New Homeowner - CLEAN POOL [back to shocking.]

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Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

Yes, after determining that my cya was in the 40-50 range I upped my shock number to 29 and dosed a bit above that. I got it it up to what should have been 31, dropped to 11 in an hour, then dosed back up to be what was 34 - and then I ran out of chlorine. I will be picking up 48 gallons of 12.5% today around 1PM, and then it's back to the dose, brush, test every 30 minutes cycle until I get a decent residual.

I did test my CYA again last night and got a result of 50, but it was in the kitchen and obviously not in direct sunlight. I do have pretty daylight balanced bulbs in there, but even still I will run another test today after picking up the chlorine to make sure.

I did one last test before bed last night and I got the following numbers:

fc:5
cc: 5
nh3: 4-8ppm (closer to 4)

So I seem to be on the right path, I just hope that not being able to do anything until 1PM isn't going to set me back too far. Pool is looking pretty decent though, except for the "soapy" film on the top in some places. With the wind blowing right now it actually looks pretty sparkling - for the first time in days really, so we'll see how it goes later today.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

Just tested the well water for ammonia: none.

UnderWaterVanya said:
Word to the wise: my kitchen tests have given me lower CYA numbers than my sunlight ones...
Click to expand...
I have heard you say this before, but I'm a little confused about how a darker light source would give lower CYA numbers. I would expect that the darker the light source, the less water would be necessary to fully obscure the dot at the bottom of the tube, thus resulting in artificially high CYA numbers...
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

RockstarNE said:
Just tested the well water for ammonia: none.

UnderWaterVanya said:
Word to the wise: my kitchen tests have given me lower CYA numbers than my sunlight ones...
Click to expand...
I have heard you say this before, but I'm a little confused about how a darker light source would give lower CYA numbers. I would expect that the darker the light source, the less water would be necessary to fully obscure the dot at the bottom of the tube, thus resulting in artificially high CYA numbers...
Click to expand...

I had the same thought. I would think the brighter the light, the lower the CYA result.

Only thing I can think of is if you had the light shining straight down the tube from a light fixture, maybe that would read lower than the bright indirect sunlight from all sides.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

I believe that the reaction depends on the glare reflecting in the mixture to obscure the dot. So that dimmer light, as in inside, actually lets you see further into the vial, thus the CYA appears to be lower than the same test done outside where the sun in like 1000 times brighter than any indoor bulb. For that reason, I am wary of wearing sunglasses or polarized lenses while doing the test. I think the lack of glare causes the CYA to be read as lower than true. Surely someone will correct me if it is wrong.

Wish I could recall the data on indoor lighting vs sun. When I did planted fish tanks, we used these massive light hoods with amazing German reflectors to multiply the effect. Once some pro walked through the calcs to compare those "top-shelf" lights to sunlight and they were still like 1000 maybe 2000 times less light than the sun.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

Contrast? I'm not sure but my results are consistently 10-15ppm lower when I test indoors. I do it in a brightly lighted kitchen with large flourescent light fixtures - the light isn't from behind my back and some does light the tube from the side due to the way the lighting is arrayed. If I had a very bright single source light I might be able to get a higher result using my back to the light - but I haven't tried.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

I think UVW and anon are right about the light, when I do the test, if there is no sunlight, I almost always read lower cya values. I supposed there is a point where there is much less light, that the results would read higher, but from my experience they read lower (probably a minima somewhere) as light reduces from bright sunlight (indirect, since it should be at your back). IIRC, turning around and facing the sun actually gives me even higher cya readings.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

linen said:
I think UVW and anon are right about the light, when I do the test, if there is no sunlight, I almost always read lower cya values. I supposed there is a point where there is much less light, that the results would read higher, but from my experience they read lower (probably a minima somewhere) as light reduces from bright sunlight (indirect, since it should be at your back). IIRC, turning around and facing the sun actually gives me even higher cya readings.
Click to expand...

I forgot to mention that in overcast conditions outside (bright) I get 15ppm lower results also.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

That is really strange. I will have to look up the chemistry of what's going on in the CYA test at some point. Until then I'll just keep testing outside, back to the bright sun, to be absolutely certain I'm getting a reading that is as close as possible.

I just picked up my chlorine finally, going to run the cc/fc/cya/ammonia tests and start the process moving again.
 

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Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

fc: 2.5
cc: 2
pH: 7.2ish
cya: 30
nh3: 4-8

According to those numbers my mustard algae shock level is 19, so I'll dose to 25 to give myself (I hope) an hour to circulate without dropping down below 19. Then another test cycle. That's 4 gallons of 12.5%. In it goes.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

newest test:

fc: 3.5
cc: 2.5
nh3: 4-8

Oi. I'm going go crazy with all of this. Is ammonia really going to eat my my fc that quickly? I suppose that it didn't circulate enough, but I brushed the heck out of it after the last time I dosed. Back up to 25 I go, so another 4 gallons. Should I jump in and swim for a bit after dosing? I suppose that would circulate it better, but it may introduce more organics. Sheesh.

Can someone point me at the post that indicates how to do the bucket test to make sure that my chlorine is the potency I expect it to me?
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

Alright. So.

If my liquid chlorine contains 12.5% sodium hypochlorite, then I can assume that I have about .473 liters of sodium hypochlorite in each gallon of 12.5% liquid chlorine. When I dump one gallon of it into my pool, that .473 liters becomes diluted by 87065 liters, so I then have a concentration of 0.00000543272 liters of sodium hypochlorite per 1 liter of water.

Which, if my memory serves me correctly, means that each gallon of my stuff is supposed to add 5.43 ppm of sodium hypochlorite to my 23000 gallon pool.

I have NO idea if this math is anywhere near correct, but it seems to make sense to me.

Just checked my math per the pool calc, and yep, that's correct. Now I have to figure out how to get that 9.5ppm at 10000/1 converted to read the actual strength.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

From the post you linked too

If you do 10 ml into 1 liter twice (100 to 1 twice is 10,000 to 1) and then do the FAS-DPD test so that each drop would normally be 0.2 ppm, then each drop is 0.2% bleach (trade percentage).
Click to expand...

So I think your result indicates 9.5% ... although how accurate were you with your measurements?
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

if anything I was stingy with the clean water and liberal with the bleach. I have a two liter mixing bowl that I used, made sure that the low end of the meniscus (small as it was in an 8" bowl) was at the 1 liter line, and used two teaspoons of bleach, with surface tension probably closer to 2.1 teaspoons.

then there's also the whole me being unsure about how accurate I'm being with the fas dpd, even with the automatic stirinater device.

I'm not sure that ppm is a direct correlation to percentage strength though, still need to do some research on that, or maybe chem geek will stop by and set us all straight.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

i diluted by 10000. so i had one part liquid chlorine to 10000 parts water. The liquid chlorine is supposed to have a strength of 12.5% sodium hypochlorite, so that would mean that in that 1/10000 dilution, I should have had .125 ppm actual sodium hypochlorite - which is 12.5%.

So it looks like it is a (mostly) direct ppm to percentage, so my 9.5ppm is 3ppm less than I should be seeing in my liquid chlorine. Wonderful. I'll do another test to be sure - different gallon this time, but it came from same pallet of product in the same place in the warehouse, so it should give similar readings.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

Just tested another gallon. I was as precise as I could be - had to have been within 100ml in either direction of my clean water and used the taylor graduated cylinder that came with my stirinator device to measure the 10 ml bleach then 10ml diluted into 1L - i made sure to thoroughly rinse and try all of my equipment after being in contact with bleach. I think I'm pretty close with my measurement...

And this gallon came in at 14 drops - or 7ppm. I'm pretty upset at this point, I am considering asking my supplier for a discount or refund. I picked up from the warehouse today - it was right by an open rolling door in a non air conditioned warehouse, and it's been in the 90s for several weeks and high 70s besides that. My best guess is that it's not exactly fresh stock and has been sitting in the heat for a while.

Based on my two measurements, I'm going to treat it as if it's (9.5+7)/2 = 8.25% and use that in the pool calc.

Now for another fc/cc/nh3 test:

fc: 2.5
cc: 2.5
nh3: 2-4ppm

Using my new calculation of 8.25% bleach, I need to add just over 6 gallons to get back up too the 25 area.
 
Re: New Homeowner - Green Pool [HOLY AMMONIA BATMAN!]

fc: 2.5
cc: 4.5
nh3: 1-2 (i think. MAYBE 2-4 but think it's 1-2)

Another 6 gallons of my MAYBE 12.5% but more likely 8.25% going in now.
 

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