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Thread: Filter Suggestions...

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    Filter Suggestions...

    I have only had my AGP for a few months and already hate the filter system it came with. It is manufactured by Waterway, it's labeled "Millenium Ulitimate Filtration" and marked FC125. I HATE it!! The 2hp, two speed pump is fine, and seems overpowered for the filter when on HI speed. My setup looks exactly like this:


    My two biggest complaints with the filter are:
    1. When vacuuming, it pumps everything right back into the pool, even the insect chitin gets pumped back in!
    2. The interior wall of the filter element is like a PVC pipe with holes drilled in it, not very cooperative for cleaning!

    I am now very, VERY seriously considering something different, and looking for advice. I still have my aged Hayward IGP sand filter, and have entertained trying to include it into the plan, but it still puts me at requiring a new valve assembly or rebuilding the one it currently has (stuck on backwash). If I did use the sand filter, I have entertained the idea of simply putting it inline between the pump and current cartridge filter (using the cartridge to help keep sand out of the pool). The old 1hp pump still works fine, thought about incorporating it, don't know if it's worth it or not, maybe as just a booster pump for an aerator or something.

    What advice can anyone give on converting/upgrading/othwise-modifying my setup for improved function, reliability, and less headache? I'm not overly budget-constrained, but I am a tight-wad who doesn't like spending much more than absolutely necessary. What say ye?
    "The Lake" - 42'x18'x52" Vinyl AGP @ approx 23,000 gal.
    500lb Hayward S310T Sand Filter and Waterway FC125 Cartridge Filter
    2hp - 2 speed pump (110v, 14.4a high, 4.4a low) TF-100 Test Kit

  2. Back To Top    #2

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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    After making Google earn it's keep, I'm leaning more towards the idea of plumbing in a sand filter between the pump and cart filter. This should make it a multi-stage filter, of sorts, right? Let the sand do the heavy work, let the cart do the polishing? Plus I can plumb the backwash from the sand to catch in a large tub, so it can off-gas the chlorine and then use that waste water to feed my citrus trees.

    I get the idea that maybe I should also consider an additional skimmer and outlet, assuming my 2hp pump is actually a 2hp, not just an over-rated 1/1.5hp. Not too happy that there's only about 16" between current skimmer/outlet location, anyways. That's what happens when you aren't there when the contractors are doing the install, I guess.

    What is a suggested sand filter size for 21k+ gallons? 200lb?
    "The Lake" - 42'x18'x52" Vinyl AGP @ approx 23,000 gal.
    500lb Hayward S310T Sand Filter and Waterway FC125 Cartridge Filter
    2hp - 2 speed pump (110v, 14.4a high, 4.4a low) TF-100 Test Kit

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    duraleigh's Avatar
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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    My first thought is that the filter is not working properly. It sounds like it needs cleaning more often. I'm not a cartridge guy so others may be more help but I would explore that avenue first before you get a new filter.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    Quote Originally Posted by duraleigh
    It sounds like it needs cleaning more often.
    I wish that were the case. I have two cartridges, and swap them twice a week. Once on the weekend, once during the week. I have a HUGE insect load on the system. My pool is a more effective means of insect population control than both of my industrial-size looking bug zappers! I entertain the thought of putting a skimmer sock in, but fear I would starve the pump while I am at work during the day, due to the sheer number of bugs.
    "The Lake" - 42'x18'x52" Vinyl AGP @ approx 23,000 gal.
    500lb Hayward S310T Sand Filter and Waterway FC125 Cartridge Filter
    2hp - 2 speed pump (110v, 14.4a high, 4.4a low) TF-100 Test Kit

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    If it's passing stuff back to the pool then there's something not right in the filter. Either the cartridge has a tear in it or the unit isn't assembled correctly. Either way, to use it at all you're going to have to repair whatever's wrong with it. If you decide to use the sand filter (that would be my choice) I'd just remove the cartridge and place the sand filter in it's place. Leaving it in place when it's bypassing stuff doesn't help anything.

    Either repair or replace the multiport and go with the sand.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    bobodaclown's Avatar
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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    Is your filter seated properly. It sounds like it might not be or there's a rip/tear/hole in the filter media.
    17K Kidney Shaped Pool Concrete (Diamond Bright) Pool, 3/4 hp 2 speed 115V Sta-rite Duraglas PEA5D-180L/P2R5D-181L (Impeller C105-92PS Diffuser C1-216P), 1.5 piping, Pentair CC100 Filter , Heat Siphon 100K BTU Heat Pump Pool Heater, Flow meter Blue White Flowmeter Model No. F-30150P, Hayward Astrolight SP0581N, SWCG CalimarTitanium Edition TE45 , Dolphin Nautilus Plus with CleverClean, Lakeland Florida

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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    I'm going to investigate the filter tomorrow, see if it is a mechanical issue with the filter or just an issue with how it is seated between the base and lid of the housing.

    I'm also going to try to find time to tear into the old sand filter and give it a good inspection. The I.D. plate is still on the valve, so I still have the model and other info to search the interwarb for diagrams and parts.
    "The Lake" - 42'x18'x52" Vinyl AGP @ approx 23,000 gal.
    500lb Hayward S310T Sand Filter and Waterway FC125 Cartridge Filter
    2hp - 2 speed pump (110v, 14.4a high, 4.4a low) TF-100 Test Kit

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    Zombie Thread

    My job being what it is, it takes me away for a while. I don't know if reviving old threads are frowned upon, but since the applicable information is already in this thread, and the topic is still, well, the topic, I figured I'd just pick it back up and keep going.

    Since the last post (last year), I found the problem that I was having to be a fitment issue with the aftermarket filter. The diameter of the sealing surface on the replacement filter was approximately 1/8" larger than the factory cartridge filter. This allowed stuff as large as a winged ant to simply bypass the filter cartridge and be returned to the pool.

    Long story short, I'm over the cartridge entirely.

    I do like the pump. Two stage, 2hp on high. Has given me no issues.

    I'm ready to install a sand filter. I had played with the idea of rebuilding the Hayward that was on our IGP, but may not now that I have found the 'fingers' to be in bad shape, and haven't (for lack of looking) located a rebuild kit for the valve assy. Thinking I may as well just buy one to start with and go from there.

    So that brings me to my this; are there any particular suggestions on brand/style/etc.? Should I go for a matched kit of some type (pump and filter) and reuse my current pump for a water feature or added circulation? What should I expect to reasonably invest into a new filter system, considering I will be doing the installation myself?

    What say ye?
    "The Lake" - 42'x18'x52" Vinyl AGP @ approx 23,000 gal.
    500lb Hayward S310T Sand Filter and Waterway FC125 Cartridge Filter
    2hp - 2 speed pump (110v, 14.4a high, 4.4a low) TF-100 Test Kit

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    If you're happy with the pump you have there's no reason to change it out. For a pool your size I'd recommend a sand filter in the 250 to 300 lb range. Especially with that 2hp pump. Hayward and Pentair both make good filters in that size. I have a Pentair Sand Dollar and it's been fine since I've owned it but I'm sure Hayward is as good and reliable. I'd go with whichever I could get the best deal on and whichever parts are locally availaible (in case you ever needed a part in a hurry).
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    Thanks for the quick reply!

    I'm going to stop today on the way home and see what they have at the local chem shop, and do some price comparisons. I'll report back with what is available on the floor down here and post it up for replies.
    "The Lake" - 42'x18'x52" Vinyl AGP @ approx 23,000 gal.
    500lb Hayward S310T Sand Filter and Waterway FC125 Cartridge Filter
    2hp - 2 speed pump (110v, 14.4a high, 4.4a low) TF-100 Test Kit

  11. Back To Top    #11
    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    If it was just the cartridge media that was causing a problem, why not just get the correct cartridge? A properly function cartridge filter should filter better than a typical sand filter (10 vs 40 microns).
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985
    If it was just the cartridge media that was causing a problem, why not just get the correct cartridge?
    It's mainly a problem of cleaning the cartridge. There's no way to wash the cartridge from the inside-out, leaving you to try to force the debris that doesn't wash off, to wash through. Not only that, but the filter housing uses a massive 24"-ish diameter 1/4" O-ring that is a massive PITA to deal with. Nothing about the setup of the filter seemed to have any end-user ease-of-use in mind.

    If the replacement cartridges were economically priced, then my level of patience would increase, but if memory serves, the last one I bought was $88. I don't remember the name of the aftermarket cartridge, but it was the only one I could find for this model filter, aside from the cartridge that came with the filter (which I made the pool store swap me the filter out of the display model for the aftermarket one that wasn't even filtering ants).

    If I found a quality cartridge filter that gave me the end-user warm and fuzzies, I'd still want the primary filtering to be done by sand, so that I could backwash. I'd put the cartridge filter in line between the sand filter and the pool. Basically using it as a water polisher, and catching what was too small for the sand to capture (and catching any escaping sand before it got to the pool).
    "The Lake" - 42'x18'x52" Vinyl AGP @ approx 23,000 gal.
    500lb Hayward S310T Sand Filter and Waterway FC125 Cartridge Filter
    2hp - 2 speed pump (110v, 14.4a high, 4.4a low) TF-100 Test Kit

  13. Back To Top    #13
    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    Have you tried following the cartridge filter cleaning recommendations in Pool School?

    Pool School Filter Cleaning

    I have had a cartridge going on 7 years now. I clean it once a year now and it has four cartridges which usually take about 10 miniutes each to clean. As outlined in the Pool School procedure, there is a technique for cleaning cartridges which makes it fairly easy. The really tough dirt/stains can be removed by an overnight soak in dishwasher detergent.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    linen's Avatar
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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    I am not a total fan of cartridges either (sand on pool, cart on ht) but since you are not into spending money needlessly...I am curious how often you have to clean it and what filter pressures do you have before and after cleaning? Is the problem that you are getting too much debris in your pool and having to vacuum all the time? If that is the case, maybe try a pressure side cleaner instead of a vacuum side? Also putting a sock on your skimmer basket can reduce how much big junk gets into your pump basket and filter.

    The link mas posted is a good one. My personal experience may be the exception (and it is for a hot tub cart that is fairly small...I think 25 sqft), but for cleaning I just spray in between each pleat top to down twice on my cartridge, then I usually do not worry about it anymore.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    I've really kicked this around for too long without taking any real action. Today starts the process of replacing the horrible cartridge system with the former IGP's 500# sand filter.

    The laterals and stand pipe turned out to be in great shape after taking the time to clean them. The tank is a Hayward S310T, and I've replaced the cracked 2" top valve assembly with a new 1.5" Hayward SP0714T Vari-Flo XL (for less than the cost of repairing the crack and rebuilding the 2").

    I'll start a new thread for this process and photo-document it as I go. Wish me luck!
    "The Lake" - 42'x18'x52" Vinyl AGP @ approx 23,000 gal.
    500lb Hayward S310T Sand Filter and Waterway FC125 Cartridge Filter
    2hp - 2 speed pump (110v, 14.4a high, 4.4a low) TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    Can you please help me. I have this same exact filter and we threw the Cartridge filter away. On the unit there is a sticker with the FC125 but I can't find it anywhere on line to replace because I don't have the measurements. If you can shoot me a link to where to purchase, or if you have measurements, I would so appreciate it. I haven't had an issues with ours, but we have a small 18ft. x 54 in pool. Good luck and thanks for any help. I have called the place where we bought the pool but they are of no help. I'm so frustrated.

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    Mod Squad JohnT's Avatar
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    Re: Filter Suggestions...

    Quote Originally Posted by hernandez05 View Post
    Can you please help me. I have this same exact filter and we threw the Cartridge filter away. On the unit there is a sticker with the FC125 but I can't find it anywhere on line to replace because I don't have the measurements. If you can shoot me a link to where to purchase, or if you have measurements, I would so appreciate it. I haven't had an issues with ours, but we have a small 18ft. x 54 in pool. Good luck and thanks for any help. I have called the place where we bought the pool but they are of no help. I'm so frustrated.
    Welcome to TFP!

    The OP on this thread hasn't been active on the forum for some time, so you probably won't hear back. Hopefully someone else can help.
    TFP Moderator
    20K Gallon 20X36 Vinyl Inground
    Hayward S244T Sand Filter with 1HP Whisperflo Pump. Liquidator C-201 and Solar Heat

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