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Thread: TA way out of whack

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    TA way out of whack

    my TA is 220, yet PH 7.4, FC 4, CYA is high 120, CH 230, 10k gallon in ground fiberglass pool, had been use BBB method for past few months, and I used cholrine granules 3 times in past 2 months as FC levels dropped below 1.5, 2-3 oz at a time just to spike it back up, unusal warmer weather burning off bleach quickly
    Also I was using roman fountains I have in pool, jets on, ran for 7 hrs, went checked on it and water was all milky colored, is that just alot of air being added to water, it cleared in about 45 min after I turned off fountains and just ran jets, pump, filter. New filters added this MArch and checked, soaked and cleaned just before labor day

    I believe I need to drain about 60-70% of water to get CYA lowered,

    Also top and second step into pool are discolored to tan tint partially both on same side, and floating thermometer has a sticky light brown residue on submerged end, water is very clear I've used some algecide last 4 weeks, but no change.

    Hate going to pool store, as been fooled before, hopefully some of you guys have some answers. thank you
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: TA way out of whack

    Are those tests from you own test kit?
    Why did you use the granuals to rasie the FC instead of just more bleach? Or, maybe I should confirm, what are you using to add your FC daily?

    You are correct that the CYA is the first priorty ... in fact TA is basically the last thing to worry about and many times as long as you keep the pH in the correct range, the TA will eventually sort itself out. To actively lower the TA, see the article in Pool School.

    BTW, with a CYA over 100ppm, you FC should never be below 7ppm ... actually higher if you are > 100ppm ... or you are asking for algae to start. How did you get that reading since the test goes to 100? ... if the test read over 100, you should redo the test using 50/50 mix of pool and tap water and then double the reading. It may turn out the you are WAY above 120ppm of CYA which may require a lot more water change.

    Have you even had the water tested for metals? How did you fill the pool? The tan could be metal staining.
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  3. Back To Top    #3

    Re: TA way out of whack

    yes Taylor FAS-DPD K2006 kit, being new to BBB method, I didn't have enough bleach on hand, so had used the granules a few times to bring up FC, FC has been steady 4-5 for past 2 weeks, PH 7.4 sometimes going lower to 7 in same time frame, just TA is/has been high and I don't want to add a acid, as PH has been ok- good range, I'll bring the FC up to 7-8 at least, however is that still safe to swim in that high of FC? Now I have enough bleach to wash entire streets whites 10 times and use it to bring up FC levels, the little bit of pucks and granules just sitting in shed

    The milky water color while water is churning from fountains being on, is that just air, had been told it's fine just has alot of air in it?? by pool store clowns

    Guess I'll be Borrowing a sump pump , to drain pool around three quarters , even if my CYA is 100 or 200 it's only way to lower CYA that I'm aware of

    Yes in March this yr, pool store said water was ok, metals level was good. but now I don't believe them , I'll try a Vitamin C tablet test, I did rub a 3" puck over stain yesterday, I could see stain getting lighter, but not gone, it seemed as I rubbed stain it would cover back up, I could spell my name in stain, but would disappear, stain is lighter in color though. Plus still plenty of water in pool, stairs are submerged, the Vit C tab test do I need to drain pool to expose steps that are stained?

    thanks for your help
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: TA way out of whack

    You can do the vitamin c test under water.

    What chemical was the powder chlorine you used? It was either adding CYA or CH to the water ... guessing it was dichlor due to the high CYA levels.

    Water is safe to swim in up to shock value for your CYA, which in your case is above 30ppm FC if I recall the CYA/FC chart in Pool School correctly.

    The CYA buffers the FC, so at 8ppm with the high CYA, there its actually less active chlorine than you would find in a public pool with a FC of 2ppm and no CYA.

    Posted from my Droid with Tapatalk ... sorry if my response is short
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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  5. Back To Top    #5

    Re: TA way out of whack

    yes dichlor, ok I'll get it up when I get home tonight, draining pool this weekend and try again from looks of it
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

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    UnderWaterVanya's Avatar
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    Re: TA way out of whack

    Quote Originally Posted by jst81
    my TA is 220, yet PH 7.4, FC 4, CYA is high 120, CH 230, 10k gallon in ground fiberglass pool, had been use BBB method for past few months, and I used cholrine granules 3 times in past 2 months as FC levels dropped below 1.5, 2-3 oz at a time just to spike it back up, unusal warmer weather burning off bleach quickly
    Also I was using roman fountains I have in pool, jets on, ran for 7 hrs, went checked on it and water was all milky colored, is that just alot of air being added to water, it cleared in about 45 min after I turned off fountains and just ran jets, pump, filter. New filters added this MArch and checked, soaked and cleaned just before labor day

    I believe I need to drain about 60-70% of water to get CYA lowered,
    CYA 120 = min FC of 9-10; Target of > 14.

    50% drain gets you to 60 CYA - a little high but serviceable.
    60% drain gets you to a 48 CYA - just within recommended levels.
    70% drain gets you to a 36 CYA - well within recommended levels.

    Be careful draining large amounts of water in case the ground water table is high - if it is you could float the pool which would destroy pipes and wreak the pool.


    Quote Originally Posted by jst81
    Also top and second step into pool are discolored to tan tint partially both on same side, and floating thermometer has a sticky light brown residue on submerged end, water is very clear I've used some algecide last 4 weeks, but no change.

    Hate going to pool store, as been fooled before, hopefully some of you guys have some answers. thank you
    Fountains could have stirred up dead algae as well as dumped air - was there any residue on the floor of the pool after this?

    Brown residue makes me think algae but maybe not - other posts in the thread direct you to a vitamin c test - you can also use a trichlor puck to test - if the trichlor reduces the stain it's likely organic (algae) rather than metals.
    Inlaws Pool Boy since June 14th 2012, Pool built ~ 2003, In-Ground, 16'x32'
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    Re: TA way out of whack

    thanks, the puck test, was odd, I could basically write my name in brown spot, but then within moments if faded back to brown, although it looked lighter, today it looks the same as before puck test,
    no visible residue on floor but did take 30-45 min for water to clear and had sweeper wrking as well
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: TA way out of whack

    I am guessing you were seeing the puck writing like chalk on the pool and then the powder dissolving into the water.

    Have you tried the vitamin C yet?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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  9. Back To Top    #9

    Re: TA way out of whack

    correct, need to get the Vit C tablets, thought I had some in house, of course all gone
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

  10. Back To Top    #10

    Re: TA way out of whack

    Quote Originally Posted by jst81
    correct, need to get the Vit C tablets, thought I had some in house, of course all gone

    so just did vit c test, stain did nothing, so what now? I'm going to drain pool to 70% because of CYA Friday , whats best for startup like this, actual liquid chlorine or just bleach or combination of those 2
    .
    Plus get ph in line would be second

    last time i did drain, used "Yellow Out or Yellow Gone" is that a waste of $$
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

  11. Back To Top    #11

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    Re: TA way out of whack

    No difference between bleach or liquid chlorine other than concentration.
    Built in 1957 44,000 gallon in-ground, Wet Edge Primera Stone in Sky Blue, Intelliflo VF Pump, 600 lb. Pentair Triton II TR-100 Sand Filter, CircuPool RG 60 Plus SWG, TF-100 test kit
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: TA way out of whack

    And no point adding any algaecide ... just stick with the chlorine.

    So did the trichlor actually fade the stain a bit or not?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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  13. Back To Top    #13

    Re: TA way out of whack

    about how much salt does liquid chlorine add , like using dichlor 1ppm , CYA was .60 added for every 1ppm of dichlor added, thanks pool store!
    just concerned my TDS will jump up after drain/refill

    and bleach has no salt? am I correct just 6% compared to 12% LC, so double bleach
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

  14. Back To Top    #14

    Re: TA way out of whack

    yes the puck was like writing with chalk, but faded quickly and stain came back, should I try maybe more than one tablet? like a handful and see what happens

    I was asking after drain/refill is using yellow out was ok, with liquid chlorine,, last time I did drain, used it and dichlor, worked well
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

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    Re: TA way out of whack

    poolcalculator.com will tell you how much salt adding bleach will add. But keep in mind, ANY chlorine product is going to add salt - the pool store won't tell you that part. Besides, it would take forever for you to get to the salt levels I have my salt pool at, it's not really something to worry about.

    Right, 12% is just twice-as-strong bleach.

    Adding more tablets and dichlor are going to continue adding CYA to your pool. You are already way too high at 120.
    Built in 1957 44,000 gallon in-ground, Wet Edge Primera Stone in Sky Blue, Intelliflo VF Pump, 600 lb. Pentair Triton II TR-100 Sand Filter, CircuPool RG 60 Plus SWG, TF-100 test kit
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: TA way out of whack

    I have never done these tests, but ... how long did you leave the trichlor puck and the vitamin C sitting on the stain? I think it can take a few minutes.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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  17. Back To Top    #17

    Re: TA way out of whack

    We always had good luck with a magic eraser on our fiberglass pool. That's what we cleaned the waterline with. Try that on your stain.
    Blaine

    50' x 22' 27k gal shotcrete freeform, 2hp 2 sp Pentair Whisperflo, Pool Pilot RC-52 SWCG, Pentair TR 100 sand filter, Polaris 280, 2 Pentair Intellibrite LED lights with controller, french gray plaster, Butterfield U-20 "smoke"integral colored salt finish concrete cantilever deck on one side, flagstone coping on the other.

    My pool build:
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  18. Back To Top    #18

    Re: TA way out of whack

    puck about 5-7 min , vit c tablet 1-2 min, I'll try longer with vit c,, and I'll try majic eraser as well, works great on stove top also, I'm done with pucks, granules, pool stores, my god soemthing different every time they speak and none say same thing, like throwing darts in the dark

    thanks for help, might be here Sat again after pool fills
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Re: TA way out of whack

    vit c left on 4-5 hrs did nothing, so what will get rid stain, fiberglass pool
    Intex 16' x 48" Ultra Frame Pool 5K Gallons, Intex Krystal Clear Sand Filter Pump 14" Saltwater System Model CS15110, TF-100XL.

  20. Back To Top    #20

    Re: TA way out of whack

    Did you try magic eraser yet? If not that, soft scrub with bleach was rated the best stain remover on fiberglass boats. Don't know how that would work on an underwater stain...
    Blaine

    50' x 22' 27k gal shotcrete freeform, 2hp 2 sp Pentair Whisperflo, Pool Pilot RC-52 SWCG, Pentair TR 100 sand filter, Polaris 280, 2 Pentair Intellibrite LED lights with controller, french gray plaster, Butterfield U-20 "smoke"integral colored salt finish concrete cantilever deck on one side, flagstone coping on the other.

    My pool build:
    osage-hills-pool-build-t50526.html

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