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Thread: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

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    SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    I have a couple questions about the Aqua Rite system. We haven't used the system yet, but are planning on starting it up within the next couple weeks.

    1. Looking at the Aqua Rite installation manual, the plumbing section indicates that there must be at least a 12" straight pipe run before the flow switch. I'm wondering about the location of mine, since it looks to be attached directly to the return from the heater. Can somebody comment on the location?

    2. The manual also mentions 4 possible ways to install the system. I am curious about this part:

    For pool/spa combination systems with spillover, use configurations #2 or #3 above to allow chlorination of both the pool and spa during spillover but preventing overchlorination when operating the spa only.
    We have a spillover from our spa that is spilling over constantly when the pump is running, since we leave the valve for the spa's footjets open all the time. Would that indicate that we should use one of the two suggested configurations (#2, #3) as shown in the image below?

    Thanks!

    [attachment=0:23ti1gyq]equipment pad.JPG[/attachment:23ti1gyq]
    [attachment=1:23ti1gyq]Aqua Rite.jpg[/attachment:23ti1gyq]
    Attached Images Attached Images
    ~8k gallon IG Pebble Sheen pool with spa. Hayward EcoStar variable speed pump. Hayward SwimClear cartridge filter C3030, 325sqft. Hayward Universal H-Series Low NOx heater 250k BTU. Hayward Aqua Rite SWCG.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    That flow switch location is a little questionable to me, but I do not know how turbulent the flow leaving the heater is. If you have high enough flow rate, then the switch will likely close anyway and not matter. After you start up the pump you will know if that location is a problem if you get the "No Flow" light.

    I would also agree that option 2 or 3 would be preferred so that the FC was not building up when in spa only mode. But you have 3 returns that appear to go back to the pool, so not sure which you would use that would always have sufficient flow ... so that may not work either. You can always just turn the SWG off when you use the spa ... although if you do not run it for a long time, the FC may not build up too much anyway.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    My builder has offered to modify the configuration to my liking, so now the question is, what configuration do I want/need?

    I thought the manual was pretty clear with its recommended configurations, but my builder is suggesting to keep configuration #1, even though I have a pool/spa combination with spillover (this is what I have, right? My spa spills over into my pool when running in pool mode, but not in spa mode). His concern is having too little chlorine after an extended period of time, which I suppose is understandable, but seems to be opposite of the approach from the Hayward Aqua Rite manual.

    So I guess I have a few questions:

    1. What configuration should I use?
    2. If I use configuration #2 or #3, am I at risk of having too little chlorine, and how long would that generally take?
    3. Bonus question... If his concern is too little chlorine with configuration #2 and #3, how is that any different than what many people probably have operating currently with the BBB method? What's the standard operating procedure for your spa if there is no continuous chlorine being introduced when in spa mode?
    ~8k gallon IG Pebble Sheen pool with spa. Hayward EcoStar variable speed pump. Hayward SwimClear cartridge filter C3030, 325sqft. Hayward Universal H-Series Low NOx heater 250k BTU. Hayward Aqua Rite SWCG.

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    How long, and how many people, do you think will be using the spa in "spa only" mode?
    If it's a fairly long time and/or a lot of people then #1 is the way to go. However, if it's a short time and/or only one or two people then I'd suggest 2 or 3.

    Unless, you have an automation system that dials back the swg when in spa mode. In that case #1 is the way to plumb it.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    I don't really have a definitive answer yet for how I will use the spa. We've only had it a couple weeks now, but so far, our use has varied widely.

    For people who manually chlorinate their pool, how do they handle this situation?
    ~8k gallon IG Pebble Sheen pool with spa. Hayward EcoStar variable speed pump. Hayward SwimClear cartridge filter C3030, 325sqft. Hayward Universal H-Series Low NOx heater 250k BTU. Hayward Aqua Rite SWCG.

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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    So after a few more hours of searching and reading, it seems that my question regarding the flow switch location of the SWCG has been answered a few times on this forum already:

    1. Installation Location of SWG Cell

    2. Where to install SWG on pool/spa combo. Schematic included

    3. error in spa overflow plumbing. Should I correct?

    4. Correct or incorrect SWG cell installation?

    5. SWCG Install

    6. want to install Pool Pilot -- where do I put it?

    7. SWG to Spa or not?

    8. Install questions

    From what I've read now, the general consensus is to install the flow switch in the pool return line if you do not have an automated control system that turns the SWCG down when in spa mode.

    So my question is related to my previous post (which maybe this is better suited for the spa forum?... but still trying to find the answer there):

    With regards to human safety, is high chlorine or lack of chlorine in the spa more of a concern. I can guess from the above recommendations, but still curious as to how you keep chlorine levels high enough in the spa for a few hour session with multiple people getting in and out.

    Scenarios

    a) Let's say I remembered to turn down the SWCG every time I used the spa, is the SWCG going to be beneficial in this situation?

    b) What if the SWCG is off when in spa mode. The chlorine level drops to zero after an extended session and people are still in the spa. How big a concern is this? The water will be circulated back to the pool through the spillover after the spa session is over.

    c) Am I worrying too much about this ?
    ~8k gallon IG Pebble Sheen pool with spa. Hayward EcoStar variable speed pump. Hayward SwimClear cartridge filter C3030, 325sqft. Hayward Universal H-Series Low NOx heater 250k BTU. Hayward Aqua Rite SWCG.

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    Part of that depends on what your CYA is. If you have 70 ppm CYA as is normal in an swg pool, then it can get pretty high before it's a real concern. Up to 28 is safe to be in with a CYA of 70 so the swg could run a while before it got that high.

    If you remembered to turn it down every time then it would definitely be beneficial and would be great to have it feeding the spa.

    If the FC drops to zero then the spa wouldn't be sanitized and you'd be open to person to person transmission. This is especially a problem in a small body of water like a spa. And if it's heated it's even more of a problem.

    You could always test and manually dose it after a while of use but that's a bit of a problem itself.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    This is interesting as I have a Jandy Aquapure and the flow switch is attached to the cell. My system is set up like configuration 1, but it could be set up as configuration 3. I don't seem to have a problem generating too much chlorine while in spa mode. I would be more concerned about running out of chlorine while in spa mode if it was configured like 3.

    I have never turned down the % while in spa mode, and I believe Jandy would not expect anyone to turn down the % while in spa mode. To me it is safer with a little too much chlorine than too little while I'm right next to a few people in 102 degree water.

    I myself would install it using configuration 1.
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    I would choose #1 too. I am not 100% but I believe the AquaRite also has a pool and spa setting like my Aqualogic so you can set them separately to avoid over chlorination. However, the spa generally needs more chlorine anyway because of the bather to gallon ratio is much higher.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    Thanks for feedback. I'm still trying to figure all of this out. So if the pump is already running, when I switch over into spa mode then turn down the SWCG percentage, how do I know when SWCG will start generating chlorine (I could look at the status lights and see when it is generating, just curious about how it works internally)?

    I have read somewhere that the Aqua Rite either has 100 or 120 minute run cycles, so for those that didn't notice any over-chlorination, I suppose it's possible they could have just timed it in the off-cycle?

    So if I turn the SWCG down to 10%, worst case scenario is that the SWCG doesn't turn on for 90 or 108 minutes (depending on the 100 or 120 minute cycle)? Is my logic correct on the SWCG run times?
    ~8k gallon IG Pebble Sheen pool with spa. Hayward EcoStar variable speed pump. Hayward SwimClear cartridge filter C3030, 325sqft. Hayward Universal H-Series Low NOx heater 250k BTU. Hayward Aqua Rite SWCG.

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    Yes, that is correct although I believe there is also a way to reset the unit so it restarts the cycle. I think it is the + button in the diagnostics menu like it is for the AquaLogic.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    I looked at my Aqua Rite system, and it has no buttons. There is only an on/off switch (actually off/auto/super chlorinate) and a dial.

    I called Hayward technical support to get more information on how the Aqua Rite worked internally, and they informed me that the Aqua Rite has a 180 minute cycle. If I turn down the percentage, the current cycle will be interrupted and a new cycle will begin, thus it will start generating chlorine immediately for the length of time equal to the percentage of that new 3 hour period.

    Edit: This information seems inaccurate, since I've read in multiple places elsewhere the cycle time is 100 minutes. I'll try to verify this information with Hayward tomorrow.
    ~8k gallon IG Pebble Sheen pool with spa. Hayward EcoStar variable speed pump. Hayward SwimClear cartridge filter C3030, 325sqft. Hayward Universal H-Series Low NOx heater 250k BTU. Hayward Aqua Rite SWCG.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    Wow a 3 hours period is longer than I would have expected. Although does that mean it comes on for the % setting and then off until 3 hours is up?

    That would mean for a 50% setting:
    Pump on for 4.5 hours = a generating time of 3 hours (on 1.5 off 1.5 on 1.5)
    Pump on for 6 hours = a generating time of 3 hours (on 1.5 off 1.5 on 1.5 off 1.5)

    Same amount of chlorine but 1.5 hour different pump run time. That makes it tricky to say if you needed a little more chlorine to bump up the pump run time, because that may not actually get you more chlorine. Interesting ....
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    It seemed long to me too. I'm fairly sure I heard her accurately, since we discussed the fact that it would run for a period of time, then wait until the 3 hour cycle is over to run again. I do question the accuracy of this information, since I've read other non-official information that mentioned a 100 minute cycle.
    ~8k gallon IG Pebble Sheen pool with spa. Hayward EcoStar variable speed pump. Hayward SwimClear cartridge filter C3030, 325sqft. Hayward Universal H-Series Low NOx heater 250k BTU. Hayward Aqua Rite SWCG.

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    Time it yourself. Set it to 1% and see how long it stays on.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: SWG Plumbing - Flow Switch Location

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985
    Time it yourself. Set it to 1% and see how long it stays on.
    I wish I could . My SWCG is installed, but has not been turned on yet. Maybe another member can chime in here. We're just nearing the 30 day mark and plan on dumping in the salt and turning on the SWCG soon.
    ~8k gallon IG Pebble Sheen pool with spa. Hayward EcoStar variable speed pump. Hayward SwimClear cartridge filter C3030, 325sqft. Hayward Universal H-Series Low NOx heater 250k BTU. Hayward Aqua Rite SWCG.

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