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Thread: SWG and pump filter pairing

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    SWG and pump filter pairing

    I am hoping someone can help me with choosing a saltwater chlorine generator and filter system for my above ground pool.
    The pool is 24'round and 52" deep (it is a Sharkline if that matters). I am wanting to use the Aquatrol chlorine generator. Does anyone know if I can use this SWG with either of the below pump and filter systems?

    Pentair OptiFlo pump with Clean & Clear cartridge filter - 2HP 2spd Pump & 200SF Filter
    Pentair Sand Dollar filter with Dynamo pump - 2HP 22" 2 spd Sand System (2.3 SqFt)

    A couple of my concerns are wheterher the inline fittings are compatible and if the pump's flow rate would be a factor.

    I really don't have a lot of expertise in this area and would greatly appreciate your input.

    Thanks
    24' / 52" sharkline AG with Hayward 24" Sand Filter, Hayward Matrix 1 HP / 2 speed pump, and Hayward Aquatrol SWG.

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    That swg will work with either of those systems, and the filters are a good size, BUT both of those pumps are way to big for that pool. A 1 hp 2-speed would be a good size. I'd try and get them to lower the size of the pump and keep the filter.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    The 2 HP Optiflo is actually an SPL rated pump so it has the same head curve as the Optiflo 1.5 HP uprated pump which is the same as an equivalent 1 HP full rated pump. It generally comes packaged with the filter and it is better to get the larger filter. Are these the combo units, pump and filter together?
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Christian's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    A side note, Sharkline will not honor the warranty if you install a salt system.

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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Yes, I was looking at a combo system from H2opoolproducts dot com. They are half the price of the local pool supply store. I apologize if this sounds ignorant; but if the optiflo 2 hp is basically a full rated 1 hp pump, would this still be too large of a pump?

    Also, thanks for the Sharkline warranty information. The pool is two-years old and is holding up fine, I don't expect to have any issues, except for the normal wear and tear. In your opinion, should i reconsider the SWG? Again, thanks for all your help.

    Daniel
    24' / 52" sharkline AG with Hayward 24" Sand Filter, Hayward Matrix 1 HP / 2 speed pump, and Hayward Aquatrol SWG.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Smaller pumps are more efficient. For a 24' round a 1/2 HP full rated pump would be plenty, and cost less to operate than any larger pump will. Ideally you want a two speed pump, which is effectively a much smaller pump when running on low speed, and you still have high speed for anything that might need it (vacuuming the pool tends to need high speed, and backwashing the filter often does as well). All of that said, small two speed pumps are very difficult to find in packages that include reasonable size filters, so sometimes it is worth getting the larger pump (at least in the short run, long run the additional electrical costs are small but they slowly add up).

    If you can find one, getting a two speed pump makes a larger difference than getting a smaller pump, so it might be worth investigating if there are any two speed pump combo packages, even if they have a "2 HP" pump.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Christian's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Honestly, I don't see any problem with running an SWG in your situation. I just wanted to make sure you were aware it invalidates the warranty before you do it.

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    The 2 HP Optiflo is actually not that big a pump. AG pumps are much smaller than their label HP would suggest. In fact, it is technically a smaller pump than a 1/2 HP Whisperflo (higher head curve). In this particular case, I think the price of the combo system trumps all else and going with separate items would cost a lot more up front and would not save you that much in energy costs to compensate. I would just go with the combo system, they are usually pretty good deals. They also come in two speed versions which I would recommend.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Thank you for all your input it has been very helpful. This board has been great and educational. I definitely don't know what the best equipment would be, but I can tell you what isn't the best... the pump and sand filter that came with my pool. I've been running a PMX 2 hp pump and sand filter system for the past two years, and it has been a real nightmare (I'll spare you the aggravating details). I believe I will replace everything with the Pentair OptiFlo pump with Clean & Clear cartridge filter - 2HP 2spd Pump & 200SF Filter, but run it on the low speed; along with the SWG. Hopefully this system will be more frieidly on the electric bill as well. The pool dealer told me the PMX system performed best on high, but thankfully I found this website.

    Just one last thought; I live in Oklahoma, do you think the climate has a bearings on cartridge vs sand filter?

    Again, thanks for everything.

    Daniel
    [attachment=0:38u2491p]photo-4.JPG[/attachment:38u2491p]
    Attached Images Attached Images
    24' / 52" sharkline AG with Hayward 24" Sand Filter, Hayward Matrix 1 HP / 2 speed pump, and Hayward Aquatrol SWG.

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Quote Originally Posted by dmmeek
    I've been running a PMX 2 hp pump and sand filter system for the past two years, and it has been a real nightmare (I'll spare you the aggravating details).
    I probably shouldn't scratch a scab...but, what went wrong? Is this the one you have?: http://www.columbiapoolproducts.com/deluxe/ It looks like a 2 speed pump (is it?) and I would guess the pump is uprated. The filter area appears to be 2.6 sq. ft...which is bigger than the filter that comes with the package you listed previously. I do not know anything about the brand, but the sizing does not look too bad...especially if it is a 2-speed. If the pump has been giving you trouble, maybe use you existing filter and just buy a new 2-speed pump?

    I guess I would like to know more about the problems you have had...maybe there are other angles to look at?
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Quote Originally Posted by dmmeek
    Just one last thought; I live in Oklahoma, do you think the climate has a bearings on cartridge vs sand filter?
    Yes, I think it can. Cartridges are great for areas like mine where we don't get a lot of rain and we don't close the pool for the winter so spring cleanup is not an issue. If you close a pool for the winter, opening in the spring can be a hassle with a cartridge filter (also DE) where as a sand filter is fairly easy to clean up a pool with algae. Also, if you get a lot of rain and need to lower the level of the pool consistently, then a sand filter could be ideal since you have extra water for back washing.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Thank you for your response. Yes, the photo is of the system I currently have installed. The first year, when it was under warranty, the dealer had to come out three times to work on the filter. The filter continually leaks, due to o-rings / seals that don't last or work. I eventually got them to replace the sand filter; however, last season it began to leak again. Also, it blow sand back into the pool. As for the pump, I have had to order to replacement lids because they keeping breaking along with the o-rings. The lids just don't seem to fit right. Even if I plug all the holes (no pressure) the pump lid doesn't seal properly. To sum it up, both pump and filter leak water, and sand blows back into my pool from the filter. I just found this Columbia system online for approx. $300. I guess you get what you pay for.

    I may reconsider the filter / pump combo. I do close the pool for the winter and we did get a green algae last summer. From the combo units, the 22" sand dollar seems to be the biggest filter available. I'm assuming this is equivalent to a 200 pound filter (why this matters, I don't know... it just sounds manlier I guess).

    Again, I sure appreciate you taking the time to respond to my post. I plan to use your pool chemistry method this summer, so hopefully we can enjoy the pool more.

    Daniel
    24' / 52" sharkline AG with Hayward 24" Sand Filter, Hayward Matrix 1 HP / 2 speed pump, and Hayward Aquatrol SWG.

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Just thought I would ask...it sounds like that equipment has been unreliable...now I can see why you want to start fresh.

    When it was working, what filter pressure did it run at?
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    I should now the answer to that question, but i really can't seem to remember. When I get home and look at the pressure valve, maybe I'll be albe to tell you the exact numbes. What I do remember is that it never went out of the zone, even when you could clearly feel the return jet pressure reducing. So I backwashed it based it every 2 to 3 weeks until the looking glass on the filter was clear. Also, I tried adding DE to the filter, and after 1 1/2 cups of DE, my pressure didn't increase. However, I never added more than 1 1/2 cups of DE; I figured that was more than adequate to help the filtering process.

    Also, I don't know if I have the same filter as the one in the Columbia link above. I do have the 2 hp / 2 speed pump. It's not a matching pair (no base for the unit). From the looks of the sand filter, it is too small. When the pool tech came out to replace it, there was only 3 empty bags of 40 lb sand in the trash box. One of my friends has a big Hayward sand filter on their ABG, and it looks massive compare to mine.

    Daniel
    24' / 52" sharkline AG with Hayward 24" Sand Filter, Hayward Matrix 1 HP / 2 speed pump, and Hayward Aquatrol SWG.

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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Just in case this is a factor, the installer hard-plumbed the pump and filter in with PVC. I am grateful for this, since it seems easier to deal with than plastic hoses and hose clamps. I am hopeful, I will be able to use the same fittings for the Pentair.
    24' / 52" sharkline AG with Hayward 24" Sand Filter, Hayward Matrix 1 HP / 2 speed pump, and Hayward Aquatrol SWG.

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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Okay, after searching all of the message boards I have found the following combination of pump and filter / SWG. By the way, this site is addictive

    * Hayward AquaTrol SWG
    * Hayward Pro-Series S244T 24-Inch Top-Mount Sand Filter with 1-1/2-Inch Vari-Flo Valve for In-ground Pools - $295
    * Hayward SP15922S Power-Flo Matrix Above-Ground Pump 2-Speed $240

    From what I've read on here, the above combination would be better than the Pentair Sand Dollar filter with Dynamo pump - 2HP 22" 2 spd Sand System (2.3 SqFt) I was originally going to go with.

    Does anyone know if that Hayward pump is a 1 HP full rated or max rated pump? If you think there is a better combination, please let me know.

    I'm ready and excited to open my pool this year. I've already received my Taylor test kit, just waiting for the warmer temp.

    Daniel
    24' / 52" sharkline AG with Hayward 24" Sand Filter, Hayward Matrix 1 HP / 2 speed pump, and Hayward Aquatrol SWG.

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Quote Originally Posted by dmmeek
    From what I've read on here, the above combination would be better than the Pentair Sand Dollar filter with Dynamo pump - 2HP 22" 2 spd Sand System (2.3 SqFt) I was originally going to go with.
    Yes better, it(filter and pump) is a very good combination, though more expensive I think?

    Quote Originally Posted by dmmeek
    Hayward SP15922S Power-Flo Matrix Above-Ground Pump 2-Speed $240
    I have this pump...it is uprated, but an excellent choice for your pool and that 24" filter.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: SWG and pump filter pairing

    Thanks everyone. I'll go with that Hayward combination and post on my results this summer.
    24' / 52" sharkline AG with Hayward 24" Sand Filter, Hayward Matrix 1 HP / 2 speed pump, and Hayward Aquatrol SWG.

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