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Thread: How much TA reduction with murayic acid

  1. #1
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    How much TA reduction with murayic acid

    So far the bbb method has been going well. The only part that is my battle is the high TA and calcium hardness.

    Here are my results today - from pool store they do a pretty extensive testing not just strips.
    Tc - 4.6
    fc - 4.6
    PH - 8.2
    TA - 240
    ch - 325
    Cya - 20
    Borate - 30
    Tds - 400

    Their recommendation was close to pool calculator of 11 pints muratic acid. My question is is the amount more for the ph or the TA? How much of a decrease will there be in TA? Also, they say to only add 4 cups every 4 hours of ma. What happens if I don't wait? I already added 8 cups - four at a time 3 hours apart. Ph is still high.

    Thanks. I feel like this TA is going to be my never ending battle. It is with the fish tank!

    Pool is 13500 gal, 2 hp pump no heater yet.
    24' Round Diamond Star, 54" wall height, 200sq ft sta-rite cartridge filter
    Dynamo 1hp 2 speed pump, 199k Rheem milivolt heater
    Pool rover jr. - our best friend!
    Tf-100 plus borate strips and Taylor k1000.

  2. #2
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    Re: How much TA reduction with murayic acid

    Use the pool calculator to determine how much 31.45 % muriatic acid you need to add to lower the pH from where it is to 7.2. Add the amount of acid and then retest after 1 hour. Continue to lower the pH to 7.2 until the TA is where you want it.

    Going from 8.2 to 7.2 in 13,500 gallons with a TA of 240 and a borate of 30 will take 133 ounces (about 1 gallon) of acid. 133 ounces of acid will lower the TA by 39 ppm.

    pool-school/lowering%20total%20alkalinity

  3. #3
    Senior Member bobodaclown's Avatar
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    Re: How much TA reduction with murayic acid

    Hello,
    I got my TA down to 80. It was pretty high. Follow these procedures:http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-...l%20alkalinity

    When you add the MA ensure your pump is on and pour it in front of the returns so it mixes quickly.
    17K Kidney Shaped Pool Concrete (Diamond Bright) Pool, 3/4 hp 2 speed 115V Sta-rite Duraglas PEA5D-180L/P2R5D-181L (Impeller C105-92PS Diffuser C1-216P), 1.5 piping, Pentair CC100 Filter , Heat Siphon 100K BTU Heat Pump Pool Heater, Flow meter Blue White Flowmeter Model No. F-30150P, Hayward Astrolight SP0581N, SWCG CPX36, SmartPool Nitro SmartKleen NC22 robotic pool cleaner, Lakeland Florida

  4. #4
    Senior Member Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: How much TA reduction with murayic acid

    http://www.poolcalculator.com/ is your friend.

    I just plugged in your numbers. To drive pH down to 7.2 will require just about a gallon of acid - that's 8 pints.
    Down near the bottom, it gives Effects of adding chemicals A gallon of 31.45% muriatic acid will lower pH by 2.28 and lower TA by 37. So you may not want to add it all at once; maybe half at a time, give it an hour or two to work between doses. And aerate. Also note the disclaimer: Note: pH calculations are not exact. These numbers are only suggestive of the relative magnitude of the pH change you can expect. Small changes, +-0.4, with pH between 7.2-7.8, TA around 80-120, and Borate near zero will be approximately correct. The further you go from those ranges the less these pH changes will correspond to reality.

    If a gallon of acid will drop TA by only 37....it's going to take a lot of acid to get it down to target range. So buy 3 or 4 gallons now; it has a long shelf life.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
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  5. #5
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    Re: How much TA reduction with murayic acid

    I see your CYA tested at 20. If that seems to be a valid value, that is, you have not recently added a bunch of CYA and it just isn't showing up on test yet, them you could use trichlor pucks for awhile. It is a luxury, so enjoy it. I suggest you use, your friend, the Pool Calculator, to see how many pucks you could use to get from 20 to 40 ppm CYA. Count those out and stop using that when they are done, go back to bleach. Pucks have the effect of wearing down TA. Or you could save them for a vacation, just know that your TA will be lower after a lot of them.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

  6. #6
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    Re: How much TA reduction with murayic acid

    Thanks for the advice of using pucks and not adding all at once. (sorry for the typo, I know it is muratic not murayic!)

    I have added 1 gallon over 24 hours, took the cover off and have it areating. Too bad it keeps raining, I should see what the TA is of rain water. It seems the combination of rain and aeration has kept my ph high.

    At least I don't have to worry about adding my horrible tap water!
    24' Round Diamond Star, 54" wall height, 200sq ft sta-rite cartridge filter
    Dynamo 1hp 2 speed pump, 199k Rheem milivolt heater
    Pool rover jr. - our best friend!
    Tf-100 plus borate strips and Taylor k1000.

  7. #7
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    Re: How much TA reduction with murayic acid

    Rain gives a lot of aeration if it is hard rain, raising pH. It also can give dilution if it is a lot of rain and the pool overflows, lowering TA and thus pH.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

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