Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 25

Thread: I dont even know where to begin

  1. Back To Top    #1
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    I dont even know where to begin

    So I received my K-2006 today and tested my water. I have been reading pool school and switched to liquid shock 12.5% last Thursday and started the BBB
    I have not seen the pool store since...
    Here are my results and I dont even know where to begin..... Help Please!!!!!!!!!!

    FC .05 tested twice
    CC .05
    PH below 7.0 wasnt even close to the color on 7
    TA 130 with 25ml sample
    TA 125 with the 10 ml sample
    CH 350 did this twice..
    with CH both times the sample turned (clumpy) purple. not blue. the second time I added the 6 drops of R-0012 first (like book suggested) counted in total drops

    CYA was done twice and I didnt even get close to the 100 mark before the black dot disappeared from view. I had been using 3inch trichlor
    (pool store said my CYA was 35 almost 2 weeks ago and had me bump.... Shows what they dont know)

    So where do I begin... Should I put 12.5 % in the pool.. and to what level shock????
    Or do I need to get the PH up first ??
    Oh.. my deep end is 6.5 ft deep. Pool is only slightly cloudy. I can see both drains in the bottom

    Help Please
    Thank you
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  2. Back To Top    #2

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Posts
    4,052

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Start by figuring out how much CYA you have in the pool so you know how much water to drain. Mix your pool sample 50/50 with tap water and test again. I bet you are going to have to drain 50% of your water at least. Don't drain more than that at risk of damaging your pool.

    pH needs to be brought up for sure. But if you are going to drain first, don't waste chems if you are just going to put them out on the ground.

    CYA is where the pool store almost always gets it wrong.
    Built in 1957 44,000 gallon in-ground, Wet Edge Primera Stone in Sky Blue, Intelliflo VF Pump, 600 lb. Pentair Triton II TR-100 Sand Filter, CircuPool RG 60 Plus SWG, TF-100 test kit
    If TFP has helped you, please click to SUPPORT TFP!

  3. Back To Top    #3
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
    Posts
    37,389

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Your FC and CC levels also do not make sense. They should either be multiples of 0.5ppm (using a 10ml water sample, recommended) or 0.2ppm (using 25ml of water).
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

  4. Back To Top    #4

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Posts
    4,052

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    I assumed that's what he meant.

    While we are there, just do the 10ml sample test.
    Built in 1957 44,000 gallon in-ground, Wet Edge Primera Stone in Sky Blue, Intelliflo VF Pump, 600 lb. Pentair Triton II TR-100 Sand Filter, CircuPool RG 60 Plus SWG, TF-100 test kit
    If TFP has helped you, please click to SUPPORT TFP!

  5. Back To Top    #5
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Oh. yes. it was .5 not .05 sorry about that
    As for draining the pool. I dont know if I want to do that right now because it will only be open about 4 or 5 more weeks and then we will close for the winter. We would have to fill from our hose and we really have not gotten that much rain this summer. We had a hard time finding water when we opened it because no one wants to haul it around here anymore.
    Will leaving the cya that high be a problem over the winter. (I am still ticked at the pool store.. UGG>.. add more of this.. add more of that)
    I would rather wait and do it in the spring when we open.

    I did the test again twice (that sucker is hard to read) with 50/50 pool/well water
    I read once outside and once in.
    Standing straight up with my arms down in front so the tube was lower than waist high. Is this a good way to read it? I will search on that topic also.
    Both times It was at 80 when I couldnt see the black dot.. so that mean my 35 CYA (from pool store) is really 160??
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  6. Back To Top    #6
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
    Posts
    37,389

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Yup, sounds like you are around 160ppm on the CYA.

    Is your water clear now? If you want to limp through the rest of the year, according to the poolcalculator, your minimum FC level is 12ppm ... so you should maintain it ABOVE 12ppm at all times to avoid getting algae starting to grow. Shock level would be up in the 40ppm FC range.

    You can hope you get the magical CYA eating bacteria in your pool over the winter that converts the CYA to ammonia ... although then you have to get rid of the ammonia with a lot of chlorine.

    Path forward:
    1. Get your pH in the 7s
    2. Get the FC > 12ppm (unless you need to shock in which case you need to keep it up around 40ppm)
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

  7. Back To Top    #7
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Pool is just alittle cloudy. I can still see the drains in the 6.5 ft deep end..
    should I raise the PH first or just get the FC up.
    Right now I only have 1 76 oz box of Borax.. Should I put that in now and let it run for 30 mins or so before I add the bleach ?? Or should I put the bleach in first... then the borax.. and get a couple more boxes Wed. (If I am reading the pool calculator right I need 214 oz of Borax (with TA of 130 target 80) (borate 0)
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  8. Back To Top    #8
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Where do I get some of this "You can hope you get the magical CYA eating bacteria"
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  9. Back To Top    #9
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
    Posts
    37,389

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Quote Originally Posted by ajackson
    Where do I get some of this "You can hope you get the magical CYA eating bacteria"
    IDK, but if you could corner the market you might become rich.

    Well, you just reminded me of the other reason having high CYA and FC is bad. The pH test is not valid when the FC is > 10ppm.

    So you definitely want to adjust the pH first to 7.3ish and then get your FC up. The problem is going to be keeping the pH in range if you are maintain your FC > 12ppm as is needed for your CYA.

    Borax will have the largest affect on pH and a minor affect TA ... to lower the TA (as I think your post indicates) you would have to add muriatic acid. Ignore the TA and just focus on the pH and FC.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

  10. Back To Top    #10
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Ok. great. thanks for the advice.. I will add the 76 oz I have on hand.. wait awhile... add Bleach.. just to get the FC up until I get home from work tomorrow.
    chech PH and FC again.. add more borax.. then bump up the FC to 14
    Does this sound like a good plan for tonight ?
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  11. Back To Top    #11
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
    Posts
    37,389

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    As good as you can do while trying to maintain this high CYA level. May need to shoot even higher than 14ppm to be sure it does not drop below 12ppm.

    Likely a good idea would be to perform the OCLT to see if there is something living in the pool causing the cloudiness, then you know if you should follow the shock process.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

  12. Back To Top    #12
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Ok.. I will read up again on the OCLT.. Thank you again for getting me started..
    You all are Great.
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  13. Back To Top    #13

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    424

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    I have read of CYA going down some over the winter but not by 110. So, since you probably will need to change a lot of water in the spring, if i were you I would drain enough to bring it down to 100 per the pool calculator. This will make keeping your FC level a lot easier. Then in the spring you can get the CYA on down to 50.
    Larry in Texas

    Above ground 7,700 gallons, 19 inch sand filter ( 2 sq. ft.), Liquidator, and a WaterWay Hi-Flo Pump with an A.O. Smith 1 hp SF 1.0 motor.

  14. Back To Top    #14
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    I am back.. I have another question. I added the Box of Borax I had last night 9getting more today)
    waited 1 hour then bumped my FC up to 18
    this morning the pool was so cloudy I could not see the bottom of the 3ft end. Is this normal when adding Borax
    (dissolved in 5 gallon bucket of water)
    Before I added the borax I could see the drains in the 6.5 deep end
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  15. Back To Top    #15

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    424

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Others may have a different experience, but in my experience the answer is no. Did you do the overnight test? I suspect the cloudiness and borax are unrelated. I believe the cloudiness is a progression from the little cloudiness you were experiencing. What is your FC level this morning? Have you read the shock process in pool school? Please study it and follow it. I think you are on the edge of going green. With your high CYA level you are going to use an enormous amount of chlorine to get clear and stay clear. I know you don't want to drain and refill, but I believe you will be much happier and it will be cheaper to go ahead and get your CYA down to 50. Good luck.
    Larry in Texas

    Above ground 7,700 gallons, 19 inch sand filter ( 2 sq. ft.), Liquidator, and a WaterWay Hi-Flo Pump with an A.O. Smith 1 hp SF 1.0 motor.

  16. Back To Top    #16
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    I did check the FC this morning at 5:30am it was sitting at FC 9 last night 18
    I didnt know if the Borax, Low PH and high CYA would affect the "true" FC level... or if I really am on the verge of having a bigger issue..
    Thanks for the advice..
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  17. Back To Top    #17
    Administrator Leebo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Eastern Ohio
    Posts
    6,601

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    95% of the time cloudy water mean water that has something living in it. You are on the verge of a green pool. Can you post a current set of test results? A one time shock will not work. If your water is cloudy you need to bring the pool to shock level and hold it there until......
    1. Cc is 0.5 or less
    2. Lose 1 FC overnight
    3. Water is clear

    You do not pass all 3....you need to shock the pool.

  18. Back To Top    #18

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    San Antonio
    Posts
    424

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    If I understand correctly you added the CL last night either after dark or shortly before and brought the FC to 18 and then before daylight this morning you had an FC of 9, thus loosing 9 during the dark. You loose FC for only three reasons 1. it is killing something, 2. Sunlight, and 3. lower FC water is added. The only one that applies is killing things. This is why your pool is more cloudy and will get worse unless you do something. Using your FC & CYA numbers 14,500 gallons in the pool calculator for maintaining a clear pool you need an FC level of 12-19 and for shock an FC of 35. To get to 35 from 9 you need to add over 6 gallons of Bleach or 3 gal of 12.5% liquid chlorine. And it is not a one time add, as pool school teaches shocking is a process that may take awhile and use a lot of chlorine. Because your pool has not gone green by acting promptly you may be able to get back to clear in a few days if you can keep your FC level at 35 (this usually means adding chlorine every few hours at first.) I don't know what your time and money constraints are, but to me it would be costing way too much money in chlorine and way too much time versus draining and refilling. By the way, the pool calculator states to get to a CYA of 50 you need to change out 69% of your water. If you decide to drain and refill it is not a good idea to drain more than 50% at a time, so I would suggest you do it in thirds. That is drain a third, refill, then drain a third and refill and then drain another third and refill.
    Larry in Texas

    Above ground 7,700 gallons, 19 inch sand filter ( 2 sq. ft.), Liquidator, and a WaterWay Hi-Flo Pump with an A.O. Smith 1 hp SF 1.0 motor.

  19. Back To Top    #19
    ajackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    76

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Ok.. thank you for the advice.. I cant truly do the Shock process until the weekend because I am gone 10 hours during the day. (wouldnt be able to check FC thruout)
    I do think we are going to change out at least 6 to 8 thousand gallons.. I really wanted to avoid doing this until next spring. but at this point I dont really see anyway of getting around it.
    Thank you for all your advice. I am going to continue to just monitor the water until I can find someone to deliver.
    We have a well and I cant put 6,000 of well water in my pool ... It would be brown slug.
    thanks again
    14500k inground, vinyl, built in 2007
    Hayward Sand Filter, 1hp Hayward pump, AquaCal electric heat pump
    Taylor K 2006

  20. Back To Top    #20
    Administrator Leebo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Eastern Ohio
    Posts
    6,601

    Re: I dont even know where to begin

    Where about's in Ohio are you?? Located in Steubenville myself.

    I promise you...once you find somebody to truck in the water, you'll never turn back! Well water here too, and I cringe the thought of adding it to the pool now. Changing out the water to lower your CYA level will be a HUGE help to you. The extra cash you spend on water will quickly be repaid by the saving's in pool chemicals. I wouldn't even mess that much with trying to shock until you are able to get your CYA level under control. No need cleaning water just to dump it.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •