlus Salt (add sealant to coping) $ 850.00

    Upgrade TriStar to EcoStar Variable Speed Pump for P/S $ 430.00

  2. Back To Top    #2

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    Re: New Pool Build - Getting Quotes but Need Advice - Quotes

    Pool Builder #2:
    PROPOSAL
    Pool Size
    ……………………………….
    16' x 32'
    Pool Area
    ………………………………….
    495 sq.ft.
    Pool Shape
    ………………………………….
    Free Form
    Pool Perimeter
    ………………………………….
    91 lf.
    Pool Depth
    ……………………………….
    3.5' x 6'
    Spa
    ………………………………….
    Spa 12" Raised Flagstone or Boulder Impressions
    Spa Perimeter
    ………………………………….
    27 Linear Feet;

    Interior Finish
    ……………………………….
    Wet Edge (Level Two) 400 S.F. Minimum
    Filtering System:
    ………………………………….
    Hayward SwimClear™ Cartridge 525 ftฒ
    Pump:
    ………………………………….
    Hayward TriStar™ 1 ฝ HP Full Rate
    Additional Pump(s)
    ………………………………….
    (1) Hayward TriStar™ 1 ฝ HP Full Rate
    Cleaning System
    ………………………………….
    Polaris 280 / Pentair Legend
    Heater
    ………………………………….
    400,000 BTU Hayward H-400 Low NOx
    Coping
    ………………………………….
    Boulder Impressions
    Facing
    ………………………………….
    Boulder Impressions
    Pool steps
    ………………………………….
    custom to plan
    Pool bench
    ………………………………….
    custom to plan
    Skimmers
    ………………………………….
    2 Hayward automatic
    Pool returns
    ………………………………………….
    6 directional (included eyeball fittings)
    Sanitization
    ………………………………….
    Pentair Rainbow™ 320 Chlorinator 2
    Controls
    ………………………………….
    Goldline Pro Logicฎ PS-8
    Equipment foundation
    ………………………………….
    Concrete
    Steel reinforcement
    ………………………………………….
    4 - 1/2" bar bond beam
    Floors and walls 8" o.c. with 3/8" rebar
    Maintenance equipment
    ………………………………….
    8’-16’ telescoping pole, vacuum head, 35’ hose, plastic wall brush, leaf net, 7 in
    Waterfall
    ………………………………….
    Rock Ledge Overhang Moss rock waterfall 3 ton 1 Unit(s); Plus 3 Additional
    Ton(s); Moss rock accents 7 Linear Feet;
    Decking
    ………………………………….
    Spray-Decking Straight; 400 Square Feet;
    Caping Existing Decking
    ……………………………….
    No Caping Existing Decking
    Lighting
    ………………………………….
    pool:
    500 Watts
    spa:
    100 Watts
    waterfalls:
    None
    Toe Tiles/Upgraded Tile
    ………………………………….
    No Toe Tiles/No Upgraded Tile
    Special Construction
    ………………………………….
    No Special Construction Items
    Drainage System
    ………………………………….
    Area Drain Pipe (4") County 200 Linear Feet; Deck Drain Grates (4" sdr)
    County 8 Unit(s);
    Fencing
    ………………………………….
    New 8' section of wooden fence; 2 Section(s);
    Specialty Items
    ………………………………….
    No Specialty Items
    Miscellaneous
    ………………………………….
    No Miscellaneous
    Landscaping
    ………………………………….
    Landscape Package Starter, SOD (St. Augustine ); 1400 SF, Sprinkler Per
    Zone also Repair & Reroute; 3 Unit(s)
    Upon completion all equipment is primed, started and fine tuned, pool and spa are thoroughly brushed and vacuumed, and all necessary start-
    up chemicals are added for proper balance.
    PROPOSAL also includes: all standard permits necessary for building, plumbing, and electrical. Backwash line is not needed for cartridge
    filter. Electrical hook-up of all equipment and lighting with proper grounding. Flood light over equip, 150' of electrical raceway to equipment.
    Sch 40 PVC plumbing for pool and/or spa.
    The total Price for the pool, and landscaping is as follows

    TOTAL BID . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

    $59,179.39

  3. Back To Top    #3

    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Do you have a picture of the design?

    Its so hard to say.. the second one has more stuff included.... so its not apples to apples.

    We are upgrading to tiger shark cleaner from polaris so that may be a good idea for you as well.

    I don't think I am much help but a picture would help.

    What is your measurements of the pool. Mine is 35 x 23 at widest area with sunshelf, I forget the perimeter. We are up to about 46k with a gas fire pit. We are also doing a qtz plaster vs. pebble. We are doing ozone and chlorine.

    So hard to compare.... I am in Cypress
    Thanks, KIM
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Here is a picture of PB#2 Design:
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Here is the Picture of PB#1:
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    That is super nice. Lots of beautiful rock! I think for what your getting with the pebble and rock price seems ok for both builders. I hope some others with more knowledge will respond and help you!

    I like the first design better.. pool looks bigger? is it?

    I think Ocean Blue is on my side of town, you should contact backyard luxuries who I am using too and see what he can do. So far super pleased with fast response to quote and changes and great to work with so far. Had good refernces too.

    KIM

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    They are pretty close to the same size. I included a different angle of the pool so you can get a better perspective.

    Jeremy

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Yes, looks great! What are your concerns? Price? Builder?

    I would look on BBB and talk to references about their experiences.

    If all seems good there, just go with who gives you the most for your money!

    And who you feel has done the best job with the planning, proposal process. Building a pool is kind of a nightmare, I have done it before... so choosing good builder is super important and I learned from a past mistake!

    kim

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    My main concern is equipment, and material choices. This will be my first pool building experience. We have narrowed it down to 3 PB'S. One builder is contradicting what the other 2 are telling us on some aspects but it is in-line with what I have read on the site (ozone, plaster vs aggregate, and heater size). We want a waterfall/grotto out of natural stone but would also like the salt option due to the supposed maintaince ease over chlorine and the monthly cost of chemicals. Also, not sure what sort of option to go with as far as in pool cleaning equipment. I just want to make sure I am informed and making the right choices on equipment and materials to ensure I get the best for the money.

    Also, Kim if you could pm the people that you would not recommend and why that would be much appreciated because I keep reading horror stories about people getting burned by pool builders and that is not what I want to happen. Could you also include your quote. I would like to compare what you are getting to what we are getting and cause your pool seems much bigger and looks like you have more decking. How many sq ft on the decking?

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Well, They both use hayward, so that is easy. Sounds like you are going salt for sure so you will need to seal all your rock is my understanding. I would love to have salt but have decided to try the ozone/chlorine combo to avoid salt issues eventhough I don't have much rock. I have read alot of issue with furniture rusting, window frames rusting, etc. I am hoping that the ozone will give us the feel of salt and lower chlorine usage like salt without the issues.... I can always go to salt if I want to later.

    I need to check on my filter size as mine is only 422 or something and yours is bigger and I think our pools are similar in size.

    It is too much to think about. I know! KIM

  11. Back To Top    #11
    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Quote Originally Posted by Texgirl
    I am hoping that the ozone will give us the feel of salt and lower chlorine usage like salt without the issues.... I can always go to salt if I want to later.
    I am not entirely sure I understand your statement but...with no salt in the pool, I am fairly certain you will not get the "feel of salt". Also, Ozone most likely will require more chlorine not less. From Alternative sanitizers and "chemical free" pools :
    Ozone will destroy chlorine but will oxidize organics so it's a two edge sword. You will generally have higher chlorine consumption with ozone than without and it does not allow you to run lower chlorine levels because there is no residual effect from the ozone.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    linen, I know I won't have salt, but I have spoken to several people that have this combo and they say they are able to use less chlorine and the water feels softer... maybe just because its less chlorine, not sure but they all really like it.

    Not one of them has said anything about having to use more chlorine, quite the opposite. Also, rarely need to shock.

    I know most out there don't believe in the ozone and if I get it and it is not doing what I think it will, I will let you know!! and move to salt.. but gonna give it a shot based on the people I have spoken to and their experiences.

  13. Back To Top    #13
    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Quote Originally Posted by Texgirl
    Not one of them has said anything about having to use more chlorine, quite the opposite. Also, rarely need to shock.
    A properly maintained pool should never need shocking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Texgirl
    the water feels softer... maybe just because its less chlorine, not sure but they all really like it.
    Proper FC level for the pools cya level will not be harsh on skin or hard on swimsuits. Many people equate pool water "harshness" with chlorine because of public pools where the active chlorine level is much higher than what is recommended on this site. Also when ph is not maintained properly, it can be irritating.

    Ozone is mostly a placebo when used on a typical residential pool. With that said, if you use it or not, make sure you follow recommended levels to have a trouble free (and safe) pool.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

  14. Back To Top    #14

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Seriously nobody else wants to chime in. I figured I would be overwhelmed with information. I will post the other quotes as they come in.

    Jeremy

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    I recommend not going too fast and keep getting quotes until you find a builder that you have references from and you have a good feeling about.

    Some things I wished that I did differently now that I have gone through the process:

    1. I wished I had a variable speed pump, not only for cost savings here in So Cal, but easier to dial in the pool features. The SWG requires a certain amount of flow, solar works best at a certain flow rate, etc.
    2. I wished I had a light added at the pad area. I'm using a portable light for now.
    3. I wished I went with colored LED lighting.
    4. I wished I had automation, would make running the solar, SWG, etc. more efficient.
    5. Learn how to maintain your pool from Pool School at the top of each page.
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
    Hayward Aqua Rite T-15 SWCG, Jandy LXi 400k BTU NG heater, 350 sq.ft. of Sun Star solar panels, TF-100 Test Kit, Dolphin s300i Cleaner
    Test Kits . Pool Math . Chlorine/CYA Chart . The SLAM Process

  16. Back To Top    #16

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    For what it's worth (we just built and are in Cypress, TX) the approach I took was as follows - Interviewed my initial selection of seven builders. I removed several from the list after that as I could not imagine working with them at all, or they were unresponsive etc. For the four that I could see myself using, I got their initial quotes and then taking those I went back to each for numbers on options that would allow me to put together a comparison of equal quotes - equal size, equipment etc (apples to apples if you will). This allowed me to narrow down to two finalists and make my final selection. There are a few big names in the Houston area that I ruled out IMMEDIATELY based on what they were recommending. If they contradicted what I read on this site that was also a warning light. Would be happy to share any specifics if it helps.
    18,000 Gallon IG, Pebble Sheen, Quartzite coping
    Pentair 420 Cartridge Filter, 2HP Silencer, 400,000 BTU Heater, Platinum Legend Cleaner
    2x IntelliFlo VS pumps - Screenlogic Interface - Stenner 45MPHP10 15 Gal Bleach Injection
    TF100 + PoolCalculator + This Site!

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Texgirl.. this is better than great advice on this forum.

    ...just sayin'
    Helen
    Dallas Area, 16,000 gal IG, Easytouch 8 computer, Intelliflo 3HP Variable Speed pool pump, Pentair Smart Pump 4x160, Pentair 3/4 HP Booster Pump, FNS 60 DE 60, Mastertemp 400, Rainbow 320, Dual Timer w/ freeze protection, Intellichor SWG, TF100 Test Kit, POOL FILLED AUG 3, 2012, ORDER YOUR TF100 KIT FROM http://tftestkits.net
    http://www.troublefreepool.com/under...ie-t49936.html

  18. Back To Top    #18

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    Who did you end up using and how did it go?

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some adv

    We actually didnt end up doing it. We are in the process of selling our house currently and are starting to look for a pool builder again. We will be building a house and pool at the same time.

  20. Back To Top    #20

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    Re: Please Help -New Pool Build Richmond, TX - Need some advice

    The best advise I can give you is to get every little detail in writing. Make sure you have the email for everyone that's involved in the project. Use email as you primary form of communication. This is the best way to hold folks accountable. It will also ensure folks are responsive to your issues. The way pool builders set up payments puts the customer at a disadvantage. Think about this, you would of payed out 80% of the cost the day of gunite. They will want this the morning of before they start. Your deck, plaster, coping, electrical and much more will still need to be done. If you have issues after that point you have no financial leverage against the pb. He also has no financial motivation to finish your job quickly because at that point he has received all of his profit.

    Don't just look at price. Talk to some of their previous customers and get a good feel of how they operate. When you are 45k in and looking at bowl of ugly concrete and a mud pit you want to feel like you can trust the guy your dealing with. I also always make a copy of anyone's driver license that is working on my house. When your dealing with folks that don't have a traditional place of business this is very important. In the past I have had to go knock at someone's door after they stop returning calls. I have also went to the police station and file criminal complaints and having this information makes it a fast and simple process. It also has always resulted in issues being resolved fast.

    I may sound a bit extreme but 60k is not chump change. My neighbors pool ended up costing close to 400k after the builder built part of the pool on the empty lot next to them. They decided to buy the lot to resolve the issue.
    16,000 gallons, IG
    Pebble,Sand
    Jandy 2 speed pump
    Under construnction 8-1-14
    Spa

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