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Thread: Floating Liner***Help***

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    Floating Liner***Help***

    Well I have a problem with my liner floating. I originally found one wrinkle in the liner after a heavy rain when I had unplugged the sump pump and forgot to plug it back in. At the time i could feel there was water behind the liner at the bottom of the deep end where it slopes 45 up to the steel wall. I hoped that it would drain but after a few weeks it seemed it would not. I knew I would have to suck out the water behind the liner but was so busy at work I have not had a chance to do it. The one wrinkle in the liner remained and I was going to pull it out with a plunger but again never got around to it. Since that time it has been pretty dry with almost no rain. I went from one wrinkle in the liner tight to the pool floor to now having the liner floating badly in the shallow and deep end in one day with no rain. I can feel water behind the liner almost up to the water line inside the pool. I have had to add more water to the pool this year than I remember adding last year so I think I have a leak in the liner somewhere. It is not leaking a lot maybe 1 inch a week or so. I thought it might have been evaporation as I like to keep the pool up to 90 and the outside air has cooled off at night and I can see a lot of steam coming off the pool. When I had the pool cooler and used the solar blanket there did not seem to be much water loss at all. I do have a sump pump keeping the under side of the pool void of water and when I look in the well point indeed the water level is below the deep end of the pool so it can't be ground water causing the liner to float. I am amazed that the level of the water behind the liner is as high as it is. I would have thought it would have found a way out between the steel panels or where the concrete and vermiculite meet the bottom of the steel wall. I know there is duct tape over the seams in the steel wall but I would not have thought it would be a water tight seal. Also I would have thought that the water would have drained through the bottom of the steel wall where the pool bottom meets the wall.
    The bottom of the pool is about 3 to 4 inches of concrete with about an inch or so of vermiculite on top. There is about a 6" ring beam of concrete around the bottom of the steel wall outside the pool. Maybe that it causing a water tight seal stoping the water from escaping.

    Here is what I thought of doing for a short term fix till the end of the season:
    Find leak and seal it.
    Remove some of the bead lock and suck the water out from behind the liner and push and pull out any remaining wrinkles in the liner.

    Now what I thought I would do to make sure this wouldn't happen again would be to drain the pool and pull back some of the liner in the deep end between where the liner is attached to the wall at the skimmer around to where it is attached to the light niche. Obviously I don't want to remove the screws from the light niche or the skimmer but this is my longest unobstructed span of liner. Then I thought I would climb in the pool and drill some 3/8 or 1/2 holes through the vermiculite and concrete around the radius of the deep end right where the bottom of the pool slopes 45 deg. up to the pool wall. My thinking is that since the liner did not touch that part of the floor the water would have a chance to drain out into the limestone beneath the pool and into the sump system and pumped out with the rest of the ground water. Also if ground water did come up and get behind the liner when the level dropped it would be able to drain.

    Would this work or is it a bad idea?
    Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks in advance,
    14X28 I/G steel wall hump back Kidney 3'-5', 30mil vinyl liner,92" spill over spa, 1hp Hayward Super 11-pool circ., 1 hp Hayward super 11- spa booster, Hayward Tristar waterfall pump through Jandy CS100 for three 24" Brilliant Wonders sheer descent waterfalls and two Jandy Laminar deck jets , Hayward Swim Clear Cartridge 425sqft, Hayward H-series 250,000 BTU N/G, Pro-logic PS8, T-Cell, Hayward Aqua Vac Robotic

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Pools of your design aren't usually watertite enough to hold water in the shell. Water behind the liner is usually due to high water table. Do you have a dry well near the pool?
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Thanks for the reply
    Yes there is a dry well and when I look in the well the water level is below the deep end of the pool. The back of the pool is about 2 to 2 1/2 feet out of the ground with a retaining wall. Also I have excavated the front side of the pool in a couple spots for footings for the deck i will be building. No water in those holes either at the time. A little bit now due to some much needed rain but that will quickly go down as the sump pump keeps pumping. I would not have though that it would/could hold water either. Certainly not to the level it is at behind the liner. That is higher than the level of the ground out the back of the pool and there is no water there.
    14X28 I/G steel wall hump back Kidney 3'-5', 30mil vinyl liner,92" spill over spa, 1hp Hayward Super 11-pool circ., 1 hp Hayward super 11- spa booster, Hayward Tristar waterfall pump through Jandy CS100 for three 24" Brilliant Wonders sheer descent waterfalls and two Jandy Laminar deck jets , Hayward Swim Clear Cartridge 425sqft, Hayward H-series 250,000 BTU N/G, Pro-logic PS8, T-Cell, Hayward Aqua Vac Robotic

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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Here are a couple pics of the liner
    14X28 I/G steel wall hump back Kidney 3'-5', 30mil vinyl liner,92" spill over spa, 1hp Hayward Super 11-pool circ., 1 hp Hayward super 11- spa booster, Hayward Tristar waterfall pump through Jandy CS100 for three 24" Brilliant Wonders sheer descent waterfalls and two Jandy Laminar deck jets , Hayward Swim Clear Cartridge 425sqft, Hayward H-series 250,000 BTU N/G, Pro-logic PS8, T-Cell, Hayward Aqua Vac Robotic

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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Here is a pic of the well point and the hole in the front of the pool for deck pier as you can see there is no water outside or under the pool.
    14X28 I/G steel wall hump back Kidney 3'-5', 30mil vinyl liner,92" spill over spa, 1hp Hayward Super 11-pool circ., 1 hp Hayward super 11- spa booster, Hayward Tristar waterfall pump through Jandy CS100 for three 24" Brilliant Wonders sheer descent waterfalls and two Jandy Laminar deck jets , Hayward Swim Clear Cartridge 425sqft, Hayward H-series 250,000 BTU N/G, Pro-logic PS8, T-Cell, Hayward Aqua Vac Robotic

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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Sounds like you have a leak. Could be plumbing related. Could be liner related. Could be hardware related.
    A leak in any of these, gone long enough will float a liner. If the water table behind the liner (inside shell) is as high as the water in the pool, its equalizing.

    Rain will only worsen the issue.

    Hope this helps. Good luck.
    American Leak Detection
    Tech I, II, CPO
    VP, Sr Tech
    Since 1994

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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Thanks for the reply,

    Would drilling some holes through the vermiculite and concrete floor under the liner allowing trapped water to drain into the limestone and sump system below the pool be a good idea?
    14X28 I/G steel wall hump back Kidney 3'-5', 30mil vinyl liner,92" spill over spa, 1hp Hayward Super 11-pool circ., 1 hp Hayward super 11- spa booster, Hayward Tristar waterfall pump through Jandy CS100 for three 24" Brilliant Wonders sheer descent waterfalls and two Jandy Laminar deck jets , Hayward Swim Clear Cartridge 425sqft, Hayward H-series 250,000 BTU N/G, Pro-logic PS8, T-Cell, Hayward Aqua Vac Robotic

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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Quote Originally Posted by Butcher
    Thanks for the reply,

    Would drilling some holes through the vermiculite and concrete floor under the liner allowing trapped water to drain into the limestone and sump system below the pool be a good idea?
    depending on the ground water level that could give the water easier access ?
    17,000 gal inground
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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Pool Spa Combo makes things more interesting. Does the spillover water run over the liner track when active? If so this is one source of water behind liner. When the wind blows against spillover and dirty filter will also cause a reduction in overflow volume, allowing water to penetrate the liner track......

    more thoughts....
    American Leak Detection
    Tech I, II, CPO
    VP, Sr Tech
    Since 1994

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    Re: Floating Liner***Help***

    Quote Originally Posted by LT3
    Pool Spa Combo makes things more interesting. Does the spillover water run over the liner track when active? If so this is one source of water behind liner. When the wind blows against spillover and dirty filter will also cause a reduction in overflow volume, allowing water to penetrate the liner track......

    more thoughts....
    Thanks LT3,
    I think you are correct about the spillover spa. The bottom of the spillway is supposed to have a decorative cover so you can't see up inside. I had not installed it and without it the water flows nicely into the pool. The night before the liner floated I installed that cover and it looks like the water was coming over the spillway and and back feeding on to the pool coping. I removed the cover and pumped the water out from behind the liner on Fri. Aug. 31 and since that time the liner seems to be staying put and shows no sign of floating. We are even having heavy rain today and everything looks fine and the sump pump is pumping full time. I will keep monitoring it everyday.
    14X28 I/G steel wall hump back Kidney 3'-5', 30mil vinyl liner,92" spill over spa, 1hp Hayward Super 11-pool circ., 1 hp Hayward super 11- spa booster, Hayward Tristar waterfall pump through Jandy CS100 for three 24" Brilliant Wonders sheer descent waterfalls and two Jandy Laminar deck jets , Hayward Swim Clear Cartridge 425sqft, Hayward H-series 250,000 BTU N/G, Pro-logic PS8, T-Cell, Hayward Aqua Vac Robotic

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