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Thread: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

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    This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    Edit: I have created an in depth guide to cleaning and patching my DE filter grid mesh here: http://alilknowhow.com/2011/07/31/ho...l-filter-grid/

    The pool company came to open my pool the other day and I've been having problems. Just moved into this house, this pool company has been servicing this pool to open and close for the last 2 seasons. Last fall they setup new plumbing all around the filter (because it was all leaking) so I'd assume they would be pretty familiar with the setup. I am REALLY hoping this pool doesn't become a money pit. I sooo want to be able to enjoy it!

    • Dirty water comes back through the jets when I vacuum. My pool had a ton of silt and dust at the bottom. Running the vacuum just shot it straight back through the jets so that my water went from clear to cant even see bottom in about 20 minutes of cleaning.[/*:m:duphoeec]
    • Eventually started seeing tiny leaf particles come back through the jets (thats when I was like, ok thats definitely too big to make it through the DE filter properly). Had it set to Filter obviously. Leaf particles about 1/5 size of a dime. [/*:m:duphoeec]


    First time I had the dirty water jets, I did the backwash -> rinse, backwash -> rinse, backwash -> rinse as it says to on the side of the filter. PSI dropped from 24 to 14 (After waiting 5 minutes for DE to coat the grid). I vacuumed again for about 10 minutes and the PSI shot up to 24 PSI again pretty fast and the dirty water persisted.

    At this point I am starting to think that
    • DE Filter clogged with sludge[/*:m:duphoeec]
    • DE Filter improperly installed by pool company causing dirt to bypass somewhere.[/*:m:duphoeec]


    Below are pictures. Can you please help me figure out what is going on? Also, at this stage, should my Grid just lift straight out of there? Or do I need to unscrew anything else?
    This is what it looks like right after I perform the 3 cycle backwash -> rinse. All of the water that drained out of the bottom of the container before I opened it was crystal clear.



    16,000 gal in-ground
    Pump: Hayward C48K2N143 1HP 230V
    Filter: DE Triton Nautilus FNS-36

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    DE builds up inside the filter over time, no matter how much you backwash. The filter needs to be opened occasionally and fully cleaned out. The only thing that is obvious from the photos is that this hasn't been done in a while.

    There are usually two bolts in the center column that need to be removed before the grids lift out. Look carefully at the top of the center column and look for the bolts which may be covered with DE. Sometimes the bolts have plastic caps on them.

    From your description there is most likely a torn grid somewhere. You need to get the filter cleaned off and taken apart to find the problem.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    Quote Originally Posted by JasonLion
    DE builds up inside the filter over time, no matter how much you backwash. The filter needs to be opened occasionally and fully cleaned out. The only thing that is obvious from the photos is that this hasn't been done in a while.

    There are usually two bolts in the center column that need to be removed before the grids lift out. Look carefully at the top of the center column and look for the bolts which may be covered with DE. Sometimes the bolts have plastic caps on them.

    From your description there is most likely a torn grid somewhere. You need to get the filter cleaned off and taken apart to find the problem.
    YAY, I know how I'm spending my weekend

    Is this a good guide for cleaning a DE filter? http://www.troubleshooters.com/pool/de_ ... eaning.htm

    The thing has literally been running for about a total of 5 days this year. This is the second backwash. Is this not excessive buildup for this short amount of time? Do the grids look "caked" with algea? they certainly dont look like the white fabric I was imagining, but they could have been that dirty and crusty when it was put in the first time this year (having possibly never been properly cleaned before).
    16,000 gal in-ground
    Pump: Hayward C48K2N143 1HP 230V
    Filter: DE Triton Nautilus FNS-36

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    If the filter was cleaned over the winter I wouldn't expect it to be quite that dirty. I suspect it was not cleaned in some time.

    The link you gave for cleaning instructions looks good. They have a very through writeup. The fabric will never again be as bright white as it is in the pictures at that site after the first couple of months.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    EDIT: I have created an in-depth guide to my cleaning process here
    http://alilknowhow.com/2011/07/31/how-t ... lter-grid/

    Looks were deceptive. There was a ton of stuff caked on. Mind you the original picture is post 3 cycle backwashing (Backwash water almost clear).

    Heres pics of me in various phases of hosing it down.
    Soaking over night in a trash can full of water and dish detergent, a bit of Mr. Clean and some calcium dissolver. It was VERY greasy feeling.

    Before any hosing



    Started hosing it down - Difference - Wow the whole thing was caked with that ****


    Clean - Spent a long time getting in-between everything as well.


    Found that tiny hole that was letting dirt through - Will attempt to seal it with some hot glue and silicon caulking. Perhaps a patch with waterproof glue?
    16,000 gal in-ground
    Pump: Hayward C48K2N143 1HP 230V
    Filter: DE Triton Nautilus FNS-36

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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    You're missing the long threaded rods that hold the entire assembly together. Part # 40 in parts diagram (Exact part depends on the model number).

    The top manifold and the bottom assembly are removable so that you can clean the grids individually. The damaged grid can be replaced.

    http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/FNSOM.pdf

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    Join Date
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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    I would not patch the defective grid.
    You can replace the torn grid for around $25.

    Disassemble and carefully inspect each grid for signs of wear.
    If several grids are in poor condition, you can replace all 7 grids for around $125.

    Excellent job with the pictures and description.
    This post should be a good reference for future DE issues.

    PSG
    poolschoolgrad

    20x40 free-form IG vinyl, 1hp Hayward superpump, Hayward pro grid DE filter, Raypak heatpump, Goldline Aquarite SWCG, Polaris 280 with booster, and tested using a Taylor K2006.

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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    Quote Originally Posted by Poolschoolgrad
    I would not patch the defective grid.
    You can replace the torn grid for around $25.
    Why is that? I have read of people on this forum successfully patching them with hot glue and being good for quite a long time.

    Worse case is that it starts leaking again and I actually do have to replace it. But I'd rather save my money. I'm not exactly rolling in cash here :P


    Quote Originally Posted by JamesW
    You're missing the long threaded rods that hold the entire assembly together. Part # 40 in parts diagram (Exact part depends on the model number).

    The top manifold and the bottom assembly are removable so that you can clean the grids individually. The damaged grid can be replaced.

    http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/FNSOM.pdf
    Odd that I do not have these, hmmm. Where can I buy them online?

    And do I need them? There was another threaded rod with nut at the bottom that seemed to be holding everything together, but maybe that was for something else?
    16,000 gal in-ground
    Pump: Hayward C48K2N143 1HP 230V
    Filter: DE Triton Nautilus FNS-36

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    Join Date
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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    For me, the band-aid approach seems to always cost me more time and money in the long run than fixing the problem correctly the first time.
    $25 does not seem excessive to properly repair a $500 filter , but I understand every dollar counts.

    A damaged grid in the manifold area may be difficult to properly seal, but you can certainly give it a try.
    Worse case is you get to spend another weekend working on your filter and cleaning your pool instead of enjoying it.

    PSG
    poolschoolgrad

    20x40 free-form IG vinyl, 1hp Hayward superpump, Hayward pro grid DE filter, Raypak heatpump, Goldline Aquarite SWCG, Polaris 280 with booster, and tested using a Taylor K2006.

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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    http://www.poolplaza.com/C-Pentair-Filt ... -4143.html

    Unfortunately, they're expensive. You might be able to find threaded rod of the same size for less.

    http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/us ... ine+Thread

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    Join Date
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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    Boon, do you have a pentair or Hayward filter? I'm asking because you sig says Hayward but James is referencing a pentaire manual?
    15,600 Gallon, 16' x 32' In-Ground Vinyl Pool
    Pentair VS 3050 pump, Quad DE 60 filter and SunTouch controller
    8 gallon Liquidator, Aquatherm EcoSun Solar Panels, 2 wheel ThePoolCleaner

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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    Quote Originally Posted by carlscan26
    Boon, do you have a pentair or Hayward filter? I'm asking because you sig says Hayward but James is referencing a pentaire manual?
    OK just did some research and updated my signature with more accurate product models.
    http://www.poolcenter.com/parts_filter_ ... us_fns.htm
    16,000 gal in-ground
    Pump: Hayward C48K2N143 1HP 230V
    Filter: DE Triton Nautilus FNS-36

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    Re: This doesnt look right. DE Grid after Backwash (PICS)

    I think that the manufacturer was originally Purex, which was acquired by Pac-Fab, which is now owned by Pentair.

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