Any harm in using TSP in bathtub to soak the filters

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Dixit

0
Jul 16, 2012
123
Duluth, GA (ATL)
I have a Jandy CL580 and it has 4 large Filter Cartridges that are 7" in diameter and 33" tall. I cant find a single trash can or something similar to basically be able to put these in to let them soak in a TSP solution. Most of the round trash cans are only 31-32" tall. My filters are 33" tall and Im thinking I need something in the 34" height at least.

So I was thinking is there any harm say in putting two flat in a bath tub and fill it up about 8" and put the TSP in there based on how much I need (1cup per 5gal). Then put the other two in another tub. Cant put all 4 in one tub because 4 puts the the height in a tub like 14" and the tub has the overflow drain at 10" so that wont work. I would just use two tubs and let it soak in there overnight.

My only fear is the drain, I keep reading the TSP corrodes metal. But what about like say brass drains (what you going to find in most tubs)? Is it ok to let it soak in that overnight with TSP without it eatting up the brass drain? If that is highly NOT recommended to do in a tub then I almost have no choice as far as finding some trash bin or something to hold these tall filters.

Thanks
Dixit
 
Looking around the interweb, seems like TSP on brass is not actually a bad thing, many people use it to actually clean brass, so I guess the filters are getting a soak overnight in the tub! Hopefully this helps clean my filter.

Ive cleaned it using my Aquacomb and its as clean as its going to get, looks white from the outside, inside pleats are dark gray in many areas. Also given that I just took ownership of this house, the previous owner had the pool put in about 2006, these looks like they are probably the original Filter cartridges. Ive cleaned it twice in the past 2mo and this last time even after cleaning it the base pressure on starting it up is about 32psi which seems a bit bit to me.

So before I go shell out $200 for a set of 4 new ones, might as well let it soak in TSP, rinse it down, then put it back in the CL580 tank and see if that works. Ive seen many posts on here where people say it can reduce psi from 8-15psi if done properly and filters are cleaned properly. So hopefully I get that 8-15psi drop.

Dixit
 
Dixit said:
I have a Jandy CL580 and it has 4 large Filter Cartridges that are 7" in diameter and 33" tall. I cant find a single trash can or something similar to basically be able to put these in to let them soak in a TSP solution. Most of the round trash cans are only 31-32" tall.
Click to expand...
Allow the cartridge to soak for a while and then flip it over.
 
Ahhh, I gotcha. Well maybe next time (hopefully dont have to do this again as Im fairly diligent in keeping my filters clean, Doesnt bother me to open it up, spend about 15-20mins cleaning them, put it back in and usually in 1hr Im back in business. That Aquacomb works fairly well, initially I was skeptical about it, but a few folks on here have used it and like it so I said why not. I definitely like how it spreads the pleats and also has nice fine jets to spray into the pleats.

Dixit
 
I'm very eager to hear how this turns out for you. I always love hearing what chemical cleanings do for people. A fascination of mine! :-D

Not to mention it'd sure be nice to have a reliable way to get out that ugly brown in the middle of pleats.
I have read you can use MA too, you aren't using that fake "Alternative" "Safe" TSP are you?
If you are, I'd highly recommend getting real TSP.

Oh, curious, how are they filtering?

Not to hijack the thread or anything, but question for those in the know.
TSP contains phosphates, algae food. I know it has been said many times on the forum that phosphates don't matter to us BBB pool owners, as we'll be keeping the CL consistent and high enough for our CYA that the algae won't be able to talk hold in the 1st place, let alone get to where it'll feed of phosphates.
So with that said, I'm still curious as to how much residue will be left behind on cartridge filters in the filter media when doing a TSP soak, that is after rinsing well.

Just an idle curiosity. :)
 
Definitely not using a TSP alternative, using the real thing from company called SAVOGRAN.
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R ... reId=10051

How are they filtering up till now? Fine I believe. Pool is crystal clear and no issues besides the psi on the tank seems just too high for my comfort. When I first got the house it was at 35psi or so. I cleaned it fully the day after I got the house. It dropped to about 30-32 psi. I let it run for about 2mo that way, then last week cleaned it again (since I have a spa spillover into a spillage basin which is close to the lawn) cause the landscaper keeps getting grass into my spillage basin. When cleaning it after 2mo of initial clean, alot of grass and dirt came out. At that time filter tank was already showing 35psi again. So cleaned it up, put it back in, only got about a 2-3psi drop. So read up on TFP here and noticed that thread about cleaning the filter cartridges with a filter cleaning solution or TSP or dishwasher detergent.

So hoping this will get all the oils and what not off the pleats that normal cleaning is not going to do for me.

As far as MA, they say to only use it if you have signs of algae, calcium carbonate (residue from calcium hypochlorite), iron, or other minerals, which I see neither of. Also if you use MA before doing the TSP (or one of the three above methods to clean off all the oils) then putting MA on the filter is going to harden the oil and basically permanent attach itself to the filter fibers. So I dont intend on using MA or Chlorine as I dont have any of the issues it will help resolve.

I dont think phosphates is going to be an issue as I intend on rinsing these off after their overnight soaking. I will rinse it basically with my Aquacomb like Im doing a quick cleaning.

Im hoping this TSP clean gets me a double digit PSI drop. I have a flow meter on my 2" PVC pipe and it shows about 60gpm and I thinking it should be in the 80+ range looking at the pump specs. I think the incresed PSI is lowering flow rate.

If nothing happens after this and Im still at 30+psi on the tank gauge, I guess I lost out on $20 (cost of two boxes of TSP) and I will need to drop $200 for a new set of 4 cartridges.

Dixit
 
So just got finished pulling the cartridged out of my two tubs, the tub was a nice brown tint of water so I was initially excited and impressed that it broke down something and cleaned the cartridged. Took them outside and did a full clean, not just a rinse because when I opened some of the pleats I could see alot of mud like dirt deep in the pleats even though I thoroughly cleaned it. So went at it with my Aquacomb for about 30mins on the 4 cartridged, tried to get it as clean as possible.

Here is a picture of the pleat inside in one of the cartridges, most of them look like this but there is still a light brownish tint to them.
http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/8725/filterpleat.jpg

Here is the filters all cleaned/rinsed ready to go back in their home.
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/4706/cleanedfilters.jpg

Put them back in, tightened down the tank band clamp, fired up the pump and no leaks. PSI went from 32psi initially to only about 30psi. So wasnt thrilled about that. This psi is oviously higher since my main return is my Caretaker 99 floor cleaner heads. So I know its going to be higher a little. If I turn the waterfeature on instead as my return I get maybe 24psi at the tank.

GPM on the Caretaker as the return didnt change much, maybe went from 60 to 65gpm.

So......... I guess it was worth a shot cleaning/deep cleaning it. Probably time to shell out $200 for a new set. Jandy wants close to $400 for the set. But this universal replacement made by either Philter,Unicel,,Filbur, or Pleatco, only seems to be half of that. Its been said that Jandy doesnt make them anyways, one of the above companies actually makes it.

I guess the previous owner poorly cleaned them as I could tell from his neglect on many things on the pool equipment. I wouldnt be suprised if he barely cleaned it once a year or just took some quick method of MA or Bleech straight method and ended up solidifying the oils into the filter media.

Dixit
 
I would say that those cartridges look to be in excellent shape. Have you tried a new pressure guage? You can open the fancy Jandy housing and replace the guage with a readily available guage.
 

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Havent done that. Initially when I looked I thought this guage/air release assembly is going to be expensive, and it looks like its 50-70bucks. But you just mentioned a key thing there that its a normal pressure gauge inside that fancy housing, didnt know you could open that and actually replace it. Thats definitely good to know.

I will see if I can replace that. Could bad I guess. The gauge on the tank shows 30psi and the gauge on my Caretaker 99 5way valve (about 60-70ft away) only shows 15psi. But thought that is probably normal as the tank gauge is reading pressure at the tank and the caretaker valve is measuring psi after about 80ft of piping and there is probably that much loss (or at least I thought).

What is say normal pressure on something like this with a new set of filters? Just ballpark as I know each install is different and headfeet and bends can all factor into PSI at the tank.

Dixit
 
Dixit said:
Havent done that. Initially when I looked I thought this guage/air release assembly is going to be expensive, and it looks like its 50-70bucks. But you just mentioned a key thing there that its a normal pressure gauge inside that fancy housing, didnt know you could open that and actually replace it. Thats definitely good to know.

I will see if I can replace that. Could bad I guess. The gauge on the tank shows 30psi and the gauge on my Caretaker 99 5way valve (about 60-70ft away) only shows 15psi. But thought that is probably normal as the tank gauge is reading pressure at the tank and the caretaker valve is measuring psi after about 80ft of piping and there is probably that much loss (or at least I thought).

What is say normal pressure on something like this with a new set of filters? Just ballpark as I know each install is different and headfeet and bends can all factor into PSI at the tank.

Dixit
Click to expand...

Yes, we only discovered, accidentally, that the guage was replaceable (I was very irritated with charging a customer for that whole fancy thing)

FYI, you can also buy that little adaptor gizmo that connects the Jandy guage housing to the tank as a seperate part.

I typically see those big Jandy filters running clean at about 12-15 PSI, unless the pump is grossly oversized, or the plumbing after the filter is way undersized.
 
So replaced the gauge with a new 60psi one and the pressure didnt change much maybe 2psi. That could be just the difference in accuracy tolerance between the different guages. So with the water feature on and the floor cleaner on (which really both shouldnt be on since the floor cleaner at that point only gets 5-8psi, not even enough to get it to pop the head fully) I get about 22psi on the filter tank gauge. If I put it on just water feature I get about 24-25psi, floor cleaner alone its about 28-29psi.

Probably just going to go ahead tonight and order me a whole new set of 4 filter cartridges. Hopefully that gets it down to the 10-15psi range. If not...... then I guess I have a set I can leave on the side to assist in doing swaps, swap it out, clean the ones that just came out the tank, then let them sit ready for the next swap out.

Dixit
 
Happy you recommended that to me right before I bought the filter cartridge set.

Before I took out the cartridges wrote down some baselines, with the Caretaker 99 as my main return was getting about 30psi and my water flow gauge was showing about 60-65gpm. Open up the water feature (caretaker99 still running) tank PSI goes down to 24psi, water flow gauge goes to about 100gpm. On the water featuree alone it gets the tank pressure about 25-26psi, flow is still about the same, maybe tad less.

Took the filters out, and fired it back up. Pressure on caretaker99 only was about the same, actually higher and kept rising to about 35psi before I cut it off. Then ran the water feature alone and it was still 2-3psi higher then before, same with both running. Water flow meter was the same too.

So put them back in and determined Im probably fine. Maybe the piping and the elbows they got on here is causing the high backpressure on the tank side. I dont think I have any blockage because after putting it back together, with both the caretaker and water feature running I was probably getting about 100gpm. The pump is rated somewhere int he 100-120gpm depending on head loss. If there was a blockage I doubt Id be getting that level of water flow and the water feature was pushing out full tilt.

Dixit
 
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