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Thread: Am I getting the right info

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    Am I getting the right info

    Hello Everyone, I have been snooping around the forums for a few weeks. I found you after scheduling an SWG install and figured I'd better get up to speed. Well I've been ingesting all the info just not sure I'm understanding it all and how all the bits relate to each other. I kind of expected the "pool guy" to get everything swim-ready.

    Well they installed the generator, Shocked the pool and aid they would need to add a lot of Stabilizer to it as they said It's size would be stretching it as far as relying on 1 chlorine generator ( original estimates calculated the pool at 45K gal.). After that, I was told to wait 3 days and added the salt, once disolved, I started the Aqua-rite. 2 days later ( now) I am getting a reading of 3200 ppm of salt at the aqua rite.

    Feeling a little left out in the cold, I went to a big box-style pool store to buy a simple test kit while I manage to buy a good one ($125 - ouch!) and a water sample.

    readings ( french abbreviations so I hope it makes sense )
    salt - 2900 ( my machine says 3200) so they say to add 40Kg but I will wait to see if it stabilizes.
    CLL - 3 free chlorine
    CLT - 3 Total chlorine
    ph - 7.4
    pha - 7.4
    at - 110
    aa - 110
    ca - 110

    Not too sure of the abbreviations as I said, but the final recommendation from them was that my system seemed in the right range and I should add 1 cup of ECO PLUS ( which is their product to raise the ph, then add 20 Kg (44lbs) of calcium to prevent corrosion in the pool. Then add the salt mentioned above.

    I bought a 15 lbs tub because I thought 44 lbs was a bit much and am polling you for the first of many, to get your thoughts and feedback.

    Thank you,

    ps. I haven't added the calcium yet
    1979, 40K Gallon IG Vinyl, Laser250 sand filter, 1.5 hp Pentair SuperMax VS pump, Aqua-Rite SWG

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Welcome

    Did they test for you stabilizer level? That is a pretty critical number to know to maintain your pool.

    What test kit did you get? That is a little pricey. Hopefully it has the FAS-DPD test!!!

    pH is fine at 7.4 ... no need to add anything ... although the SWG will tend to have the pH drift up.

    Since you have a vinyl pool, there is no reason to worry about CH (calcium harness) being too low ... you may have to worry if it gets too high.

    Can you add you location either to your signature or in your profile? ... as it could affect some recommendations (like not being able to get the TF-100 kit if you are overseas).

    If the SWG is happy with the salt level, then no need to mess with it.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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  3. Back To Top    #3

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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    THanks for the prompt reply,
    they told me the stabilizer level looked fine but it shows (not tested) on the printed report I received.

    I'm in Montreal ( I'll update my profile).
    I didn't buy the pricey kit as I saw the K-2006 on a Canadian link for Apollo pools?? and when I saw the price, I knew it wasn't a purchase I was going to make today so I just got a cheap set of test strips till I could afford the right kit.
    Should I even add the 15lbs of calcium, will it adversely affect my ph or other levels?
    Yes the SWG is showing I have its IDEAL recommended level.

    Thank you so much
    1979, 40K Gallon IG Vinyl, Laser250 sand filter, 1.5 hp Pentair SuperMax VS pump, Aqua-Rite SWG

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Not sure if you can get the TF-100 up there or not, but the K-2006 is the correct alternative ... but that price is pretty high.

    I do not know what some of your tests were ... at,aa,ca.

    Is one CH (calcium harness) and on TA (total alkalinity)? If you control TA, your can help offset some of the pH rise due to the SWG.

    There is no point to adding calcium (won't affect anything else) and I would return it if you can.

    So what FC level are you trying to maintain? How do you know without know what your CYA level is?

    I would advise you to get your own test kit as soon as you can. Maybe a fellow Canadian can recommend where to get one cheaper.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Hi, I'm honestly relying on the store's results for my info till I can get a good test kit.
    I've only used the pool for 1 month last season and just now opened it last week so I have a lot to learn and don't want to have to run to a store to constantly put my conscience at ease about the cleanliness of my pool. I was following the link to the TFTestkit 100 and will see if I can get one shipped to me at a reasonable cost.

    I'll definitely return the calcium if it's not needed and was given results based on an incomplete test.

    The SWG manual stated to try and keep the FC between 1 and 3, so I figure if I get to know the SWG dial better, I'll be able to keep it around 1 when only light use or cool days and maybe 3 on hot days or 1-2 days before a backyard party.
    Does that make sense? It it doable without disturbing other levels?
    1979, 40K Gallon IG Vinyl, Laser250 sand filter, 1.5 hp Pentair SuperMax VS pump, Aqua-Rite SWG

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Look at this chart: Chlorine CYA Chart

    As you can see we recommend CYA levels of 60-80ppm for a SWG pool (they may have gone way above this???) You can see in this range the minimum your FC should ever be is 3ppm ... I would maintain at least 4-5ppm FC until you KNOW your CYA level.

    Increasing the level of the SWG will only also possibly make your pH rise more quickly. That is the only effect beyond adding FC.

    Just keep reading through Pool School (button at upper right) and you will learn more than you thought possible ... and continue to ask questions.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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    Smykowski's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Quote Originally Posted by Flowerman
    The SWG manual stated to try and keep the FC between 1 and 3, so I figure if I get to know the SWG dial better, I'll be able to keep it around 1 when only light use or cool days and maybe 3 on hot days or 1-2 days before a backyard party. Does that make sense? It it doable without disturbing other levels?
    Unfortunately, that statement won't work. The appropriate FC level depends on your CYA level, and that's what guarantees a clean pool. Take a look at this chart.

    Also, if you haven't done it yet, please read Pool School. It will help you build a foundation for having the discussion you're going to need to have.

    There's a lot of information there, but don't worry we'll help you through it.

    EDIT: AAAAHHHHH!! Out typed again!!
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Here is a thread on test kits for you. Looks like Apollo might be your only option:
    where-to-purchase-tf-101-test-kits-in-canada-t36244.html?hilit=canada%20test%20kit
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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  9. Back To Top    #9
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Quote Originally Posted by Smykowski
    Quote Originally Posted by Flowerman
    The SWG manual stated to try and keep the FC between 1 and 3, so I figure if I get to know the SWG dial better, I'll be able to keep it around 1 when only light use or cool days and maybe 3 on hot days or 1-2 days before a backyard party. Does that make sense? It it doable without disturbing other levels?
    Unfortunately, that statement won't work. The appropriate FC level depends on your CYA level, and that's what guarantees a clean pool. Take a look at this chart.

    Also, if you haven't done it yet, please read Pool School. It will help you build a foundation for having the discussion you're going to need to have.

    There's a lot of information there, but don't worry we'll help you through it.

    EDIT: AAAAHHHHH!! Out typed again!!
    At least we said exactly the same thing
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    THanks guys, I've read through pool school once over but like I said, it ALL makes sense, just not sure how it all correlates.I read it before actually having a running pool so maybe just too much theory and not enough practice. And the Calculator, I entered my numbers but haven't the slightest idea what it means.
    Anyhow I now know that I need the CYA numbers before moving forward. I'll get them, refer to the chart and then maybe pool school will start to make sense.
    1979, 40K Gallon IG Vinyl, Laser250 sand filter, 1.5 hp Pentair SuperMax VS pump, Aqua-Rite SWG

  11. Back To Top    #11
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    In the calculator, set the size at the top, and goals at the bottom (TFP.com, SWG, Vinyl).

    After you test, put all that info into the Left NOW column. Then in the right TARGET column put the levels you would like to achieve (and know why you want them ). It will then tell you what you need to do to get to the new levels.

    Try not to change too many things at the same time. You should really eventually only need to adjust pH if the SWG is keeping the FC correct and most of the other things change slowly.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Once you actually start using it on a live pool you'll get more adept at it and it'll make a lot more sense.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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  13. Back To Top    #13

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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    Hi Again, I can't find a test kit anywhere, I'll have to bit the bullet and pay the price from Apollo

    I went to get this morning's water tested and specified I needed the stabilizer level.
    I was told it wasn't important for a salt pool. I insisted and the test revealed a ppm unmeasurable so below 30 and all would be OK.
    I stated that their tech gave me the empty 4 or 6? KG tub and told me it was all in there, how could it be at 0 ( as shown on my report).
    I was reassured and sent on my way with the other following info.

    Total Alkalinity 70ppm and should add 1.26KG to raise it a little
    PH 7.4
    Calcium hardness 130 ppm and should add 15Lbs of calcium (compared to the other store's 44lbs recommendation.)
    Chlorine 3ppm.
    and just to confuse things, they measured my salt at 3500

    That's it, I guess no one in my area can give me the test I require,
    I'll have to get on a test kit sooner rather than later.

    Thanks
    1979, 40K Gallon IG Vinyl, Laser250 sand filter, 1.5 hp Pentair SuperMax VS pump, Aqua-Rite SWG

  14. Back To Top    #14

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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    This idea just dawned on me. The clerk told me that they could only test upto 30 ppm of cya. Could she possibly see a 0 reading even though my levels are much higher because she can't test that high?
    1979, 40K Gallon IG Vinyl, Laser250 sand filter, 1.5 hp Pentair SuperMax VS pump, Aqua-Rite SWG

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Am I getting the right info

    6 kg of CYA would have raised it by 40 ppm. 4 kg would have raised it by 26 ppm. I suspect the lowest they can measure is 30 ppm not the highest. If it was 4 kg then they probably can't measure that, so it shows on the test as zero.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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