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Thread: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anything

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    Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anything

    Hi everyone,

    I am a first time pool owner, we just bought and had installed last Sunday a 18' 54"deep round above ground pool. We bought it here at a local great escape store. I am in the western burbs of Chicago, so we are hoping to get a few cold water swims in before we have to close it up.

    As far as equipment included here is what we got:
    Zodiac Nature 2 vision Pro
    Hayward 2HP swimpro voyager pump
    Hayward swimpro filtration series.

    Everything is new to me, so we got a starter kit and followed those directions, so far.

    It seems there is not many people that like the nature 2 vision system here. As being a complete newb, I want to keep it simple as possible. I got some test strips with the starter kit, but I am thinking these are not the best for a balanced pool, so I am going to order the TF`100 (or whatever that kit name is that everyone suggests here)

    So as my season is basically over I want to use this time to learn as much as I can. This nature 2 line seems to be a great escape brand. Is there other brands of chlorine tabs I can use or must I use there brand with the unit (remember I am newb) Because they seem pretty pricey at the GE at 24.99 for 2 sticks.

    Well if anyone can offer up any suggestions or anything else please, do so. I have been reading the pool school stuff, its just alot of stuff thats over my head and I am a more hands on learner. So thanks for reading and hoping to learn lots so that we can have a balanced trouble free pool
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Welcome to tfp ceme4bk!

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    It seems there is not many people that like the nature 2 vision system here.
    For most people who have had that system, it has not been very "Trouble Free".

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    As being a complete newb, I want to keep it simple as possible.
    Nothing in pool maintenance is much easier than the BBB method.

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    so I am going to order the TF`100 (or whatever that kit name is that everyone suggests here)
    Yep, get the TF-100, it will save you time and money. It is nice to see a new forum member starting with the right tools!

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    So as my season is basically over I want to use this time to learn as much as I can. This nature 2 line seems to be a great escape brand. Is there other brands of chlorine tabs I can use or must I use there brand with the unit (remember I am newb) Because they seem pretty pricey at the GE at 24.99 for 2 sticks.
    I would not even use that system. Sounds like you have already read some of it, but use the google search at lower left of page for nature2.

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    So thanks for reading and hoping to learn lots so that we can have a balanced trouble free pool
    Probably the most useful article for you in there right now is: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...ary_pool_guide One tweak to it I might suggest is in step 5 where it suggests using dichlor, my preference is to use bleach for chlorine and solid stabilizer for CYA. Then you don't have to buy dichlor!

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    Hayward 2HP swimpro voyager pump
    Is that a 2-speed pump? If it isn't, that is a very oversized pump for your pool.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Thanks Linen. I hope my test kit gets here quickly. We have not been in the pool yet. I am shocked at the dislike of the nature 2 system, as this is great escapes top package, maybe its just to keep selling refill chlorine cartridges. As I said I will continue reading but until I get my kit I will just keep reading until I actually have hard numbers to compare my actual to target numbers.

    I soon hope to earn my chemistry degree in pool maintenace.
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    maybe its just to keep selling refill chlorine cartridges.
    Bingo. And the initial dollars they get from you for the system. Some people may get the system to work fine, but we keep seeing people on this forum having trouble with it. Each pool and pool maintainer is different. With a vinyl pool being harder to stain, maybe if you have no blonde haired swimmers (I have many) it is less of a problem? Still, the cost would stop me from using it.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    frogabog's Avatar
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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    No happiness guarantee on that system from the seller or manufacturer? I'd think that if I bought something that I hated from the get go, by two weeks later I'd be demanding a refund. Doesn't Nature 2 maintain such guarantees on their website?
    Where kids swim in 54 degree water, turn blue, and giggle happily cuz they got a POOL!
    Year 3 BBB -15' x 48" Intex Metal Frame - Was using (2) 1000gph Intex cartridge filters (see Full time pumping Intex). 2012, converted to 1600gph and sand filter+SWG = Sand filter love affair!
    Don't waste time and energy looking for a better value on test kits, the TF100 is the best deal around. I did the looking and spent the extra money, but you don't have to make the same mistake. Just go here: TFTestkits. I use Pool Calculator for min/max, and shocking chlorine levels.

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    I got my test kit in th email last night. What a great looking kit, it seems like it has everything I would need and more. I read over the directions last night and they seem pretty straight forward, even for a newb like myself. I will post up my numbers after I test tonight. I will probably do the tests twice just to rule out user error. Once I get numbers I will be disconnecting the nature 2 and trying to go to the BBB method.

    Thanks for reading and the help given to me previously and the future help.
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    On the CYA test, don't redo using fresh reagents, just pour everything back in to the bottle and read it again to see if you can get 2 out of 3 that are close. That test uses a lot of reagents.

    Also, watch the bottles to see that the drops are all even sized. Sometimes at the start, there will be some static that affects them. If in doubt, wipe the tip off; see the extended direction sticky for more details if you think you need them.

    Welcome to the forum.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Ok got some numbers for you. Pool was filled 5 days ago.
    Fc 16.5
    Cc 0
    Tc 16.5
    Ph 7.2
    T/a 310
    Cya 40
    Temp 78*

    Ok I had the nature 2 set on 3 since start up. I have put it on zero after this test. Wondering if I should just take cartridge out for now. Tested chlorine levels with the Taylor also and it was dark Orange confirming my numbers from tf kit

    Any advice will be appreciated. Will punch numbers into calculator later, right now I'm on my mobile only.
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    At shock level for your CYA; how does the water look? If it looks OK, you may be ready for overnight loss test to see if you actually need to shock any more.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Water is crystal clear

    Forgive my ignorance, but if cya is 40 and my Fc is 16 am I not at shock level right now.

    Should I add borax to lower the ta

    I just went back to school and reread the overnight loss test, and I will perform tonight
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Took my Fc test for overnight total. My Fc was 13.5 down 3pts from this early evening, but we swam since then and it was still sunny and I had shut the chlorine to zero on the nature 2.

    Will follow up in the am for my numbers
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Looks like you're on the right track with the OCLT.

    As far as reducing your TA, you use muriatic acid (or dry acid) to reduce TA, not borax. There is in article in pool school on "how to lower total alkalinity".

    What is your calcium hardness? That will determine if you need to reduce your TA quickly (by aggressively aerating), or slowly by letting your pH naturally rise and then adding muriatic acid as needed.
    20'x40' Oval 27,000 gallon Vinyl IG, Coverstar Auto Cover
    Hayward MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Sta-Rite PLD50 30 sq. ft. DE filter
    Rheem 266,000 btu natural gas heater
    Dolphin Nautilus Plus with Clever Clean
    TF-100 testkit w/ Speed Stir

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Quote Originally Posted by faby3003
    Looks like you're on the right track with the OCLT.

    As far as reducing your TA, you use muriatic acid (or dry acid) to reduce TA, not borax. There is in article in pool school on "how to lower total alkalinity".

    What is your calcium hardness? That will determine if you need to reduce your TA quickly (by aggressively aerating), or slowly by letting your pH naturally rise and then adding muriatic acid as needed.
    Thanks after I re read it (pool school) I realized that. I did not do the ch test as I thought it was only for inground pools, I thought I read that in my test kit manual. either way i will test it in the am.

    Also is the muriatic acid the same that I can buy at home depot and similar places? Sorry if its a dumb question
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Yes, its the same muriatic acid that you buy at home depot or the hardware store. You probably already know this, but be careful handling muriatic acid, especially be careful not to get it in your eyes - eye protection is recommended.

    Also, since your pH is currently at 7.2 you do not want to add and acid until your pH rises. When I was lowering my TA, I would let the pH rise to 7.8 and then add enough acid to lower the pH to 7.2, and repeat as needed.

    The reason to measure calcium hardness is because at high TA and high CH you may be at risk for scaling. If you are at risk of scaling (CSI at 0.6 or higher according to the pool calculator), you would want to lower the TA more quickly by aeration. If you are not at risk of scaling then there is now hurry to lower the TA, just keep your pH in the recommend range and the TA will lower itself over time.
    20'x40' Oval 27,000 gallon Vinyl IG, Coverstar Auto Cover
    Hayward MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Sta-Rite PLD50 30 sq. ft. DE filter
    Rheem 266,000 btu natural gas heater
    Dolphin Nautilus Plus with Clever Clean
    TF-100 testkit w/ Speed Stir

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    Water is crystal clear

    Forgive my ignorance, but if cya is 40 and my Fc is 16 am I not at shock level right now.

    Should I add borax to lower the ta

    I just went back to school and reread the overnight loss test, and I will perform tonight
    Yes, you are at shock level indeed. Or were then, of course.

    TA is lowered with acid, either dry acid or muriatic acid. The latter is cheaper. You can reduce TA fast or you can do it slow. Both get to the same place. I've done both, not sure which is more work. If you have a way to aerate the pool water, like a fountain, you might do the fast way. Otherwise the slow way is good as well. See the Pool School for information on both ways. The slow way, in short, is just to maintain your pH around 7.5 - 7.8 [edit] and the TA will slowly go down. Your tap water is going to be at the 310 TA that your fresh fill tested, so know that large water additions after backwashing or whatever will drive that number up. So, you can really just mind the pH and the TA will take care of itself.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Overnight test was a success. Came out with 14 so assuming slight user error by a smaller or bigger drop.

    So now do I just leave the chlorine dispenser at zero and just test regularly then once to target number start adding appropriate bleach
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Ch was 200
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Quote Originally Posted by cemeb4dk
    Overnight test was a success. Came out with 14 so assuming slight user error by a smaller or bigger drop.

    So now do I just leave the chlorine dispenser at zero and just test regularly then once to target number start adding appropriate bleach
    It is probably safe to say you passed OCLT, but not certain due to those in the tube.

    If there are trichlor tablets in the chlorine dispenser try to get them out. It will continue to dissolve even at zero. In fact that may be why the FC seemed to rise overnight. If what is left is slight, you could let it stay if the CYA estimate from that will not be much. It is really hard to fish tablets out of those things.

    After the tube is totally empty, you might do another overnight test, just to be sure.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

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    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    Thanks I will take out, should I just let the pool be without any chlorine til me levels get to my Target then add appropriate amount per the calculator.

    Also if I remove the chlorine tube in the nature 2, is it ok to leave it attached with the mineral tube or should I just delete the entire nature 2 unit.

    Thanks
    18' round ABG 8600 gallons
    hayward 2hp swimpro voyager cartridge filter

  20. Back To Top    #20

    Re: Virgin pool owner, and looking for help advice and anyth

    I was saying to remove the chlorine tablets inside the tube assuming this is an automatic chlorine dispenser sort of like mine that uses 3" tablets of trichlor. I know that my Rainbow 320 will slowly leak out trichlor even on the zero setting. I assume yours does also. With the chlorine tablets removed, you can either do another overnight test or assume that all is well and just let the FC drift down.

    The pool is so new and looks good you say and your swim season is so short, I'd swim now and when FC gets to 3.0 ppm then add bleach to get to 5.0 ppm, testing every day.

    You CH is fine, low is fine with ABG pools you just don't want it to get really high for that can cause scaling with the right water parameters.

    So, test pH and FC daily and adjust per Pool Calculator. Test the other things maybe weekly to see how they change. Eventually you may test some things monthly when you are pretty sure how they vary.

    As for the Nature 2 system, I have no experience there. I don't know how to disable the mineral side of it. Someone will be along who can discuss that. I have kept my in-line chlorinator so that I can use trichlor when I go on vacation. I try to keep the CYA a bit low so that I have the luxury of using tablets for a week or two here and there. My CYA is usually low in the spring if we have had normal winter rains. Nothing normal about this year however.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

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