CH test not matching store, cloudy water HELP

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trevttu76

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May 17, 2012
12
Southwest Mississippi
I have had cloudy water since the beginning and am just recently getting my chemistry on track. I started with test strips and OTO test but after reading here upgraded to the TF-100 test.

Here lies one of my problems. My test strip and my TF-100 CH test are high (1200). I thought I would stop by the pool store and see about caltreat or something else to lower the CH anything before I drain the pool. They said that in this area odds are my CH isn’t that high and bring in a sample. I took in a sample and they said my CH was 30. I have tested it 3 times and I get the same thing, well over 1,000 each time. One of us is obviously wrong… I think I will go down there with my kit and we can do both again together. Comments?
So, since everything else was in check according to the pool store I thought my sand was the problem and needed to be changed. I have since changed sand and its still cloudy and not improving (2 days).

Problem two: my pool is still cloudy, and today looks a little green maybe.

Thanks for any help you can provide.

Test results:
FC= 12.5 (high I think because pump is running 24 hrs a day with SWG on)
CC= 0.5
TC= 13.0
TA=70
CH= 1,200
Ph=7.4
CYA=55
 
Welcome to TFP!

As a general rule, trust your own testing and ignore the pool store. You might be off a little, but it looks like they are way way off. Or to put that another way, it isn't all that difficult to do the test slightly wrong and read say 800 as if it was 1200, but there is no way a level of 30 is going to read as 1200.

When you were doing the CH test, did the sample ever turn purple? If so you are getting a floating end point and the actual level is most likely somewhat lower than the result you got. Also, did you user 120 drops of reagent? Or were you doing the test by 25s and use 48 drops of reagent?

One good double check on the CH test is to measure the CH level of your fill water. That will give you a different level to test and more experience with the test.

Very high CH levels do tend to make the water cloudy, though so do several other unrelated problems (like algae). Very high CH levels also tend to cause calcium scaling. Have you noticed any white/gray/brown rough deposits on the pool surface?
 
Good to know we cant trust the local pool place. I'm not surprised, which is why it was my first and last visit there...and the reason I am here!

Got the test kit out: I tested my tap water and got 50 or 60. I re-tested the pool water and got 1,200 again.
For your purple question; when I add the first chemical I get red, then transition to purple then blue when the 2nd is added.

Since my tap is low I can only assume I am doing the test right.

If so, then I have very high CH and a cloudy pool. I know draining is the best option, but I live in a very high water table area and draining scares me. Guess I will look for another option first...

Thanks again, if anyone else has any comments I am all ears!
 
I agree, your results are essentially correct and the pool store can't possibly be right. You did see purple, so you are getting a floating end point. That means your CH level is quite high, but not as high as you think it is. There are a couple of ways to avoid a floating end point. The best one is to get a speed stir. There are also several suggestions in the extended test kit directions.

There are several ways to approach refilling. The safest approach is to fill at one end of the pool and drain at the other end at the same time, with the pump off. That ends up taking a bit more total water, but is completely safe.
 
It will take longer but drain out 1/4, then fill, drain another 1/4, repeat several times. It will cost a little more in water but you won't float the pool. The result will be you'll lower the CH level and such. You'll need to add salt and CYA.
 
No real progress to report yet, just an update.
Well, I drained what I figure is almost a 1/3 of the pool and started adding back water. My pressure is low here and took 2 days to get it to the skimmer level again. I added 2 gallons of chlorine during the filling (figured with all the fresh water added it needed SOME chlorine, but since I was still adding I didn’t test except for TC which was over 5).
I turned the fill water off when I left for work today, and will do a full check of the chemicals tonight. Pool filter has been running since last night (valved off the skimmer until this AM).

Pool is looking green, probably need to shock it (using the article here of course). I have 6 gallons of bleach and I assume low CYA, we will see tonight if I have enough before I start. Since the pool has never been "clear" I am curious if I will ever pass that criteria in the shocking process. Maybe the new sand I mentioned will allow it now.

HOPEFULLY the CH is lower, everything else we can fix with time and BBB!

Thanks again for the help and push to start draining.
 
Guess its time to close this post and/or move it to another forum.

My last two tests results show my CH is low (ok with me), FC is high (10), CC<0.5, and everything is in good shape. CYA is low as expected, but I am adding some stabilizer. I don't have results with me or I would post them here.
Draining the pool fixed my CH issue, but pool is still cloudy. Running filter 24/7 and crossing my fingers.

One question: I have not shocked the pool, but my FC has been high for a while (because I added chlorine during the filling I presume). Is there any reason in shocking if my CC is less than 0.5 on all my tests this week? My only reason thinking about shocking is to clear up the cloudiness.
If I do shock will I ever be able to stop since my pool is never clear!?

Thanks again for the continued forum support!
 
I am curious how your CH got so high in the first place. Am I understanding right that your fill water is ~50-60 ppm CH? Have you used a lot of cal-hypo in the past (sometimes labeled as "shock")? It adds calcium to the pool water.

trevttu76 said:
One question: I have not shocked the pool, but my FC has been high for a while (because I added chlorine during the filling I presume). Is there any reason in shocking if my CC is less than 0.5 on all my tests this week? My only reason thinking about shocking is to clear up the cloudiness.
If I do shock will I ever be able to stop since my pool is never clear!?
Click to expand...
Have you done a OCLT?
 
I am the new house owner so I have no idea the past history or why it got so high. My fill water CH was 50 so there had to be something years past.

Pollen is a problem in the spring here and that is when my whole cloudy issues was noticed.

I have and havent done he OCLT...let me explain.

I am adding salt still so my SWG has been off for a few days. I have tested the FC and CC twice this week and I didnt see a change in either to speak of (test results at home, I am at work). That's another reason I havent shocked, my FC hasnt dropped with the SWG off.
FC is high as I mentioned around 10, CYA is roughly 60 from memory. I have added stabilizer over the last few days as well as salt. I turned on my SWG this morning since my salt level was fianlly good (5% only since my FC test last night was still 10). I might mention it has been cloudy here all week, might explain why I am not losing FC to the sun.
 

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Yes, main pump/filter is running 24/7. It hasnt been off since changing the sand a week ago.
I did add some DE yesterday and again today (after backflushing) to hopefully speed things up.

Still running the SWG low, about 2% now. Wonder if it is better while running the system 24/7 to turn off the SWG part of the day (night maybe) but raise the % or leave it on full time at a low % as I am doing now. Any comments from anyone on that? Maybe doesnt matter, but I can argue it with myself both ways.

Quick TC test last night showed above 5 still. I will do chlorine drop tests again tonight to see what the FC and CC looks like.

Hopefully it is just a matter of time on the cloudiness...
 
Why did you change the sand?

After you changed the sand, did you do an EXTREMELY thorough backwash? I mean for at LEAST 5 minutes?

When you get to only running the pump part-time, I suggest running it during the day, when the FC is being consumed by sunlight. You don't really need to produce chlorine during the night, unless you are having a big overnight pool party.
 
RobbieH said:
Why did you change the sand?

After you changed the sand, did you do an EXTREMELY thorough backwash? I mean for at LEAST 5 minutes?

When you get to only running the pump part-time, I suggest running it during the day, when the FC is being consumed by sunlight. You don't really need to produce chlorine during the night, unless you are having a big overnight pool party.
Click to expand...

I changed the sand just before before I drained part of the pool (high CH). I was hoping the sand was "old" and would help clear up the water. I dont know how old the pool is, but I assume the sand had never been replaced.

I did a pretty thorough backwash, at least 3-4 minutes. I was clear water when I stopped. I doubt 5 minutes, but more than normal.
I would say the water is clearer now after draining AND the sand change. It certainly isnt worse, just not clear. I can now see the polaris cleaner at the bottom, but it has a lot to be desired.

I think it is getting slightly better daily. (my better half doenst agree yet...) :hammer:
 
JasonLion said:
Leaving the SWG on at a low percentage is certainly the simplest thing, and I can't think of any reason to do anything more complex.
Click to expand...


I have foiund that when all you can seem to think about is your pool you come up with the best internal arguments! Agreed, too much thought.
Maybe once I get a crystal clear pool I can start putting thought into maximizing my chlorine usage...
 
I have mixed feelings about changing sand; before and after the change... It was a cheap fix ($70 in sand, $5 for fittings) though considering my fighting the cloudiness, if it fixes it. It may be the placedo effect, but the sand I pulled out seemed smoother than the sand I put in.
I am beginning to wonder if my filter is undersized; it says it required 250#'s of sand, and I see most people have much larger vessels. I assume there is a calulator somewhere, but the thought of it being undersized just hit me.

I did start using DE yesterday, we will see if that helps speed things up.
 
trevttu76 said:
I am beginning to wonder if my filter is undersized; it says it required 250#'s of sand, and I see most people have much larger vessels.
Click to expand...
Guessing here, but 250 lbs would suggest a Hayward S220T, which is 2.65 sq. ft. sand filter. For a 22000 gallon pool, the ansi/nsf recommendation is a 4.2 sq. ft. sand filter, so yours is a bit undersized. It should still work, but will need more frequent backwashing.

Another problem could be an oversized pump. What pump do you have?
 
Had to come home and look at it. Correct on the model number. My pump is 1 hp.

Nunbers from 2 days ago as promised. I didnt get to test again today.

FC=9.5
CC=0
TA=70
CH=60
CYA=55 (added stabilizer since then)
pH=7.9 (added acid since then)


This picture is from today howerver. Best it has ever looked, still cloudy though.
 

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