The pool industry hasn't acknowledged the effect CYA has on the active chlorine content. The 1-3 ppm recomendation was for a pool with zero CYA.
chlorinator off but CL remains high
- Thread starter myrddin
- Start date
Ok... Thanks for helping me... Soon as I get the kit I will try to get the results. I will also chk the pool agn today to see if my stats have changed... I did add baking soda as recommended...
- Jun 14, 2012
- 2,668
- Pool Size
- 13500
- Surface
- Vinyl
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool Edge-40
myrddin said:
OK - Take a deep breath. Repeat after me, "Test kits do not know jack about my pool if they don't test what they need to test"!
Now - do you feel better?
What's the CYA level in your pool? If you don't know - there is no way to know how high your Chlorine needs to be to remain effective and safe for you and anyone who you let swim in your pool.
Do you have a CYA level measurement? If not you need one - pool stores are notoriously inaccurate on this test and the type of chlorine you have been using (pucks) contributes a lot of CYA (too much) over time. If your pool is like most - you have too much CYA not too little - which means that you need more Chlorine than you know.
Here's a chart - it won't mean much without CYA data to base things on - but you can see that my pool with a CYA between 50 and 60 isn't going to be happy with 1-3ppm of Chlorine.
Can you get a test kit that will measure CYA? The best kit (for the money) is the TF100 but if you don't want that kit you can get a TF50 or Taylor K2006 or even a Wally World (HTH) 6 way kit - all of these measure CYA. The 6 way kit however will not help you if you need to shock or even if you need to measure high chlorine levels.
PS - Test strips are not respected much here. The lack of precision and repeatability is as bad or worse than pool store tests...
myrddin said:
Why did you add baking soda? I missed that recommendation.
If you are switching to bleach, then your TA was fine.
thanks for that info... Now I am one step closer to understanding... Sorry...
I guess I misunderstood, the pool store sold me the bal Pak 100 and I asked if it was the same as baking soda... The response was yes. So I added what was needed thinking it was still required. I am not going to do anything else till I get the tf100 kit, its on the way... Then I can start over.
I guess I misunderstood, the pool store sold me the bal Pak 100 and I asked if it was the same as baking soda... The response was yes. So I added what was needed thinking it was still required. I am not going to do anything else till I get the tf100 kit, its on the way... Then I can start over.
Got ya ... some crossed communication.
From this point forward, you should never add anything to your pool unless you are sure you know exactly what parameters it is going to affect. That is the key to this method ... understanding the chemistry and only adding what the pool needs based on accurate testing.
From this point forward, you should never add anything to your pool unless you are sure you know exactly what parameters it is going to affect. That is the key to this method ... understanding the chemistry and only adding what the pool needs based on accurate testing.
FYI: moved to the proper area for pool water balance... thanks for your help guys...
OK guys, I have my first test results... I may retest tomorrow but feel like I am close if not dead on:
PH 7.5
CL 5+
BR 10+
FC 8.5
CC 0.5
TC 9
TA 190
CH 260 (may repeat)
CYA 95 or 100 (this is an odd test, I drop into the tube till I see no sign of the black dot at all)
What do you think?
OK guys, I have my first test results... I may retest tomorrow but feel like I am close if not dead on:
PH 7.5
CL 5+
BR 10+
FC 8.5
CC 0.5
TC 9
TA 190
CH 260 (may repeat)
CYA 95 or 100 (this is an odd test, I drop into the tube till I see no sign of the black dot at all)
What do you think?
- Jun 14, 2012
- 2,668
- Pool Size
- 13500
- Surface
- Vinyl
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool Edge-40
myrddin said:OK guys, I have my first test results... I may retest tomorrow but feel like I am close if not dead on:
PH 7.5
CL 5+ Typically you don't test with the OTO test when you use the FAS-DPD
BR 10+ Unless you have bromine tabs in the pool this is not actually true. The same block test is used with different chemicals to test for Bromine - ignore this
FC 8.5
CC 0.5
TC 9 No need to post this - we can add the FC and CC next time.
TA 190 Eventually you will probably want to bring this down - not your first priority however.
CH 260 (may repeat)
CYA 95 or 100 (this is an odd test, I drop into the tube till I see no sign of the black dot at all) I assume this was nearly to the top? If so retest with half pool water and half tap water and multiply the result by 2. The test is less accurate close to 100. Chances are it could be over 100 but since you got a less than 100 result you may be correct.
So far other than the high CYA this is not bad. What's your water look like again? If it isn't perfect I would suggest shocking - if it's close to perfect then maybe just raising it to 15-20 and doing an overnight chlorine loss test would let you know if there's anything lurking. Forgive me if you already said how the water was - I have forgotten since I read this thread last.
To lower the CYA - you'll need to swap some water by draining and refilling. Have you measured your fill water yet to see what the CH and TA levels are? If the TA is < 190 then the drain and fill you do for CYA will help the TA also.
If you can do a 50% water change (don't know if this is advisable in your situation I don't recall the pool type and don't know if you face ground water table issues) then you will end up with around a 50 CYA which is more workable than the current level you have.
The water looks clear... And I think the water will drain out to the street same as rain water and such. I need to look at my valve on my filter... Cant remember which would pump the water out... I am guessing if I close the skimmer and put the valve on winter or whatever the setting is it will pump out??
Take the pucks out of the chlorinator, they are still dissolving, just slower.
I wonder whether you may want to limp along until the end of the season. If you can pass the Overnight test and then keep the chlorine level on target, that may work out if time is short for you there.
I wonder whether you may want to limp along until the end of the season. If you can pass the Overnight test and then keep the chlorine level on target, that may work out if time is short for you there.
I haven't added any pucks in about a week... but to be honest I haven't looked in the chlorinator to see if its empty... I will do that now and if it has anything I will remove it. I will have the pool open ill about mid October...
OK just went out... it had like 9-10 pucks in the feeder... looks like it has not done anything since I turned it off... so I removed them all and still have the feeder in the off position.
OK just went out... it had like 9-10 pucks in the feeder... looks like it has not done anything since I turned it off... so I removed them all and still have the feeder in the off position.
- Jun 14, 2012
- 2,668
- Pool Size
- 13500
- Surface
- Vinyl
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- CircuPool Edge-40
myrddin said:
Waste is the setting for dumping water - backwash also does this but with a different purpose. Winter is a closed position - don't turn on the pump in that position!
So today I should chk the chlorine only and comp it to yesterday right? Once I do that I will post the results. And I need to go find some liquid chlorine I think so I can add when needed.
I didn't really do the oclt thing right as I just now read it... I didn't chk it when it was dark, and I just not checked it and sun is up.
but:
FC = 7.5
CC = 0.5
So from yesterday morning to this morning it seems to have dropped 1.0.
What do you recommend, I can remove water or keep as is... I have the pucks out and Chlorinator off... I have not added anything to the water at all for at least 2 days.
but:
FC = 7.5
CC = 0.5
So from yesterday morning to this morning it seems to have dropped 1.0.
What do you recommend, I can remove water or keep as is... I have the pucks out and Chlorinator off... I have not added anything to the water at all for at least 2 days.
If you hadn't added any chlorine between, then you have effectively passed the oclt test.
If you are diligent about keeping you FC level up, 8 ppm minimum for normal FC (from poolcalculator.com and cya 100 ppm), then you may/should be able to survive until you winterize and drain. Use bleach/liquid chlorine to chlorinate so you don't add anymore cya this year.myrddin said:
The recommendation of chlorine between 1-3 does not take into account that you have too much stabilizer (CYA) in your water. The sanitizing effect of 1-3ppm FC is MUCH higher when your CYA is between 0-30ppm. At 100+ CYA, the FC you are measuring is in effect bound to CYA and is not available to sanitize.
You have to either follow the guidlines TFP recommends or the outdated pool industry standard. You are confused because the advice we follow is far different than what the pool store would recommend. With CYA at 100+, it is just plain too high, but you might be able to get through end of season by maintaining adequate FC of 12+ ppm. With CYA that high, your shock level is at least 30ppm +
You have to either follow the guidlines TFP recommends or the outdated pool industry standard. You are confused because the advice we follow is far different than what the pool store would recommend. With CYA at 100+, it is just plain too high, but you might be able to get through end of season by maintaining adequate FC of 12+ ppm. With CYA that high, your shock level is at least 30ppm +
You only go through the shock process when your pool requires it ... for example: CC > 0.5ppm, cloudy water, visible algae, high daily FC loss (verify that it is due to organics by performing the OCLT).