new vinyl inground paver coping install

[riverlee]

hello everyone, my pool is hopefully getting started next week and i am still trying to figure out the coping and deck. i was going to go with stamped concrete, but i'm not feeling good about the colors ,nor the cracking that will happen. i really wanted to do pavers anyway, so now i am trying to figure that out. my ex boyfriend is my concrete contractor, who said he will do the pavers instead, and i really couldn't afford to do them otherwise, but he has never done paver coping. i am reading everything online i can possibly find regarding how to install paver coping on a vinyl pool, but i could really use some good advice from knowledgable people here. i live in northwestern PA, so we have the freeze/thaw to consider.
some very helpful members helped get me through the horrible liner decision, and i am desperately hoping some others (or the same )could give me some insight on this issue! thank you! lee

 

[pool_snob]

There are a few different techniques that can be used, but there are variables such as the size of the pavers and pool wall type to consider. However, I would be extremely leery of having someone lay a paver coping on a vinyl pool that I was having built that has never done so before. Improper installation of coping stones have the potential to create some of the most troublesome/costly issues in regards to pool repair.

 

[riverlee]

thank you. i figured that would be some of the advice i got! i am definitely unsure, the problem is, i bet no one in my area has much, if any, experience doing paver coping on a vinyl inground. so i'm not sure what to do. i'm waiting to hear from the pool builder, and i will ask the supplier also, to see if he knows of anyone who has done them and to see what he can tell me about the walls with respect to doing this. i've just read and seen pictures of installs different ways, and i'm not sure what the proper method is. ultimately, if we can understand that, i have to decide if i want to take that risk. the pavers i am most likely using are tech blu 60, and techo makes a bullnose coping as well as another pool coping which appears more square than long.

 

[bk406]

There are several ways to do it, and probably no way is the best way, maybe. That being said, the way I would do it is to make sure you first have a good base of packed fill around the pool itself. IMO, this should be some sort of processed material that will compress very well with a plate compactor. Next step would be to form up and pour a small concrete footing about 6 to 8 inches wide around the entire perimeter of the pool. The footing should be around 4 inches thick and be flush with the top of the pool wall. this way, you have a good, stable base to lay the coping paver on. Bull nose pavers would then be mortared to the top of the pool wall and the concrete footing with a slight slope away from the pool to drain water away from the edge. Fill the spaces between the pavers with mortar as they are laid, or go back after they are set and point using a mortor/grout bag. If the pool is rectangle, the cuts for the coping will be minimal. Any other shape and the number of cuts will increase substantially. Once the coping is in, you bring sand or stone dust up flush with a back of the footing to lay the pavers on. The grades for the different layers need to be shot with a transit or laser level so the base is the correct height and everything is level in when finished.

Thats the way i would approach it. Lots of detail i didnt go inot, but thats the gist of the procedure.

 

[riverlee]

i appreciate the response, bk. that seems to be the most popular method i've come across while researching this. some pictures i've seen seem to have a wider concrete area poured, but i would think it should be only enough to support the bullnose, beccause would you want some of the regular pavers to rest partly on concrete and partly on their standard base? i did speak with my pool builder and he said he will ask the company who makes their walls (royal palm pools) about this. he recalls them having some sort of tray support for a mortar bed, but he is not too certain of the process since no one really does that on pools he builds. he said he has seen at least one where they did just a paver coping but with a concrete deck, but not any with all pavers coping and deck. hopefully the pool company can lend some knowledge in addition to what you have said and what anyone else can add. i just hate the thought of putting in $10,000 worth of concrete that i don't like, but i also don't want something done improperly. thanks very much

 

[rmelo99]

I'm in the same boat as you, except my pool was just finished.

Make sure the liner track coping used during the build is for "pavers/stone coping" and not for a concrete deck. Probably already covered this but figured it was worth mentioning again.

I am still "considering" a cantilevered concrete deck using foam forms...and helping educate my concrete guy on their use. Just came out today to give me a quote.

or

Going the paver route. I have sample paver coping stones and the width of my steel walls for the IG is wide engough that I'm sure it would be sufficient for gluing/mortaring the stone direct to the wall w/o pouring a small concrete footing around the walls. If I go with this approach I will play it safe and do it anyway. I will be tacking this on my own for my rectangle shaped pool with 6" radius corners.

My biggest concerns with going with concrete is the "potential settling" on the overdig area around the pool. This will be mitigated with re-bar accross the overdig span <2ft. I have already compacted around the pool and have been waterring since backfill. My backfill material was not gravel, but rather what came out of the ground during the build. I have spread 10tons of gravel around the pool area that is compacted and rough graded now.

 

[riverlee]

rmelo99, good luck with your decision. i feel for you! i think i would be concerned too about the settling given the backfill that was used, though it sounds like you are working on that. have you done pavers in general before? it's funny, that is exactly my choice also- concrete coping or the pavers. i am actually getting the stegmeier forms with the pool- i thought i had decided to go with that when i finalized the pool order, and it is too late now. so basically, i will be wasting them if i go with paver coping. and yes, thank you, the pool builder did tell me i would have to switch to the correct liner track if i do the pavers rather than concrete. he was going to get all the info from the pool company and get back to me. i missed his call tonight so i'm anxious to find out what i'd have to pay to change things now and to hear what else he came up with as far as installing them. i really want to use pavers, but like i said, i don't want it to go badly.
let me know what you decide- and how it turns out!

 

[Isaac-1]

This is interesting, please post photos of the finished job.

Ike

 

[rmelo99]

From what I know the non-cove/bullnose based liner track will work for any non concrete deck. Meaning you shouldn't need to change out the track that is used with the stegmeier forms if you choose to go with a paver coping (assuming the stegmeier liner track from the kit was used). No expert, so I could be wrong.

We deleted the "included concrete" deck from our pool build. The upcharge for cantilever concrete coping was $3600. That kind of money goes a long way with any paver or even real stone coping like granite/bluestone/limestone. I opted to not go that route. I have approx 90lin feet of coping to deal with.

We have a massive pool supply house in town that sells the stegmeier forms, but only sells to the pool trade. I ordered them online but have not yet received them. I too may have "extra" unused forms.

I've not done pavers but have done dry set bluestone, and the concepts are the same. Coping I have not done...but am not too concerned. If I do it the amount of prep and time dedicated will be far greater than any contractor. I think I can pull it off.

We're still pricing paver options, but nicolock is the front runner. Trying to decide how much deck area we really need. Somewhere from 1000-1500sq ft is the last calculation.

 

[riverlee]

are you saying the $3600 was for them to pour cantilever coping? yikes.
if i were you and capable of doing the paver work myself i would surely go that route. have you gotten the concrete estimate yet?

were the stegmeier forms inexpensive? my pool builder basically includes either the aluminum coping edge or the stegmeier forms with a vinyl pool, so i don't even know the actual cost of the forms, but i still hate the thought of paying for them and not using them. i have 168 feet of coping/liner track, so i'm really hoping that you are right about the track and i can use the one coming with the pool, but that is one for a concrete deck. he made a comment yesterday about the track needing to be different if i lay the bullnose pavers on the wall. i was trying to imagine how it could be any different versus doing concrete coping, but i am entirely ignorant regarding pool building. i still haven't talked to him again, so i'm still wondering what he found out. hopefully i will get answers in the morning.