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Thread: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Motors?

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    2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Motors?

    Are there any 2 speed pumps on the market these days that use the AO Smith E-Plus High Efficiency motors (B2981 - B2984)?

    I looked in the California pool pumps data base, but, while I found some listed, it looks like the data base is not completely accurate. For example, the data base shows the Pentair Whisper Flo WFDS-6 or 26 to use this motor, but, it looks like when reading Pentair's information, the motor is actually a less efficient motor.

    I'm looking for a pump that has a 2 speed motor, where the high speed is 2.2 (total) hp (10.0 Amps), and the low speed is 0.28 (total) hp (1.6 Amps). This is what the B2983 motor performs at.

    I see that the Eco Pump EP-6 uses the B2983, but, I can't find any other companies that use these AO Smith E-Plus High Efficiency motors.

    Anyone know of any?

    Many thanks.

    Best regards,

    Bill
    30 KGal IG plaster pool with diving board & spa, built '96; 2 speed (2.2/0.28 THP) AO Smith B2983 hi efficiency motor for circ (3 skimmers w/ 1.5" lines & drain w/ 2" line) (replaced original 1 speed Sta-Rite Max-E-Glas II 2.0 THP pump in 2011); waterfall w/ Sta-Rite Max-Glass II 2.5 THP pump w/ 2.5" lines, Polaris 280 pressure-side cleaner w/ 3/4 HP pump, Sta-Rite System 3 Vertical Grid 53 sqft DE filter, AquaLink RS6 P&S w/ 52 pin Rev K.33 controller, Rainbow offline tri-chlor erosion feeder, 450 KBTU/hr Rheme gas-fired heater, Dallas climate, 10/kwh current electric rate, energy monitoring system at http://www.welserver.com/WEL0043

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    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    Have you considered the Hayward EcoStar, Pentair IntelliFlo, or the Jandy ePump?

    These pumps have permanent magnet motors, which are about 30 % more efficient than standard induction motors. And, they are variable speed, which will give you more control than a two speed pump.

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    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesW
    Have you considered the Hayward EcoStar, Pentair IntelliFlo, or the Jandy ePump?

    These pumps have permanent magnet motors, which are about 30 % more efficient than standard induction motors. And, they are variable speed, which will give you more control than a two speed pump.
    Yes, thank you, I have. Unfortunately (fortunately) my electric rate is 9¢/kWh, and thus the variable speed units have a pretty long payback period for me. I run my 2.2 hp (total) pump (10 Amp) now for 6 hrs per day to give me one turnover (30 kgal pool).

    Best regards,

    Bill
    30 KGal IG plaster pool with diving board & spa, built '96; 2 speed (2.2/0.28 THP) AO Smith B2983 hi efficiency motor for circ (3 skimmers w/ 1.5" lines & drain w/ 2" line) (replaced original 1 speed Sta-Rite Max-E-Glas II 2.0 THP pump in 2011); waterfall w/ Sta-Rite Max-Glass II 2.5 THP pump w/ 2.5" lines, Polaris 280 pressure-side cleaner w/ 3/4 HP pump, Sta-Rite System 3 Vertical Grid 53 sqft DE filter, AquaLink RS6 P&S w/ 52 pin Rev K.33 controller, Rainbow offline tri-chlor erosion feeder, 450 KBTU/hr Rheme gas-fired heater, Dallas climate, 10/kwh current electric rate, energy monitoring system at http://www.welserver.com/WEL0043

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    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    You can get the Jandy ePump for about $200 more than the WhisperFlo and you already have a Jandy AquaLink RS controller, which will work well with the pump.

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    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesW
    You can get the Jandy ePump for about $200 more than the WhisperFlo and you already have a Jandy AquaLink RS controller, which will work well with the pump.
    James, thank you. I will look at the Jandy ePump to see if it's reasonably cost effective versus moving to a 2-speed pump, noting I already have an AqualLink RS controller.

    Parenthetically, except for the Eco Pump EP-6, I sure can't find any other 2-speed 2 Hp pumps with motors as efficient as the AO Smith B2983 motor (1.5/0.19 hp, 3450/1725 rpm, 1.47 SF, 10/1.6 Amps). It looks like if you buy a 2 speed 2 Hp pump, regardless of manufacturer, it's going to have a motor where the lower speed is at about 3 Amps, about double the AO Smith B2983 motor.

    Best regards,

    Bill
    30 KGal IG plaster pool with diving board & spa, built '96; 2 speed (2.2/0.28 THP) AO Smith B2983 hi efficiency motor for circ (3 skimmers w/ 1.5" lines & drain w/ 2" line) (replaced original 1 speed Sta-Rite Max-E-Glas II 2.0 THP pump in 2011); waterfall w/ Sta-Rite Max-Glass II 2.5 THP pump w/ 2.5" lines, Polaris 280 pressure-side cleaner w/ 3/4 HP pump, Sta-Rite System 3 Vertical Grid 53 sqft DE filter, AquaLink RS6 P&S w/ 52 pin Rev K.33 controller, Rainbow offline tri-chlor erosion feeder, 450 KBTU/hr Rheme gas-fired heater, Dallas climate, 10/kwh current electric rate, energy monitoring system at http://www.welserver.com/WEL0043

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    The label rating does not really reflect the true amp draw on a motor. This is especially true at low speed. The rating is much higher than the true amp draw. For example, the full rated 1.5 HP Sta-Rite MPE6YF-207L uses 365 watts on low speed which implies a real amp draw of 1.6 amps. Power factor plays into this as the rating is for total amps and not just real amps. But what you should care about is the real amp usage.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    None of the major manufacturers say which motors they use in their pumps, so you aren't going to be able to guarantee that a pump from a major manufacturer is using that specific motor unless you combine a wet end and motor yourself. However, it quite possible that Pentair does use it. Pentair did not offer high efficiency two speed pumps until after the E-Plus line came out. The 2010 and 2011 WFDS-6 models essentially match the specs you listed according to the California energy efficiency test data in actual usage, even though the Pentair specs list higher peak amp numbers. Likewise, it is quite possible that other companies are also using the same motor on some of their pumps. There simply isn't any easy way to tell who is using what from the specs.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    Quote Originally Posted by JasonLion
    None of the major manufacturers say which motors they use in their pumps, so you aren't going to be able to guarantee that a pump from a major manufacturer is using that specific motor unless you combine a wet end and motor yourself. However, it quite possible that Pentair does use it. Pentair did not offer high efficiency two speed pumps until after the E-Plus line came out. The 2010 and 2011 WFDS-6 models essentially match the specs you listed according to the California energy efficiency test data in actual usage, even though the Pentair specs list higher peak amp numbers. Likewise, it is quite possible that other companies are also using the same motor on some of their pumps. There simply isn't any easy way to tell who is using what from the specs.

    Thank you. I agree that it looks like the WhisperFlo WFDS-6 / WFDS-26 may use this pump. If I end up replacing my whole pump (2.2 THp), I'll replace it with a WhisperFlo or an EcoPump EP6.

    Best regards,

    Bill
    30 KGal IG plaster pool with diving board & spa, built '96; 2 speed (2.2/0.28 THP) AO Smith B2983 hi efficiency motor for circ (3 skimmers w/ 1.5" lines & drain w/ 2" line) (replaced original 1 speed Sta-Rite Max-E-Glas II 2.0 THP pump in 2011); waterfall w/ Sta-Rite Max-Glass II 2.5 THP pump w/ 2.5" lines, Polaris 280 pressure-side cleaner w/ 3/4 HP pump, Sta-Rite System 3 Vertical Grid 53 sqft DE filter, AquaLink RS6 P&S w/ 52 pin Rev K.33 controller, Rainbow offline tri-chlor erosion feeder, 450 KBTU/hr Rheme gas-fired heater, Dallas climate, 10/kwh current electric rate, energy monitoring system at http://www.welserver.com/WEL0043

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    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985
    The label rating does not really reflect the true amp draw on a motor. This is especially true at low speed. The rating is much higher than the true amp draw. For example, the full rated 1.5 HP Sta-Rite MPE6YF-207L uses 365 watts on low speed which implies a real amp draw of 1.6 amps. Power factor plays into this as the rating is for total amps and not just real amps. But what you should care about is the real amp usage.

    The reason that the E-Plus motors are more efficient on low speed, is they actually use a separate winding for low speed instead of using consequential poles as standard 2 speeds use. This also helps with the power factor which is why the amps rating is lower as well. But from their literature, it is about 20% more efficient than a two speed motor which is reasonable for having a separate winding.
    This is very helpful commentary. Much appreciated. I do understand what PF is, and thus you've brought up a good point.

    I didn't know the AO Smith E-Plus motors use a separate winding for low speed. Perhaps this helps to explain why it's a 56Y framesize and not a 48Y.

    Many thanks!

    Best regards,

    Bill
    30 KGal IG plaster pool with diving board & spa, built '96; 2 speed (2.2/0.28 THP) AO Smith B2983 hi efficiency motor for circ (3 skimmers w/ 1.5" lines & drain w/ 2" line) (replaced original 1 speed Sta-Rite Max-E-Glas II 2.0 THP pump in 2011); waterfall w/ Sta-Rite Max-Glass II 2.5 THP pump w/ 2.5" lines, Polaris 280 pressure-side cleaner w/ 3/4 HP pump, Sta-Rite System 3 Vertical Grid 53 sqft DE filter, AquaLink RS6 P&S w/ 52 pin Rev K.33 controller, Rainbow offline tri-chlor erosion feeder, 450 KBTU/hr Rheme gas-fired heater, Dallas climate, 10/kwh current electric rate, energy monitoring system at http://www.welserver.com/WEL0043

  10. Back To Top    #10

    Re: 2 Sp Pumps on Market using AO Smith E-Plus Hi Effic Moto

    You could contact A.O Smith and/or Pentair and ask them which pumps use their motors.

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