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Thread: Leak helpipe

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    Leak helpipe

    Okay overall I am not new to pools but a do it myself novice. I have a 13000 inground gunite pool, with a pentair superflo and booster pump, sand filter and a electric heat pump. I was noticing wetness around the main pump on the concrete and the outflow line of the heat pump. I was constantly low on salt and did have a autofiller. I turned off the autofiller and noted the water level was going down 1/2 inch a day. I decide to fix the pump and used a kit and changed all orings and seals and now its dry as a bone, and the line out of the heat pump was tightened and it does not leak either. Looked at the sand filter and there is no wetness at all except one drop on the intake pipe, but I can't tighten this as can't turn the pipe its all glued. BUT really see no wetness anywhere here anyway. I look inside the heat pump and see puddle of water but have it covered with tarp, but this is degrading so this could be from rain holding there, Have no way to get in there and blow water out and don't see drip. I put a cup in the pipe for backwash while pump is filtereing and don't see any water coming that a way.

    Did the bucket test and after one week the bucket is always 1 inch or so higher than the pool. I have a skimmer that also has the return built into it and the builder has some valves where i can turn off the skimmer return or the bottom drains (two together). I have ran several days both ways and seems it still loses versus the bucket but its worse when pulling from the bottom drains. All these lines are underground and in concrete with travertine anyway. NO way in **** i would have this dug up and just keep replacing water and chemicals if I had too. Should I take the top off the heat pump and blow out that water I can see if thats the culprit. Or any other suggestion. I am running with the bottom drains closed as this seems to lose less water.

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    It's a bit counter intuitive since you're working on the suction side. If it's leaking more when you have the main drains open and the skimmer closed, it's most likely the skimmer leaking. I would plug the bottom port of the skimmer off and close the skimmer valve and run the bucket test again.

    Does it leak more with the pump running or off?
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    Went outside to check the heat pump and apparently wiggiling it around last time the water there is gone and a hole at the bottom must have been closgged with dirt (its dirty down there) and it was dry.

    As stated it ran one day with just the skimmer open and its slightly perhaps 1/4 inch lower in the pool versus the bucket.
    The answer to your question is I have left pump off before and it does not leak, only when pump running and thats why I fixed all those leaks I had in oring, etc and now very dry.

    I don't know how to plug the bottom port of the skimmer, there are two holes of different sizes down there. I do have one of those vacuum hose sealers but it has a hole to the hose. If there is somekind of plug I can purchase I don't know what kind of skimmer or are they generic plugs. This skimmer has the return slots below it under the water where the water returns to the pool (its part of the skimmer) and it forms a surface sheeting action that brings water back to the skimmer. There are no other return holes to the pool except for the booster one for the pentair vacuum.

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    If it's leaking only when the pump is running, it almost can't be a suction side leak.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Leak helpipe

    so what do i do, then it must be skimmer, correct? Then if the skimmer is withing concrete what does one do.

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    It's most likely not the skimmer. It almost has to be on the discharge side of the pump. Check the backwash port and make sure it's not leaking when the pump is running.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Leak helpipe

    I have looked at the discharge pipe and no water is blatently running out of it. Is there some other way of checking it. The pipe that goes from pump into sand filter has some threads there and teflon tape. When I run my finger on bottom its wet, but I don't see a drip. And when I had the motor off to fix those o rings, This pipe was loose here, BUT i can not turn it to tighten it since there is a wall there and an glued in a L shape down to motor. Would this small amount be causing 1/4 to 1/2 inch water change I notice. I can cut this pipe and tighten it and then glue the middle of what I cut. How else can I check the multivalve on top of sand filter if this is a common problem. I just rechecked the backwash pipe and see nothing while pump running. why is this so hard to figure out?

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    Leaks can be a challenge to find some times. If you don't see any water coming from the port that should be good enough.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Leak helpipe

    Still see no water anywhere. Noted now that losing about 1/2inch water in pool versus bucket every two days. Does not matter what return i use seems same amount of loss now. There is only one return to the pool built into the skimmer. Does anyone know what I should do next.

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    Have you confirmed with the bucket test that the water loss only occurs when the pump is on? I think doing the bucket test with the pump off would be my next step.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Leak helpipe

    Yes. My pump only runs 5 hours a day. I have turned it off before on a particular day and the water line stays the same. Only goes down with pump running.

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    If it only leaks with the pump running, then the leak has to be on the pressure (discharge) side of the pump. My first guess is always the multiport valve leaking out the waste port. I'd check that again and if you're sure it's not leaking, start eliminating other things.

    Can you post a pic of the equipment?
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Leak helpipe

    I am uploading my pictures.
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Re: Leak helpipe

    More photos
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Re: Leak helpipe

    more photos. Note my skimmer, those slots on under the water is the return line. So if my return is whats leaking then how do i get this skimmer out and check that?
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Re: Leak helpipe

    Hello, Any thoughts or help. HOW do i see where return line in this skimmer is leaking? its built into concrete. Any moderators can guide me?

  17. Back To Top    #17
    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    I don't have any experience with those type skimmers. One thing I noticed is that if you're runnig the bucket test like you show in the pics you may need to lower it a step and fill it almost to the top to get a more accurate reading.
    How much water are you losing in the pool each day now?

    I'd start by pulling the grating off the front of the skimmer and looking at the port closely.
    The pictures are a little close to tell exactly how everything is connected, but you have a lot of plumbing there.
    Where do those small pipes go?
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

  18. Back To Top    #18

    Re: Leak helpipe

    I thought the same thing with the bucket, thinking that the bucket shielded the wind and therefore and evaporation would be less in the bucket than the pool. But this got dispelled by the fact I left everything off for 2 days and the bucket level was equal to the pool level. So no doubt it was going down in the pool more than the bucket only when pump runs. Those other small pipes have valves that I have turned off and they go to a water feature that sprays over the surface of the pool. When they run it looks like rain and supposedly was to help cool the water in the hot summer. I did not see much of any cooling. The other small flexible pipes are just going through the booster pump driving my the cleaner. I run it 2 hours a day to stir things up and cleans the bottom of the pool. I see no water around any of these pipes. Its actually an awesome skimmer. You can see the sheeting action of the water forced out of those slots go all the way across the pool and curls up and across the surface of the pool back to the skimmer. When the pool is off everything looks terrible and hair and debris on the surface of the water, within one hour almost 90 percent of this stuff is gone and into the skimmer. in the very corners on the same side of the skimmer this debris might not make it back.

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Re: Leak helpipe

    Some more information. Since you told me from my information that the leak had to be from return lines and not suction side with the motor running. I did some more tests while checking the bucket. I took my pool cleaner off the connector on the wall, still lost 1/4 inch of water in pool after 5 hours of pump running time. I remembered here that on my pool cleaner there was a pressure relief thing right at that connector that was red colored couple of years ago it broke and I removed it and plugged it with a solid bolt. I thought it was to protect the pool cleaner and never really thought it did much.
    Anyway its on the connector that removes with the cleaner. Even with it off the pool lost the 1/4 inch. If you look at the pictures right after the booster pump going to this return line for the cleanr there is a blue valve and I closed it. So no water coming into that connector and return that whether the booster is on or not the regular pump pushes through. SO now with that valve closed I BELIEVE with todays test NO water loss! I will fill the pool up a little more and keep running this test to make sure. SO I must have damaged this line by removing the function of the pressure relief valve though i thought that was to protect the cleaner from too a high pressure. NOW assuming this line is the problem, how the heck am i to see where its leaking under ground and concrete and how would i seal it, is there a way? What do you think about all this Bama Rambler?

  20. Back To Top    #20
    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Leak helpipe

    It does sound like you've found the leak. Once you've confirmed that for a couple of days you'll know where to start looking for the leak.

    That cleaner pipe should go from the pad straight to the port in the pool. It may follow the trench with the other plumbing but there won't be any other valves etc in it.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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