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Thread: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

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    tejensen's Avatar
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    Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    Hi,

    I have a Hayward EC-40 DE filter with a 1 HP Hayward Perflex pump and everything has been working fine. I have been running into a problem with an air leak whenever I use my Aqua Bug pool cleaner. Whenever I use the cleaner I get a ton of air in the pump strainer basket. If I remove the cleaner and and turn the pump back on it reprimes fine. I just replaced the o-ring on the strainer basket cover and lubed it with Jack's 327 multilube as recommended by the manufacturer and it didn't help at all. Additionally, I have tried removing the leaf canister in case that might have been the problem. Today I tried to sink each of the connections in the hose a few at a time to see if maybe it was one of the connections that's leaking, but I did not have any luck with this either?

    My only thoughts are to replace the hose to see if that is the problem or I wonder if it could be the seal on the pump shaft? Not sure if that makes sense, but thinking that the restriction/head load that the vacuum adds might cause a seal that's on its way out to leak? I don't even know if that makes any sense, but I'm stumped. Seems that the hose costs almost as much (more some places) as an entire new unit ($105 on Amazon with free shipping?) Anyone have any experience with a similar problem? Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks
    Tommy
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

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    Vette's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    If your hose has air in it when you connect it, that's where the air ends up - in the pump basket. That's why you need to fill the hose up completely before attaching.
    11,700 gallon 21' round 54" deep all-resin AGP - June 2012
    Waterway 1HP 2-speed pump / 100 sq ft cartridge filter
    Hayward 150,000btu Natural Gas heater
    I use and recommend the TF-100 for testing

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    tejensen's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    Thanks for the reply but I do fill the hose completely. This setup/procedure has been working well for about 5 years up until just a few weeks ago. Any other ideas?

    Thanks
    Tommy
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    One of your aquabug hoses may be starting to fail. Another thing are you sure you get them pushed together completely, every joint is a possible air leak on he factory hose.
    Over 30 years in the pool business
    We build vinyl, fiberglass, stainless steel pools
    Certified in Hydraulics

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    tejensen's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    I know that the joints are all pushed together as tight as can be (flanges are flush on each connection.) I guess I'll just get a new hose and give it a shot. Still have no idea how this can be since I tried it with the hose underwater, but I'm out of other options.

    Thanks very much
    Tommy
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

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    techguy's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    Have you tried Craigslist for hoses or a replacement bug? I see them for about $50 here. Also, I acquired from a buddy some generic replacement segment hoses and they work great with the old hoses. I don't know the price but they are at least 12 longer than the Hayward hoses. The Hayward hoses were made shorter to reduce the UPS shipping costs (no longer oversized in UPS)
    -- Guy --
    10K gallons in 21' Round 52 inch wall Aqualeader AG, Hayward Power Flow LX 1.5 HP pump motor, Hayward Perflex EC50AC DE filter w/Cellulose, Wide mouth skimmer, 2013 new Diver Dan (craigslist) to replace the faded old Hayward AquaBug. TF-100

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    tejensen's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    I just gave up and ordered a new cleaner and hose. It was on sale on Amazon for like $98 and free shipping with Amazon Prime. Will have it tomorrow and hope it works. I looked on craigslist briefly, but then started thinking that maybe I'd be getting someone else problem! Keeping my fingers crossed!

    Thanks
    Tommy
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    Looks like you could sell your's though... recover some of your costs.
    -- Guy --
    10K gallons in 21' Round 52 inch wall Aqualeader AG, Hayward Power Flow LX 1.5 HP pump motor, Hayward Perflex EC50AC DE filter w/Cellulose, Wide mouth skimmer, 2013 new Diver Dan (craigslist) to replace the faded old Hayward AquaBug. TF-100

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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    Ok, I'm totally stumped! I replaced the aquabug and hose with a new "diver dan" and hose. Then I removed the ball valve from the bottom of the skimmer hoping that the stem seal might have been the problem. Added new hose adapters to the bottom of the skimmer and the pump inlet (sealed with teflon tape) as well as a new flex hose and clamps. I changed the o-ring on the strainer and lubed it up with Jacks 327. Took the drain plug out and lubed that o-ring as well and re tightened it. I ran the vacuum for about 5 minutes and 1/2 the strainer housing was air. I removed the vacuum and ran the filter for 4 hours with not a drop of air. I called Hayward and they had nothing for me. Any ideas what else I can check/replace? I'm going to borrow a strainer lid from someone to try that, but other than that I'm stumped. No water leaks anywhere when the pump is off. This is really driving me nuts!!!!! Anyone have anything for me????

    Thanks
    Tommy
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    How do you attach the hose to the skimmer?

    Do you use an adapter like this that plugs into the base of the skimmer body? It is a white rubber like material that plug on the male end of the hose into the skimmer body, below where the basket would be.



    It looks like this when plugged in.

    -- Guy --
    10K gallons in 21' Round 52 inch wall Aqualeader AG, Hayward Power Flow LX 1.5 HP pump motor, Hayward Perflex EC50AC DE filter w/Cellulose, Wide mouth skimmer, 2013 new Diver Dan (craigslist) to replace the faded old Hayward AquaBug. TF-100

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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    Yep just like the one in the picture. It's brand new as it came with the new vac/hose.
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    I tried using an adapter plate an it sucked a bunch of air so I went back to the adapter.

    When the bug is running, can you hear air entering the hose at any of the segment joints? I know I had a leak on one of mine and I found it by pushing down on the hose when it was running and listened to the hose.

    Try using one or two segments of hose to see how far (how many segments) you can attach before getting air. I have some aftermarket hose that are longer than the standard Hayward hose and I found if that hose is plugged in and it bends over into the pool I will draw in the water without any air.

    Try attaching the cone to one hose and add a second hose (no bug), turn on the pump and see if you get any air. Add additional hoses while holding the hoses under water. See how many you get before getting air... Try it with the center hoses floating and just the last hose's open end under the water.

    As far as I know, the only place it can get air is via the hose.
    -- Guy --
    10K gallons in 21' Round 52 inch wall Aqualeader AG, Hayward Power Flow LX 1.5 HP pump motor, Hayward Perflex EC50AC DE filter w/Cellulose, Wide mouth skimmer, 2013 new Diver Dan (craigslist) to replace the faded old Hayward AquaBug. TF-100

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    tejensen's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    Thanks very much for the suggestion. I tried something very similar with the old hose and I was still drawing air with the entire thing submerged. This weekend I'll try that again with the new hose. If that doesn't work, I think I'm literally going to completely disassemble the entire thing.... take all the fittings apart, hoses off, clean the filter again, take the pump apart to ensure that the impeller looks good and is free from and debris and then put it back together with another new o-ring in the strainer lid and see what happens!

    Do you know where you got the aftermarket hose? The only ones I could find locally were really hard and brittle feeling and they wanted like $20 per section.

    Thanks
    Tommy
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

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    techguy's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    As I see it, if you do not draw air without hoses, it's not the skimmer, it's the hose assembly. As to the hoses, I don't know where they were purchased but I assume it was Leslie's. I only have them and used them as my hoses are sun damaged and my buddy had taken down his pool and given them to me. The Hayward hoses are better quality overall.
    -- Guy --
    10K gallons in 21' Round 52 inch wall Aqualeader AG, Hayward Power Flow LX 1.5 HP pump motor, Hayward Perflex EC50AC DE filter w/Cellulose, Wide mouth skimmer, 2013 new Diver Dan (craigslist) to replace the faded old Hayward AquaBug. TF-100

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    tejensen's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    Thanks. I agree that it sounds like it should be the hoses, just I can't believe that I would be lucky enough to get a brand new set that has the same issue!
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

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    techguy's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    This is what I do when I connect my bug. I take my bug with the leader hose (first segment) attached and spin the bug face down with the black square filter pointing up to get the air out of the bug. She starts to sink. I take the second segment of hose and i connect it to the leader hose below the surface with the second segment pointing up towards the sky. I feed the hose down into the water to get all of the air out and then attach the third segment below the surface. I continue this feeding and connecting one segment at a time until I basically have the entire hose submerged. It may not stay completely submerged but it sits "low" in the water. When i get to the last segment (the one with the adapter cone) i pull it over to near the skimmer. I remove the skimmer basket and then turn on the pump and wait until all air have been removed from the pump's basket, assuming any occurs. I then reach into the pool and submerge the cone and remove all air from that end of the hose and quickly and smoothly move the adapter end of the hose from the pool and into the skimmer and then into the skimmer outlet.

    I do give a small twist to each hose as I connect them together. If I get an air leak, I can frequent hear the sucking-in noise. I push the leaking connection below the surface and twist and pull the connection apart so as to not draw in air. I then reconnect the hoses while under the surface. They want to pull tight with the pump running. If I get a stubborn leak, I start at the skimmer end of the hose and move my way down the hose, one segment at a time.

    Sorry if this seems overkill but to assume we do it the same way is a good way to make bad assumptions.
    -- Guy --
    10K gallons in 21' Round 52 inch wall Aqualeader AG, Hayward Power Flow LX 1.5 HP pump motor, Hayward Perflex EC50AC DE filter w/Cellulose, Wide mouth skimmer, 2013 new Diver Dan (craigslist) to replace the faded old Hayward AquaBug. TF-100

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    tejensen's Avatar
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    That is a very good systematic approach. The part that is driving me just crazy is that I have been using this exact setup for 5 years with no problems at all and then all of a sudden I started having problems. Thanks again for all of your help. I really appreciate it!
    Above Ground (24' Round) 15,000 Gallons
    Hayward DE Filter (EC-40) with 1HP Pump - Advertised flow rate = 40 GPM
    Pools receives full sun for majority of the day
    TF-100 Test Kit
    Was using Trichlor with an inline chlorinator, but switched to BBB last year and water has been perfect ever since! (after draining 75% of the water to get rid of the bonus CYA that the Trichlor provided!) Thanks TFP!!!!

  18. Back To Top    #18
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    Re: Hayward Above Ground Air Leak When Vacuuming

    I didn't have any leaks until this year either.... 7 years with no issue is pretty good.

    I did replace the side flaps on the bug's underside but I found a YouTube that showed what to do... 20 minutes... all set. I figure that's a wear item.
    -- Guy --
    10K gallons in 21' Round 52 inch wall Aqualeader AG, Hayward Power Flow LX 1.5 HP pump motor, Hayward Perflex EC50AC DE filter w/Cellulose, Wide mouth skimmer, 2013 new Diver Dan (craigslist) to replace the faded old Hayward AquaBug. TF-100

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