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Thread: Need some IG help quickly!

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    Need some IG help quickly!

    My husband and I are in the process of buying home via short sale that is headed for foreclosure. It has an IG pool (I *think* I attached a picture to this post) that has not been winterized at all. Everything seems to be fine as of now since we've had such a mild winter so far, but it is supposed to be very cold this weekend so I am worried and hoping to work on it tomorrow. Today, I drained the filter and the heater. I guess blowing the lines is what is left, and I am going to try that tomorrow, but it is snowing here now and we are supposed to get several inches of snow tonight, so that is what I will be dealing with tomorrow in trying to locate the return valves (pool level is above normal level). Sort of wishing I had lowered the level of the pool today instead of draining everything so we could blow out the lines and not have to plug them. My question, I guess, is a worst-case-scenario one....if we can't get things taken care of, what are the possible consequences/costs? I assume very expensive, but really have no idea. My biggest concern was the pump/filter/heater, but maybe I should be more focused on the lines. ??
    I want to just hire someone to close it, but can't justify dropping $300 on it when we aren't 100% sure we will even buy the house at this point.

    A few other questions re: this pool...how do you get a new liner for an odd-shaped pool like this one? Are they super-expensive to buy and to have installed?

    The filter is a DE Sta-Rite that does not have a dial/valve thing that changes to filter/waste/recirculate, etc. Owner said the entire thing has to be taken apart to put new DE in it and it is a huge pain. Isn't this unusual? There is no way to backwash it he said. ???

    We really want to buy this house as an investment property, but this pool is becoming something that is scaring me away due to concerns about damage this winter. Help!![attachment=0:dm2tbgys]photo.JPG[/attachment:dm2tbgys]
    Attached Images Attached Images
    27' AG round pool; vinyl liner; 1 HP pump; 40 GPM Tagleus sand filter

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    Living in Arizona we do not run into this. Down here if it actually gets below freezing (over-night) we just run the pump to keep the water moving and prevent freezing. I do not actually see where you are located. Is it going to be cold for a long time such that running the pump is not an option?

    I have read other threads say to cover above ground pipes with insulation and maybe put a tarp over the entire pad too (and even to put a light bulb on under the tarp to generate heat), but I think those are pretty temporary solutions.

    You may just need to worry about what is above ground for now ... although I hope someone else comes along that knows more than me.

    Good Luck!!!

    EDIT: That is odd that there are no valves on the filter, but I do not think it would bee to hard to add one after the fact ... either a simple slide one or a multi-valve (recommended).
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    Sorry...forgot to mention I am in Ohio, so yes, we generally have long periods of freezing temps. It is supposed to be in the teens and 20's for the next week, I believe. That picture I posted was taken today, so there is currently no ice, but a week ago, there was an inch or 2 of ice in it I would guess.
    27' AG round pool; vinyl liner; 1 HP pump; 40 GPM Tagleus sand filter

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    XsAllOverIt's Avatar
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    Just run the pump until you winterize everything. As long as you don't get a lot of ice forming, you'll be OK. Start winterizing as soon as possible. Drain below the skimmers and blow out all lines. Go to pool school to determine how to winterize all the equipment. If your pump is not running, you're really putting your entire system at risk. Not only are you risking your equipment, but all the lines below the concrete become at risk also, which could be a huge repair scenario. If the pump is running full-time, no problem. Water won't freeze while it's circulating, but you certainly want to winterize it in OH and as soon as you can. I wouldn't worry about a cover at this point. The pool will need Pool Schooling the Spring with a lot of tender care. As far as the equipment questions, a few pictures really helps in the analysis.
    18 x 36 Inground Gunnite, White Plaster 21K gallon
    18" raised spa, 8' Diameter (620 gallon)
    Triton II Sand filter, Intellichlor IC40 SWG
    Pentair Pump, Max-E-Therm 400 BTU
    Lamotte ColorQ PRO 7-Plus test kit
    TFT-100 test kit

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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    With now having pump filter and heater drained but nothing able to be done to cap returns due to weAther, should I go backwards now and reset everything to run?
    27' AG round pool; vinyl liner; 1 HP pump; 40 GPM Tagleus sand filter

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    XsAllOverIt's Avatar
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    If you can winterize the pipes, that would be your best option. Blow out all your lines and follow the winterization steps in pool school. If in fact you have bad weather and can't do it, I wouldn't leave your pipes exposed with water. That said, the weather doesn't look like it's getting warmer for the next 10 days, so if at all possible, I would blow all your lines out, cap them and leave the pool till Spring. Easiest is with an air compressor. You can probably do all but the main drain with a shop vac.
    18 x 36 Inground Gunnite, White Plaster 21K gallon
    18" raised spa, 8' Diameter (620 gallon)
    Triton II Sand filter, Intellichlor IC40 SWG
    Pentair Pump, Max-E-Therm 400 BTU
    Lamotte ColorQ PRO 7-Plus test kit
    TFT-100 test kit

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    XsAllOverIt's Avatar
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    Finding the return valves will be no problem once you start blowing out the lines. With an air compressor attached to the system, your pool will be bubbling at the returns and the skimmers.
    18 x 36 Inground Gunnite, White Plaster 21K gallon
    18" raised spa, 8' Diameter (620 gallon)
    Triton II Sand filter, Intellichlor IC40 SWG
    Pentair Pump, Max-E-Therm 400 BTU
    Lamotte ColorQ PRO 7-Plus test kit
    TFT-100 test kit

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    [attachment=0:2y2uksrp]pool pump.JPG[/attachment:2y2uksrp]Okay, thanks a bunch for the help! I have been researching here and YouTube about how to winterize. So, I need to reach into the pool and ice-cold water and unscrew the return valve-things on each one that directs the water return flow, and, while bubbles are coming out, put a cap on them, correct? Now, with the bottom drain, I am a little confused. I am attaching a pic of the pump...I don't see what I need to shut off to create the air lock once I have blown out the line?? There doesn't appear to be any kind of shutoff anywhere on the whole thing. Does something go inside the pump basket?

    Thanks again for the help...I am really needing to resolve this today - very cold and snowing here and going to stay in the teens for the next week. Eeek!
    Attached Images Attached Images
    27' AG round pool; vinyl liner; 1 HP pump; 40 GPM Tagleus sand filter

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    XsAllOverIt's Avatar
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    From the photograph it appears you have two lines coming in to the pump. My guess is a main drain and one skimmer from your pool picture. Disconnect the pump from the two lines with the union and blow out both lines. The skimmer should be blown out first and plugged at the skimmer. The main drain then gets blown out and you use the black valve to close the main drain line which will give it an airlock to prevent water from entering the main drain. Then you can blow out the other direction for the return and then plug the return line at the pool. Hope that helps. Yes you will unscrew the "valve-things" (return eyeballs) and use a cap to cap the return. There is a water bottle like device used to screw into the skimmer to allow expansion of ice within the skimmer. You can also use a plug but make sure you have plenty of antifreeze in the skimmer then and put something in there that will expand if it freezes.

    For an explanation of the black valve (Jandy valve most likely), you would point the oppositte of the handle toward the line which is the main drain, so the round 1/2 circle will be pointing to the pipe that is the main drain. This will close that pipe. The other pipe (skimmer) won't matter if it's open because you got it plugged on the other end by the skimmer itself.

    When you're done blowing out all the lines, you can disconnect the pump if desired, but it looks like it's inside already, but as long as you blew out the line through the pump, it should be fine since it won't have water in. Pool school goes into detail on the winterization of the filter and heater and pump. Make sure you unplug the drain lines and blow the lines out. I don't do that with my pool because I run my hot tub full-time. I simply use the Jandy valve to close off the other lines that are exclusively for the pool. Just draining the lines doesn't always eliminate all the water. Follow the directions well in Pool School, especially for Ohio.

    Also, you may want to make sure you don't have water in the line for the slide. You should be able to blow that line out also, but I'm not familiar with how slides are set up. Maybe someone else can answer that.

    Hope that helps.
    18 x 36 Inground Gunnite, White Plaster 21K gallon
    18" raised spa, 8' Diameter (620 gallon)
    Triton II Sand filter, Intellichlor IC40 SWG
    Pentair Pump, Max-E-Therm 400 BTU
    Lamotte ColorQ PRO 7-Plus test kit
    TFT-100 test kit

  10. Back To Top    #10

    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    Excellent. Thanks for taking time to respond!
    27' AG round pool; vinyl liner; 1 HP pump; 40 GPM Tagleus sand filter

  11. Back To Top    #11

    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    Okay, need some more advice if anyone is still reading this. We went to the house yesterday but could not get the Jandy vale to budge, so were not able to blow out the lines. The other issue is this...I was trying to figure out how the plug thing screws into the skimmer hole, so had my hand in the water and after only 10 seconds or I was dying, so there is no way that I will be able to reach in the pool and cap the return eyeballs and put caps on even if we do get the lines blown out - just WAY too cold to have hands in there for a couple minutes. It is supposed to get up to 40 this coming week and i am wondering if the best bet is to hook back up the filter and heater and try to drain the pool down below the return jets and skimmer ~ and that is assuming nothing else freezes between now and then that makes that impossible. If i need to do that, I will have to post pictures of the filter to get help figuring out how exactly to drain it since the filter does not have a multi-port valve like I am used to on my AGP. Any other suggestions welcome - I am not sure what to do at this point. Guess it is time to pray for a mild winter...

    Man, this is a lot of headache and hassle for a house that we don't even own yet - I must be crazy!

    One other question...assuming we cannot get it any more winterized than draining the filter, pump, and heater, any idea of how pricey frozen lines can be? I want to have some ballpark idea because it will affect our negotiating the price of the house if we are potentially buying a major expense in fixing the pool lines in the spring.
    27' AG round pool; vinyl liner; 1 HP pump; 40 GPM Tagleus sand filter

  12. Back To Top    #12
    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    Frozen pipes aren't usually a huge deal to fix especially PVC pipes. If you can get the pad equipment drained you probably won't be in too much trouble come spring.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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    reindeerboy's Avatar
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    If you think you are going to end up with this house, then hire a pool company to quickly come out with a blower to get the job done for you in blowing out the lines and drain the pool below the skimmer level about 4-5 inches so that ice doesnt form in the skimmer. You can easily drain it some by getting a submersible pump with a hose and drop it in to drain it down yourself while the pool company is on its way. Its faster and well worth the extra cost of not having to mess with it, plus you can ask them some questions while they are doing it. Thats what I did to get started and now I have it down. Its worth the 200-300 bucks in my opinion.
    Chad R.

    POOL SIZE: 16 x 32' Vinyl lined pool. 22,000 gallons. 8' deep. 2009 Hayward 1.5 HP Super Pump. Hayward S310S 30" 500 lb Sand filter. 1 skimmer and 2 returns. Solar Blanket.

    Pics of my pool: http://s307.photobucket.com/albums/nn312/reindeerboy/

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    XsAllOverIt's Avatar
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    Re: Need some IG help quickly!

    Several answers: The jandy valve should move. Is there a screw on top that is tightened. If so, untighten and it should move. If not, you can certainly take all the screws out of the jandy valve and remove the valve to see more of what could be the problem. You certainly need to figure out this problem. At worst, you could certainly unconnect pump from lines and blow out both lines simultaneously. Buy a new union like the one that exists and create a temporary stop pipe/valve by adding a small piece of pipe to the union 1/2 that looks the same as the side from the pump and put a cap at the end of the pipe. After you are done blowing out both lines, quickly screw this temporary union/pipe combination to the existing other 1/2 of the union on the pipe side. Leave the pump unattached til spring. Blow out the other side and cap the returns inside the pool. You'll have to do this even if you get the water below the returns and skimmer.

    As far as damage to lines - see all that concrete. All the lines are below the concrete. If you have line damage, you'll first have to determine where the damage is and then cut concrete out to repair lines. Not good.
    18 x 36 Inground Gunnite, White Plaster 21K gallon
    18" raised spa, 8' Diameter (620 gallon)
    Triton II Sand filter, Intellichlor IC40 SWG
    Pentair Pump, Max-E-Therm 400 BTU
    Lamotte ColorQ PRO 7-Plus test kit
    TFT-100 test kit

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