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Thread: Bad R-011L?

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    gsheltonlhc's Avatar
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    Bad R-011L?

    Hello All, I have been lurking for a month now and I very much appreciate the site, science, and all the tips. I moved from northern CA to western AZ and of course we have a pool again. I'm told that a pool is more of a challenge here due to very high temps during the very long summer, and bad water to start with from Lake Havasu City, so I'm trying to get in front of it. I have my Taylor K-2006 test kit and am unable to perform the calcium hardness test. Even while trying to test my fill water. When adding the R12 it turns purple and you can see the thousands and thousands of pink "floaters" starting to settle to the bottom. I tried the Taylor instructions and added 6 drops of the titrant first but still purple, also diluted the fill water sample with an equal portion of my RO water (tested at zero Calcium hardness) and I get the same thing. I am wondering if I have a reagent problem. The Calcium Indicator Liquid (R-011L) is much "thicker" than the other reagents and when dropping it into the test tube it drops straight to the bottom and will not mix by swirling I have to put the top on and shake to get it to mix. I called Taylor and they said that there have been no other problems reported on this lot number (3125C) and that it is not uncommon for the R-011L to be thicker. The city states that our water contains .46 ppm of copper, and 6.72 ppb of lead, is this the issue?

    Do I have a reagent issue, or a fill water issue? Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
    17,000 gal. inground gunite 30'X15' w/7'X7' Spa. FNSPlus 60 DE, 2.0 HP WhisperFlo, MiniMax 400 heater. No SWG.
    19 year old pool but new to me 10/2012. Taylor K-2006 test kit.

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    Administrator Leebo's Avatar
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    Re: Bad R-011L?

    The CH test is one that is VERY touch and go without the speedstir. Make 100% sure you completely stir the reagents during the test, as it sounds like you're doing.

    Here's a quote from the Extended test directions.....may or may not be your answer....but worth a try.
    The sample may turn purple during the test, or go to blue for a moment and then turn back to red/pink. This is called a "fading endpoint" and is caused by interference from metal ions. If this happens, do the test again, but this time add five drops of R-0012 before adding any R-0010 or R-0011L. Remember to count the initial five drops in the total.

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    y_not's Avatar
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    Re: Bad R-011L?

    The R-011L reagent is much thicker than the others. It's a light syrup consistency. I recall the drops do sink to the bottom and are very hard to mix when doing it by hand. Swirling is not an option, you have to put a lid on it and shake it.

    With this test you can easily end up with a reading 100ppm higher than if you had used a speed stir.
    But the test is accurate enough when doing it by hand.
    My water tested @ 250ppm when I did it by hand, several times. Once I got the speed stir, it tested at 110ppm. Two times in a row.

    Have a look at these instructions for doing things by hand.
    adjusting-ta-trying-to-raise-ph-kids-wanna-swim-t52844.html#p434998
    Where Richard says: "Swirl it until it mixes, no blobs left.". Since you have tons of blobs, which I believe means very high calcium. Instead, cap it and shake away, stop once the blobs are gone.

    Also, if you could please put in your City+State in your profile. That'd be helpful for helping you best when you post.
    Directions are in the top link in PSchool.

    Posting a full set of test results would be great too. As for CYA in AZ, I would shoot for 50ppm and see how you do from there. Others that live down there can advise you better than this Oregonian can.
    Thanks for reading... - Tony
    Da' Pool: Intex 15'x42" 3284gal AGP EasySet (Inflatable Ring) - (Summer 2014: 27' round EW /w 6.5' deep end @ 22,500gal)
    Pump & Cart Mod: 1000gph Cart. 5ft² - 2 nylons, 24/7 OP. Traps bugs/bits, lasts longer/cleans easier = Happier Pool Owner!!
    The Bible for a "Trouble Free Pool" life = PoolSchool, the BBB method a TF100 test kit(Recommend Kits Compared). - Cleaning a Sand Filter
    Water looks like GLASS, if yours doesn't...SLAM IT! Feels nice and never been happier!!! :D

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    gsheltonlhc's Avatar
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    Re: Bad R-011L?

    Thanks for the link to more info on CH testing. I have been jumping around the different forums and searching multiple issues but had not seen that. It has a lot more info than what is included in the Taylor instructions.

    I will post full test results as soon as I have water back in the pool! My last test results were: FC 4.0, CC 0, Ph 7.2, Alk 125, and the pool store CH test was 900 so I come up with an SI of .20. They also told me the TDS was over 7500 and needed to be drained. Not much of this mattered as the CYA was over 200 so I need to drain anyway.

    The pool has not been properly maintained and has a number of other issues. The filter, pump, heater, etc. has a cover over it, about 5 inches above the top of the filter housing, that had been nailed down and painted. The paint is to the point where it needs a fresh coat so my guess is the cover has not been off the filter assemble for 5+ years or so. Thanks to this site I was able to remove the "Fingers/Grids, degrease, acid wash, and add new DE. Pressure at the filter dropped from 35 to 23 lbs and as an added benefit the spa now has a dramatically increased flow and aeration.

    The pool water had a blue green tint to it and you can see bluing on the pool walls so I'm going to acid wash it before the refill.

    Thanks again
    17,000 gal. inground gunite 30'X15' w/7'X7' Spa. FNSPlus 60 DE, 2.0 HP WhisperFlo, MiniMax 400 heater. No SWG.
    19 year old pool but new to me 10/2012. Taylor K-2006 test kit.

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    gsheltonlhc's Avatar
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    Re: Bad R-011L?

    Okay, the pool/spa has been drained, acid washed, and refilled. I added 35 oz of MA to bring the pH down to 7.4, then 24 oz of dichlor to bring FC to 4.5. TA is 150, and CH is 275. The link to detailed instructions on the CH test was appreciated and worked like a charm on the 1st attempt.

    I will run a full check again tonight and it sounds like I need to wait a week or so to check the CYA. I will continue to use dichlor for chlorination (9 lbs) and then check CYA that should bring me to around 30 CYA and then I will monitor closely until it approaches 50 and switch to liquid chlorine. As the pH rises I will continue to add MA and get the TA to acceptable levels.

    Sound about right?

    Thanks Again.
    17,000 gal. inground gunite 30'X15' w/7'X7' Spa. FNSPlus 60 DE, 2.0 HP WhisperFlo, MiniMax 400 heater. No SWG.
    19 year old pool but new to me 10/2012. Taylor K-2006 test kit.

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