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Thread: Pool's a mess....help!

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    Pool's a mess....help!

    I'm posting on behalf of a friend.....I switched to the BBB method a few years ago and have had such success with it that I would like to help him out. I don't really understand the basic chemistry of why it all works....i just know that if I test daily and use the pool calculator my pool looks great. So since i can't explain it all to him I'm looking for help from you. He has a 25,000 gallon round vinyl above ground pool. He came home from vacation and had some algae issues. He added some algacide and a few boxes of Borax and baking soda. Now his pool is a cloudy mess. Here are his numbers:

    FC: 0.5
    CC: Couldn't test; out of 0003 reagent
    PH: less than 7; almost a yellow color
    TA: 100
    CYA: TOO HIGH! About 3/4 below the 100 mark...what would that be?

    As you can see he's a mess. I know that much but don't know where to tell him to start. He's ordered his own test kit to arrive on Thurs so once we get him where he needs to be he'll be able to maintain. Please help!

    Thank you so much!
    My pool:

    24 foot, 13,000 gallons.
    1 HP Pump; cartridge filter

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Obviously a large water replacement is in order to get the CYA under control.

    Try redoing the CYA test using 50/50 pool and tap water to start and then double the results ... that will give a little better idea how high it really is.

    Let me take a guess here ... while on vacation he put a LOT of tablets or dichlor in the pool? That could explain the VERY low pH. This should be brought up quickly, but if you start replacing water, it may be able to wait until the refill which may help.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Thanks.....I will redo the CYA test tomorrow but in the meantime any suggestions about how much water he should replace?
    My pool:

    24 foot, 13,000 gallons.
    1 HP Pump; cartridge filter

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Depends on how high the CYA is

    Minimum is 50% and likely more than that. IF the CYA is 200, then need to replace at least 75%

    But, it is bad for the liner to drain too much at a time. Leave at least a foot of water everywhere ... this may require multiple dump and fills.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    We won't know until after the diluted test. Probably about 75%.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Bama and jblizzle beat me to it...Got to type faster

    I would first suggest re-testing the CYA as jblizzle suggested to get your true number. Once you have that, go to the Pool Calculator link in my sig. Go to the CYA section and enter the number from your test result and the desired (target) number you would like for your CYA to be at. The calculator will tell you how much water needs to be replaced.

    BTW, target CYA for a manually chlorinated pool is between 30 - 50 ; For SWG pools, 60-80.
    Gold Supporter, TFP Lifetime Supporter, 26,680 gal Plaster IGP 3.5 - 10' depth / Attached Waterfall Spa, Manually Chlorinated, Triton Sand Filter, 1.5 HP * 1.1 SF = 1.65 SFHP 1-speed Pentair WhisperFlo WF-26 Pump, 400K BTU NG Teledyne Laars Series One Heater, Polaris 360, Test Kit Comparison, Chlorine/CYA Chart, SLAMing Your Pool, OCLT
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Ok....thanks guys! This place is awesome :P

    I will probably be back for more guidance over the next few days.

    Happy 4th!
    My pool:

    24 foot, 13,000 gallons.
    1 HP Pump; cartridge filter

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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    You guys will love this. He got his water tested at the pool store and hIs numbers went something like this:

    FC: 0
    CC: 0
    PH: TA: I forgot but high
    CYA: 300 (!!!)
    Tons of algacide.

    You know what they told him he needed? Stabilizer.

    Unbelievable.

    Thankfully.....he's smart enough to know better.

    He dumped about 2/3 of his water and is refilling now. Still waiting on his test kit but I'll test when it's full and post a new set of numbers. Do you think he dumped enough to get his CYA down to the recommended level?

    Thanks!
    My pool:

    24 foot, 13,000 gallons.
    1 HP Pump; cartridge filter

  9. Back To Top    #9
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    I think some info got crossed ... I bet the 300 was really a CH number. The CYA tests do not go above 100ppm.

    You never reported back what your CYA test showed with the 50/50 pool/tap water sample ... so we have no idea if he dumped enough.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Does it make a difference if they have one of those fancy computer testing machines that they use to test the water? Could they have guesstimated that number?

    I never retested. He wasn't in a hurry and was waiting on his test kit. Just happened to run into him today and he shared that story.
    My pool:

    24 foot, 13,000 gallons.
    1 HP Pump; cartridge filter

  11. Back To Top    #11
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    The fancy testing machines often just read the color off of a test strip ... So you start with a crappy test strip and then let a computer guesses at the color and spits out a number to 2 decimal places.

    Trust your own test kit.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    I do trust my own test kit.....I've been using this method for years and have had great success.

    He didn't ask me to retest and was anxious to dump and start over. I'll retest when it's full....

    I just found it ironic they wanted to sell him stabilizer.
    My pool:

    24 foot, 13,000 gallons.
    1 HP Pump; cartridge filter

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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Did I read that correctly... they tested CYA at 300 and wanted to sell more?

    Also, if he is doing a dump and fill, I don't think I would talk him out of it unless they liner is at risk of being damaged. I know I dumped mine at least twice during it's lifetime... without damage... before becoming a dedicated BBB convert and dumped my pucks.
    -- Guy --
    10K gallons in 21' Round 52 inch wall Aqualeader AG, Hayward Power Flow LX 1.5 HP pump motor, Hayward Perflex EC50AC DE filter w/Cellulose, Wide mouth skimmer, 2013 new Diver Dan (craigslist) to replace the faded old Hayward AquaBug. TF-100

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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Alright, so I did the half tap water half pool water thing for the CYA. It still did not reach the 100 line reading. It was about a 1/4 inch below it. So if we double that, what would it be? Well over what it should be!!

    This was after dumping 2/3 of his water and refilling. I'm thinking he has to dump again....but he is hoping the CYA level goes down over time. I showed him how much FC is required for a pool at 100 CYA, so he can imagine how much it would take to keep his balanced. I'm not sure what he will do. I tested for him today and plugged it all into the pool calculator so he knows how to do that. He has a brand new test kit and I have directed him here to read pool school, as well as encouraged him to post himself so he can get on the right track.

    Thanks everyone for all your help.
    My pool:

    24 foot, 13,000 gallons.
    1 HP Pump; cartridge filter

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    If it was still over 100 using 50% tap water ... then his CYA is still over 200ppm.

    If he really replaced 2/3 of his water, combined with the current reading, he had to have been over 600ppm to start with ... which seems kind of unbelievable.

    I think we need to step back and determine if it was really possible for his level to get that high; if he really replaced 2/3 of the water; and how confident you are with your CYA testing.

    Do you have any history of what chemicals have been used in the the pool?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    It's all speculation until the pool is filled, the water is mixed, and an accurate set of tests are performed.

    Things can get done logically, based on facts, or by riding the pool store merry-go-round.
    If he wants to be swimming before Summer's over, I'd look for facts.

    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  17. Back To Top    #17

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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    The water was replaced a few days ago and I did another set of tests about an hour ago, including the CYA with the 50/50 water mixture. I don't know all his history...I know he was using pucks and shock packets. He said he spent over $1000 in pool chemicals and was frustrated with the results so that's when I told him about the BBB method and how it has worked wonderfully for me.

    It's one of those things that people have to do on their own, see the results, experience how simple it can be, and live happily ever after.

    I've pointed him in the right direction, it's up to him whether he decides to follow it or not ya know?
    My pool:

    24 foot, 13,000 gallons.
    1 HP Pump; cartridge filter

  18. Back To Top    #18
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool's a mess....help!

    Just got curious and ran some numbers:
    To raise CYA by 600ppm, you would need to add 225 lbs of trichlor pucks/granules or 250 lbs of dichlor granules.

    How old is the pool? How long has he been struggling? That is a lot of solid chlorine.

    Assuming your CYA test was right (no reason to think it is not), I would say he needs another 75% water replacement and to stop using anything but liquid chlorine.

    There is a chance that he was throw in dichlor packets while replacing the last set of water.

    I agree with you that it is often not possible "force" the BBB method on someone. They need to become desperate enough to find the solution for themselves.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

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