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Thread: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions please

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    Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions please

    All, i am relatively new again to a pool. The previous owners werent too meticulous w keep up and maintenance, and their service co. was horrible. Anyway, the cartridges need replaced, but someone encouraged me to check out a DE filtering option.

    I have 2 Lab dogs, two kids, rock waterfalls that put all sorts of stuff on the pool floor. According to my buddy, a DE makes much more sense, and when i replace my current filters id be half way to paying for a new DE system.

    Im asking for your input and suggestions. This is a 10+ year plan. I take care of the pool myself, work my arse off during the week, then turn into sport-o-rama Dad on the weekends.

    Please share your thoughts. And i thank you for your time and info!
    30,000 gallons, 6 feet deep, IG, plaster, waterfalls, Pentair CCP 420 cartridge filters, Pentair Whisperflows 2.5 HP pumps, Pentair 320 inline feeder.

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    In my experience the DE filter will require less breakdown and cleaning than the cartridge. That might be helpful given your situation.
    24' round above ground, 13500 gallons, vinyl liner, 18" Sand Filter

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Sounds like you have a big load with quite a bit of dirt and debris. I would recommend sand.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Each kind of filter has different advantages and disadvantages, so that no one type is best for everyone. Usually it comes down to personal preference. There is an article in Pool School discussing some of the specific pros and cons of each kind of filter.

    Personally I like cartridge filters (but keep in mind that mine is larger than usual, which means little cleaning). But everyone has different preferences.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    I went from DE to cartridge. I have had the cartridge filter for almost a year and not once have I had to clean it. The pressure has not ever moved and the pressure coming out of the return jets is as strong as day 1. The DE filter was a little over sized and the new cartridge filter is bigger than the one I had. I have not had to clean the filter yet but I may give it a cleaning before the pool season starts.
    13,000 Plaster IG Pool approx
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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    How often are you having to clean it? (fyi..we recommend cleaning when the pressure goes up 25% from the "clean" pressure)

    If you are getting a lot of debris getting into the pool and having to clean it regularly, I too would think sand might be an option to look at if you typically do not have water restrictions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Pool for School
    According to my buddy, a DE makes much more sense
    Did he say why?
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    I have a DE filter, and while using DE for the first year, I cleaned the filter a couple of times. I noticed the grids did not get that clean with backwashing only, maybe 50% of the DE was removed. Cleaning the grids was a messy chore. I switched to fiber clear instead of using DE, and now the grids are much cleaner after backwashing and the filter doesn't have to be broken down to clean it. The big problem with using fiber clear is that the filter needs backwashing more often now. I will say it needs backwashing every couple of months now, and I do a tear down every 6 months. The fiber clear filters smaller debris than DE and I believe this is why I need to backwash more often, but I would not say the water is clearer. I always see fine particles in the water from being blown in from the wind.

    Another thing we ran into is we have restrictions on sending DE to the sewer, so I had to install a separation tank on the backwash line.

    From everything I've read the biggest mistake one can make when choosing a filter is choosing one that is too small. For the most part, the bigger the filter the less cleaning you will have to do. I suggest to clean the filter every year for seasonal pools and twice a year for year-round pools, even if the filter pressure never rises. Proper maintenance is the key for being happy with your filter performance.

    If water restrictions are not a problem and you have a place to easily backwash your filter I would probably choose a large sand filter. My 2 cents.
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    I have one of the largest cartridge filters on my 25k pool and have had it for 4 years now. I clean the filters twice a year and it usually takes me 3 hours for a good cleaning...I've also used the pool skimmer socks since day one. Filters still look like they have plenty of life in them too...
    Pool: 24k, 38' x 19' x 24' Free-form IG Gunite with 24' Infinity Edge and Cantilever coping, SGM Diamond Brite Super Blue Plaster,
    Filter: Hayward C5025 Swim Clear Cartridge Pool Filter - 525 Square Feet
    Main Pool Pump: Hayward TriStar Energy Efficient Pool Pump 1HP - (SP3210EE), Hayward Pool Cleaner Booster Pump - 6060
    Infinity Edge Catch Basin Pump: Hayward TriStar Energy Efficient Pool Pump 3HP - (SP3230EE)
    Automation: Aqua Plus 40K Gallon Chlorination and Control - PL-PLUS (SWG)

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Quote Originally Posted by duraleigh
    Sounds like you have a big load with quite a bit of dirt and debris. I would recommend sand.
    I agree with this.
    Built in 1957 44,000 gallon in-ground, Wet Edge Primera Stone in Sky Blue, Intelliflo VF Pump, 600 lb. Pentair Triton II TR-100 Sand Filter, CircuPool RG 60 Plus SWG, TF-100 test kit
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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    You may want to begin using skimmer socks if you are not already. This will trap a lot of this debris in the skimmer, at least the part that floats before it sinks. A pool cleaner would work on some of what is on the floor.

    Water restrictions could play a part in your choice. Backwashing will consume a lot more water than washing a cartridge, I think. I do use a lot of water when I wash the cartridge, but I do it about 2 maybe 3 times a year. And I do it in the back yard, moving from place to place so the water is not wasted.

    You may find that with new cartridges they will last longer between cleanings. I think my old cartridges were calcium covered perhaps. With the new set, and skimmer socks, I did not actually need to clean last Sept when I last did but winter was coming and so I cleaned the carts anyhow. Just to avoid having to do it in the cold. The pool runs all winter and it is still fine, 6 months later.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Thanks for the input and responses guys. To answer a couple of the questions, i am cleaning the cartridges about once a quarter during the off-season, and imagining having to do it once a month starting soon. These things are filthy when i need i clean them. Pressure is about 15 right after a clean, and as soon as it hits 25-30, the system pretty much stops cleaning anything all together.

    Sounds like DE or sand is the way to go. I guess ill start reading about both and make a decision based on what i find. Any tips on the best place to purchase?
    30,000 gallons, 6 feet deep, IG, plaster, waterfalls, Pentair CCP 420 cartridge filters, Pentair Whisperflows 2.5 HP pumps, Pentair 320 inline feeder.

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Any type of filter should be cleaned when the pressure goes up 20-25% of the clean pressure.

    Posted from my Droid with Tapatalk ... sorry if my response is short
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Skimmer socks will help alot with the dog hair. A cheap alternative I use is to get "big Girl" Knee high panty hose and slim them over the basket strainer. You can get a bunch for almost nothing if you look in the Family dollar type of stores.

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    You will be stunned by what you can catch in the skimmer with socks or knee-hi's. Such a cheap thing to try before you commit to new a new filter and deal with DE disposal issues or water restrictions.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

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    pwrstrk's Avatar
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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    I'll second the skimmer socks. They work great for pollen and anything else. Prefilter for the filter. Just keep an eye on them so they don't starve the pump of water.


    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Quote Originally Posted by ping
    I have a DE filter, and while using DE for the first year, I cleaned the filter a couple of times. I noticed the grids did not get that clean with backwashing only, maybe 50% of the DE was removed. Cleaning the grids was a messy chore. I switched to fiber clear instead of using DE, and now the grids are much cleaner after backwashing and the filter doesn't have to be broken down to clean it. The big problem with using fiber clear is that the filter needs backwashing more often now. I will say it needs backwashing every couple of months now, and I do a tear down every 6 months. The fiber clear filters smaller debris than DE and I believe this is why I need to backwash more often, but I would not say the water is clearer. I always see fine particles in the water from being blown in from the wind.
    What is "fiber clear"? Is that anything like Aquaperl or more like this?
    18'x4' AG Intex Ultra Frame, 6,700 gal., assembled new 2013; Mods: Hayward EC50C90 Perflex filter & 1 h.p. PowerFlo Matrix pump, Fiber Clear cellulose D.E. substitute, Hayward H100ID1 100,000 BTU NG heater, a pair of 2'x20' Sungrabber solar heaters via the original Intex 635T pump, grey Hydro Tools through-the-wall skimmer, Confer steps/ladder system & Cover Free chemical pool cover. The Summer of Mods!

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    It is equivalent to your 2nd link, the cellulose fiber.
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Quote Originally Posted by ping
    It is equivalent to your 2nd link, the cellulose fiber.
    Found this one too. Did you check with your filter manufacturer first to see if they recommended it or just go forward on your own? I have a new Hayward to install this summer and have been looking at DE alternatives but haven't contacted Hayward (or even looked through the manual that closely) yet.
    18'x4' AG Intex Ultra Frame, 6,700 gal., assembled new 2013; Mods: Hayward EC50C90 Perflex filter & 1 h.p. PowerFlo Matrix pump, Fiber Clear cellulose D.E. substitute, Hayward H100ID1 100,000 BTU NG heater, a pair of 2'x20' Sungrabber solar heaters via the original Intex 635T pump, grey Hydro Tools through-the-wall skimmer, Confer steps/ladder system & Cover Free chemical pool cover. The Summer of Mods!

  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    I never checked anything with the manufacturer, I just cleaned my filter thoroughly before using the fiber. Most of the alternatives are cellulose based and should be pretty much equivalent to each other. Your first link was volcanic based and is different than the others. I'm not sure what type of performance you would get from it.
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
    Hayward Aqua Rite T-15 SWCG, Jandy LXi 400k BTU NG heater, 350 sq.ft. of Sun Star solar panels, TF-100 Test Kit, Dolphin s300i Cleaner
    Test Kits . Pool Math . Chlorine/CYA Chart . The SLAM Process

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    Re: Cartridge vs D.Earth filter experience and opinions plea

    Quote Originally Posted by ping
    I never checked anything with the manufacturer, I just cleaned my filter thoroughly before using the fiber. Most of the alternatives are cellulose based and should be pretty much equivalent to each other. Your first link was volcanic based and is different than the others. I'm not sure what type of performance you would get from it.
    I took the time to contact Hayward about using alternatives like cellulose and Aquaperl and this was their response:

    "The Perflex DE filter is designed and tested for use with DE powder. We only recommend DE powder, but it is possible to use alternative filter media in the Perflex, which does not void the warranty necessarily."

    So now I just have to decide between volcanic (Aquaperl) and cellulose (ZeoFiber). Anybody have experience with both and a preference?
    18'x4' AG Intex Ultra Frame, 6,700 gal., assembled new 2013; Mods: Hayward EC50C90 Perflex filter & 1 h.p. PowerFlo Matrix pump, Fiber Clear cellulose D.E. substitute, Hayward H100ID1 100,000 BTU NG heater, a pair of 2'x20' Sungrabber solar heaters via the original Intex 635T pump, grey Hydro Tools through-the-wall skimmer, Confer steps/ladder system & Cover Free chemical pool cover. The Summer of Mods!

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