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Thread: Question about bonding / electricity

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    mitch08's Avatar
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    Question about bonding / electricity

    With the other post about bonding / shocking problems, I have a few questions but I dont want to off track that thread.

    About 4 years ago I had the cement around my pool ripped completely out and had pavers installed. The pavers were installed on crushed stone. About a 4" base of that. I know my paving guy didnt do any bonding on these pavers around the pool.
    It never seemed to be an issue.

    Now I added a new patio off those pavers that connects to the crushed stone around the pool. This different paver guy used 4" of cement instead of crushed stone. It doesnt come near the pool, but it directly connects to the old pavers around it that sit on the crushed stone to make everything flow...

    Can this in any way be dangerous if there is stray voltage or something else?

    I'm asking because just recently I have been having an issue with lights in a garden near the pool.
    They are tripping the GFCI they connect to. I dont know if the problem is with the GFCI or there really is a problem somewhere. I am going to switch out the GFCI.

    This GFCI also hooks up to the pool light. So now with that other thread and me having some minor electrical issues around the pool, I am getting a little concerned

    Thanks guys!!!
    18x38 Inground Liner (25k gal) Paver surround, multi-speed pump, DE Filter, Raised spill over spa, TF-100

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    Re: Question about bonding / electricity

    I would switch the gfci out and in the panel switch breaker to a gfci type. if you tell me brand of panel I can help you with that. not sure about question with the pavers, where do you think the voltage would come from? everything you installed in patio should have a ground, meaning the voltage would travel to ground(earth).
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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Question about bonding / electricity

    The new concrete/pavers won't make anything worse. The existing pavers/crushed stone is a minor problem however. Everything out to 3 feet away from the water should be bonded, typically with a loop of wire or grid of wire buried in the crushed stone. At this point it probably isn't practical to fix it, though it does introduce a small risk.
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    mitch08's Avatar
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    Re: Question about bonding / electricity

    ...
    18x38 Inground Liner (25k gal) Paver surround, multi-speed pump, DE Filter, Raised spill over spa, TF-100

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    mitch08's Avatar
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    Re: Question about bonding / electricity

    Quote Originally Posted by eddie1129
    I would switch the gfci out and in the panel switch breaker to a gfci type. if you tell me brand of panel I can help you with that. not sure about question with the pavers, where do you think the voltage would come from? everything you installed in patio should have a ground, meaning the voltage would travel to ground(earth).
    Thanks a lot. I think I can do that. I will take a look this weekend.

    \\
    18x38 Inground Liner (25k gal) Paver surround, multi-speed pump, DE Filter, Raised spill over spa, TF-100

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    mitch08's Avatar
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    Re: Question about bonding / electricity

    Quote Originally Posted by mitch08
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonLion
    The new concrete/pavers won't make anything worse. The existing pavers/crushed stone is a minor problem however. Everything out to 3 feet away from the water should be bonded, typically with a loop of wire or grid of wire buried in the crushed stone. At this point it probably isn't practical to fix it, though it does introduce a small risk.
    Thanks! What type of small risk are we talking about here?

    I have a 3 year old that swims all summer. Granted this has never been an issue, but I dont want to put her at any risk even if small with getting zapped by something.
    18x38 Inground Liner (25k gal) Paver surround, multi-speed pump, DE Filter, Raised spill over spa, TF-100

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Question about bonding / electricity

    The small risk is that if something goes awry around the area that introduces stray currents, you could feel them due to it not being properly. That chance is very small but it possible none the less.

    They bond the crushed stone by burying a #8 bare copper wire or grid in it all around the pool 18 to 24" from the wall. There's enough conductivity in the soil to make it work. And if there's not enough conductivity you're not going to get shocked anyway.
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    Re: Question about bonding / electricity

    The bonding requirement for the area around the pool, as opposed to the pool itself, is relatively new--2008 code cycle maybe? The 2005 code just said all metal objects, which obviously does not include pavers, need to be bonded. There are fifty years of pools built without this kind of protection, including mine. It doesn't bother me a bit. My pump does not have a GFCI either, although the outlets and lights do. I might upgrade that, but we have been operating for fifty-five years without it on two different pools.

    I would bet there are other items of higher risk at your house that should be addressed before this. That said, any new work should always adhere to current governing code.
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    Mod Squad JohnT's Avatar
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    Re: Question about bonding / electricity

    Quote Originally Posted by Durk
    The bonding requirement for the area around the pool, as opposed to the pool itself, is relatively new--2008 code cycle maybe? The 2005 code just said all metal objects, which obviously does not include pavers, need to be bonded.
    I think it says conductive parts, not metal objects. IIRC, 2005 was amended fairly early in the cycle to require mesh under pavers and rebar bonding or mesh under the concrete if no rebar was used. But I agree that it's a fairly small risk since concrete isn't a great conductor, even when wet.
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