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Thread: Please save me from the pool man!!

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    Please save me from the pool man!!

    Greetings all!

    I have been reading the forum inside and out for, unfortunately, the last 8 days. I say 'unfortunately' because we put up the pool 10 days ago. With our own information and some suggestions from a know it all pool place lady. The suggestions were, ahem... incorrect. so anyway......here I am, and I am two seconds from calling a pool guy, because, quite frankly, we have alot of hands in our pool (four adults who are attempting to share but who each think they have the solution to the problem.. I am included in this....and a couple of smaller and inpatient humans who just want to swim, for crying out loud!!). The 4th of July and it's obligatory pool party is also just around the corner so I'm pretty desperate.

    SO our story is this: We got the pool, used, cheap. (This was my bad decision ... please refrain from ). It was pretty dirty and it sat in the yard getting rained on for another couple of weeks so it got dirtier still. It had one patched hole in it that was ... pretty big (about 2 inches). So we gave it a rinse off and set it up and started filling it with well water, which was fine to the naked eye for a little bit but about an 1/8th of the way full the well began to spit out orange water, which did not seem like a good idea to me. So we stopped that flow and rigged up the hose to the washer faucet and it took a couple of days but it filled up, and it was sort of a cloudy aqua brownish color, like this, maybe?

    we switched on the saltwater system and tossed in the saltwater starter stuff (which is essentially cya) and waited for the miracle of clear water to occur over night and as you can guess that did not happen. We took a sample to the pool store where the assault with intent to bankrupt began. It was at that point I was also beginning to look at this website. Still, I have three other peeps in the mix who had other ideas. I can't remember what we did. a jug of something because the alkalinity was low, I think. Hardness they also said was low and sold us about six tons of calcium, but I was reading this website when the others were busy tossing chemicals and i screamed, "NO! Halt! enough with the calcium already!!!" She wanted us to hit 300ppm for hardness and I was reading that is just not necessary with these intex pools. So no more calcium. We were using testing strips which i was also rapidly discovering are not accurate. The Taylor 2006 is nowhere to be found in the immediate area, so I had to settle for the Walmart 22 dollar kit and returning for free samples to be done at the pool store and fighting off the calcium crazed pool lady. Filter has run essentially continually and we have been rinsing it out at least twice a day, starting on day 5, when we decided to take a look at the cartridge and realized the thick orange stuff it had accumulated was probably not allowing anything else to be filtered anymore. The numbers have not been too far off all along, and now seem to be ok with the exception of alkalinity which is a little high according to your standards and the pool calculator and the cya is too low; although I was a bit thrown off with how to read that, as it can take a week to read accurately. Suffice to say after 6 days it was still at 30, which was fine by the pool lady but not so good according to you guys, so we threw some more in, but not enough because we only bought one bottle of it and we only had half the muriatic acid we needed and the long and short of it now is CLOUDY AQUA COLORED WATER with the following numbers: (from the pool lady free analysis this am)

    Temp 75.0(f)
    FC 7.0 (after adding 128 oz of bleach the night before)
    TC 7.0
    CC 0.0
    pH 7.5
    Hardness 90
    Alkalinity 100
    Cyanuric acid 30ppm
    copper 0.0
    Iron not run (why the **** not? I asked, with all that red stuff floating around??)
    Total dissolved solids - also not run.


    This is what pool lady told us: copper, alkalinity, pH ok.
    hardness Low (there she goes again with the calcium) add 25 pounds in 2 doses.
    FC is above the recommended range and we should not use the pool because our bathing suits will dissolve.(she did not really say that, but she implied it).
    she scratched out the stabilizer level is low for some reason.

    she gave us a free bag of DEAS A cartridge filter aid In which we are to hose down and clean the filter if pressure is high... add 5# of DE to the skimmer with the filter running
    Run filter for 48 hours stragiht
    hose down filter again as necessary.


    WE HAVE DONE NOTHING YET. I take that back. We poured in 2 128oz bottles of bleach this evening, I think. I say I think because i am not there tonight but I heard that was the plan.


    So...... what I 'think' we should be doing is this:

    to lower our TA we need to first lower the pH to 7.2 using 20 oz muriatic acid and then aerating to bring ph back up or use baking soda (but how much, and when?)
    add 83 oz of stabilizer to bring cya up.
    and if we wanted to lower the hardness, we would replace 44% of the water...but is it ok @ 90ppm?


    thanks for any help!! I have been instructed to 'call the pool guy' but I really think we can do this ourselves!! We havent' screwed it up beyond repair, have we?


    Colleen
    Intex 24x52 ultra frame round AGP
    12,481 gallons
    Intex 2500 gallon cartridge pump and Krystal Clear Saltwater Filtration System

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE SAVE ME FROM THE POOL MAN!!

    Cloudy is probably a combination of low FC and all the snake oil you've been adding.

    Aqua may be algae; most likely it's rust against a blue background.

    Do a search using "rust" and you'll find several recent threads. The short of it is you'll be spending a bit more money on a product called "sequestrant." Once the iron is sequestered (like a high-profile jury) you can deal with CYA and bleach. Forget TA - that's what you work on when everything else is good and you're bored. 300 CH is not a problem, especially since you'll be losing plenty of water to splashout. Once the pool is tamed, the SWG can maintain FC for you.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE SAVE ME FROM THE POOL MAN!!

    The TA is a minor issue which can do now if you want, or wait until later to deal with. The CH level is not an issue at all, it is just fine where it is.

    The main issue here is the cloudy aqua water. The obvious diagnosis is algae, but if it was algae I wouldn't expect your FC level to have still been 7 this morning. I suppose it could be the tail end of an algae issue that you have mostly or nearly completely conquered. The only ways to be sure are to either shock the pool to eliminate all possibilities of algae, or to do an overnight FC loss test, but that is only possible if you have a FAS-DPD chlorine test.

    Your description of your fill water strongly suggests iron in the water, though that isn't completely certain. The current color might be the result of iron. Iron can turn the water yellow, which often looks green against a blue liner.

    I recommend getting your own top quality test kit, ruling out algae as a possibility, and getting an iron test if you can find someone to do it for you. Don't raise CYA too much until you rule out algae. It is much more difficult to fight algae when CYA is really high.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE SAVE ME FROM THE POOL MAN!!

    Welcome to tfp, junkets

    Others beat me but here is my take...

    First, we would recommend that you get a test kit since pool stores are notoriously inconsistent, and you will need to test often, especially if you are fighting algae which your "cloudy" description makes me think you are.

    How much of the cya did you add? Are you sure it was just cya in the "starter stuff"?

    Since you described you pool as cloudy, you need to do the shocking process. It is a process and you will have trouble unless you have a good test kit.

    Most likely you also have a lot of metals (probably iron) in the water. The pool store should have tested this, maybe you can get it tested?
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

  5. Back To Top    #5

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    Re: PLEASE SAVE ME FROM THE POOL MAN!!

    Thank you all for your quick replies! I think we will try the iron route, because I have never been convinced the pool water is actually 'green'. (it is reported as 'clear' with no color on the pool store result page... I suppose I should have mentioned that maybe?) The first 1/8 to 1/4 of the pool water really poured in a brownish color and the iron in the well water was enough to turn the toilet bowl orange, so I'm going to say this is probably the issue. We were tied in to the town water just the day before we started filling so we thought we'd run the well dry..... duh.

    I will read up on the rust and report back soon! We thank you!

    Colleen
    Intex 24x52 ultra frame round AGP
    12,481 gallons
    Intex 2500 gallon cartridge pump and Krystal Clear Saltwater Filtration System

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    ultra800_96's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE SAVE ME FROM THE POOL MAN!!

    Quote Originally Posted by junkets
    Greetings all!


    we switched on the saltwater system and tossed in the saltwater starter stuff (which is essentially cya) and waited for the miracle of clear water to occur over night and as you can guess that did not happen.

    Temp 75.0(f)
    FC 7.0 (after adding 128 oz of bleach the night before)
    TC 7.0
    CC 0.0
    pH 7.5
    Hardness 90
    Alkalinity 100
    Cyanuric acid 30ppm
    copper 0.0
    Iron not run (why the **** not? I asked, with all that red stuff floating around??)
    Total dissolved solids - also not run.

    Colleen
    The others have you well taken care of, but one thing that caught my eye in the above sentence..You did add salt didn't you? I don't see salt in your tests & I have no idea what the "salt water starter stuff" is.
    12,900 Gal. 24' X 48" ABG Vinyl Round (17th Birthday)
    1HP Hayward Pump w/S180T Hayward Sand Filter
    AquaTrol RJ SWCG 2011 startup
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    50ppm Borates, June '12

  7. Back To Top    #7

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    Re: Please save me from the pool man!!

    yes, we did add salt. the salt is at 3200 per pool calculator recommendations
    Intex 24x52 ultra frame round AGP
    12,481 gallons
    Intex 2500 gallon cartridge pump and Krystal Clear Saltwater Filtration System

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    Isaac-1's Avatar
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    Re: Please save me from the pool man!!

    Hang in there, if it is just Iron you might get it clear enough to swim in by the 4th, get the sequesterant and follow its directions some brands are reported as better than others, but local choices will likely be limited.

    Ike
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Please save me from the pool man!!

    Can you post a pic of the pool? I think that would give us an idea of what it is.

    That cartridge filter is your biggest enemy when it comes to clearing a cloudy pool. It'll work but you have to stay on top of it and keep it cleaned or changed out regularly.

    With that size pool it's worth the investment to get a good test kit. With that, we could rule out several things.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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  10. Back To Top    #10

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    Re: Please save me from the pool man!!

    Ok, my son brought a sample to the only store that carried Jack's magic purple stuff. They said (I think) that the water had 0.3ppm iron? and that FC was 'very high'.

    My son has put a teddy bear stuffing stuffed stocking in the skimmer per someone's instructions as well as a stocking on the return water hose to further filter the water.

    we have had orange residue on the filter every day, though less than when it first was checked, but we had let it run a couple of days before even checking because we didn't realize it would dirty up so quickly.

    I suspect as well that the filter pump we use (which came with the pool) is minimally effective. Is there another one we should consider?
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Intex 24x52 ultra frame round AGP
    12,481 gallons
    Intex 2500 gallon cartridge pump and Krystal Clear Saltwater Filtration System

  11. Back To Top    #11

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    Re: Please save me from the pool man!!

    it looked better before we did anything!!!!!!
    Intex 24x52 ultra frame round AGP
    12,481 gallons
    Intex 2500 gallon cartridge pump and Krystal Clear Saltwater Filtration System

  12. Back To Top    #12
    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Please save me from the pool man!!

    Those intex cartridge filters are very substandard compared to other filters. Intex sand filters, the 1600 and 2650 would both be good choices for your pool.

    Looking at your picture, the water looks cloudy to me (especially the second one). Metals only would be clear but tinted. I would start the shocking process and hit it often: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...king_your_pool

    You will need to clean the filter frequently.

    0.3 ppm iron is a good amount, so no surprise it is showing in the water.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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