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Thread: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

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    2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    Hello all,

    I recently switched over to the 2 “B’s” method last week, Sunday to be exact and couldn’t be happier. I thought my water was clear before, and was complimented on it several times by friends and neighbors. Now it seems to have that little extra sparkle.

    The reason for my converting to the “BB” method was not due to having any issues with my pool. All parameters are correct based on the charts used here in TFP. I have never shocked my pool (bought 4 bags of shock last year and sold to neighbor just a few weeks ago). He didn’t believe me, and then looked at the dates I wrote on the bags when purchased. He also seemed in awe that I have never had any issues with my pool. Seems that if I didn’t have an algae problem, I may be doing something wrong ? . The old method of chlorination was via the 3” pucks (GLB DuoGuard). The only other chemicals I used were Baking Soda (right from the beginning), Stabilizer, and GLB Natural Clear. The reason I switched was simple; I was tired of fighting the CYA battle. I told myself at the beginning of the swimming season that if the CYA level reached 70 I would switch to the BBB method. It finally reached 69 last Sunday. I pulled the remaining Chlorine pucks from the chlorinator and set out on a new adventure!

    Why only Bleach and Baking soda you ask? Well to be honest, I am asking all of you whether or not I should add the 3rd “B” to my pool along with additional questions. What are the Pro’s and Con’s of doing so? Seems that searching the Internet for answers can be good and/or bad.

    I also have one other concern, the addition of Phosphates as a result of using liquid Chlorine. In reading this site I understand that if I maintain the correct levels of Chlorine, it shouldn’t be an issue. Also, if I understand correctly, if I am concerned about Phosphates, I can use a product like “ULTIMA NIX” to remove Phosphates, which also eliminates and prevents algae growth. I would like to hear what others are doing with their pools.

    My latest set of test results:

    FC 6.13
    TC 6.27
    PH 7.5
    ALK 94
    CH 199
    CYA 55
    Water Temp 79.3
    Filter PSI 16
    Test time: 7:15 PM

    Sorry if I added to much info regarding the test. I have an excel spreadsheet that details every test ever taken on the pool including the amount of chemicals dispensed. This assisted me in learning my pool (new ABG as of last year, never had a pool before).

    Thank you all in advance for your contributions to this site and willingness to help others!

    Thank you,

    Marvin
    24' x 54" Aqua Leader Influence Above Ground Pool
    Hayward Pro Series S180T Sand Filter w/Zeobrite
    Hayward Power-Flo Martix SP1592FP Pump
    Lamotte ColorQ Pro 7 Test Kit
    Aquabot Pool Rover Jr. Pool Cleaner
    All equipment is hard plumbed

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    I use the AB method. All my pool ever gets is Acid and Bleach. ('cept when I leave town, then it gets Trichlor pucks.) And I can toss a coin in the deep end and call heads or tails from the deck.

    Borates are optional. I use pool water on my lawn, trying desperately to lower the CH level by drain and refills. Why add something only to pump it out? And I've been to Death Valley. Not much grows around the old Borax Works...

    My phosphates haven't been tested since I bought the place almost 3 years ago, and I've never had an algae outbreak, nor even cloudy water.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    Like Richard said, the borates are optional. But borax is often used to raise the pH. If you do not suffer from low pH, then you may never need the third B.

    What test kit are you using? We are often sceptical when we see so many decimal places. Although it sounds like what you are doing is working great

    Posted with Tapatalk ... sorry if I sound short ... hate typing on phone
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Swampwoman's Avatar
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    I added borates to my pool once I recovered it from foreclosure because I suffer eczema and was worried chlorine would dry my skin. Borax is used in a lot of skin care products.
    IMHO it has made my liner squeaky clean with no brushing, boosts sparkle, but more importantly, makes the water feel extra soft and silky -- a friend who was over Friday night remarked that his skin didn't feel like he had been swimming (we're hoping to convert his wife to bbb )

    In my case, the borates seemed to help stabilize ph drift a little as well. But I did not ave a season without to compare, and many of these features are also features of a well balanced "bb" or "abb" pool as well

    In my case, my dishydrotic eczema has just about completely disappeared for the first time in ten years, without steroids. So I'm a fan, and I credit the borax.

    Btw, if you decide to add and you hate handling muriatic acid as much as I do, pro team makes supreme plus, which is ph neutral (there is also a cheaper version that is not ph neutral, FYI.) it's quite a bit more expensive, but I am notoriously clumsy with acid, so we figure the added expense might be worth preserving an eye (yes, I wear goggles and still have managed to burn skin on corner of my eye during a bad over-the-pool pour).
    In ground extended Grecian, 22,000 gal, Hayward 220t sand filter, vinyl liner, dolphin m4 supreme.
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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    ProTeam Supreme Plus is essentially boric acid, which is available generically for substantially less.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Swampwoman's Avatar
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    Yes, in another thread, someone posted this link, which I bookmarked for future use when I replenish : http://www.dudadiesel.com/search.php?query=Boric+acid

    Much cheaper - should have thought to post it! Thanks, jason!
    In ground extended Grecian, 22,000 gal, Hayward 220t sand filter, vinyl liner, dolphin m4 supreme.
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    Vette's Avatar
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    Yep, the whole point of the BBB isn't the amount of B's, its the knowledge!
    11,700 gallon 21' round 54" deep all-resin AGP - June 2012
    Waterway 1HP 2-speed pump / 100 sq ft cartridge filter
    Hayward 150,000btu Natural Gas heater
    I use and recommend the TF-100 for testing

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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    I also have one other concern, the addition of Phosphates as a result of using liquid Chlorine.
    Chlorine is completely unrelated to phosphates. Where did you hear that?
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    Isaac-1's Avatar
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    I am like Richard, the only thing my pool ever gets is bleach and acid, with the acid amount being well under a gallon per year. The thing about phosphates is they are algae food, and as long as you maintain correct chlorine levels the algae never has a chance to get started so why worry about how much food it has. Also where did you see that bleach/liquid chlorine adds phosphates? There should be NONE in bleach.

    Ike
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    jblizzle, I am using a Lamotte ColorQ Pro 7 Test Kit with version 5.01 software. While I can't comment on what issues I have read about in these forums, it seems to work very well for me, The tests are predictable and repeatable. Since converting over to the BB method, I will now need to order one of the recommended test kits outlined on this site as the ColorQ only measures to 10 for FC and TC. Should there be a need to shock my pool, I will not be able to correctly measure the chlorine levels with what I currently have.

    duraleigh, I stopped in a pool store (big mistake) to see what they had in pool toys. Right away they tried to sell me some chemicals. The topic turned to the BBB method and right off the bat the sales person stated that I would experience a multitude of problems including high phosphates as a result of adding "bleach" or liquid chlorine. I asked him then why does he sell it (it being 12.5% chlorine), nothing but back peddling then. It did get me thinking hence the question posted to this forum. If it has no merit, so be it. If there is merit, please help me to understand.

    I like the idea of the feeling of soft water in my pool. We also have a water softener in out home and we are on city water. The reason, high doses of chlorine and over 10 grains hardness. Anyway, I picked up 5 boxes of 10 Mule Team Borax from Walmart today, go figure, it cleaned out the shelf. I will go back in 2 days and buy the remaining boxes I need then head on over to Lowes and pick up the Muriatic Acid. Any suggestions from the experienced before I start the process?

    Again, Thank you all in advance for your contributions to this site and willingness to help others!

    Thank you,

    Marvin
    24' x 54" Aqua Leader Influence Above Ground Pool
    Hayward Pro Series S180T Sand Filter w/Zeobrite
    Hayward Power-Flo Martix SP1592FP Pump
    Lamotte ColorQ Pro 7 Test Kit
    Aquabot Pool Rover Jr. Pool Cleaner
    All equipment is hard plumbed

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: 2 "B" or 3 "B", that is the question I ask of thee....

    Bleach doesn't add phosphates at all.

    Many years ago laundry detergents had phosphates in them, and that association was carried to all laundry items.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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