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Thread: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    May 2011
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    Miami, FL
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    Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    I have my navigator running daily with about 10 hose segments (plenty of length) without the heavier header, and I notice the same behavior on most days:

    1) Gets stuck suctioning over the main drain cover
    2) Repeats the same circular pattern
    3) If the hose gets tangled, it goes into a weird pattern and doesnt reach everywhere.
    4) Upon turning at the top of the pool, it occasionally just floats up there. Could this be caused by not having the heavier header segment?

    I looked for some type of swivel hose adapter on ebay, and I came across 2 items:
    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=STRK:MEWAX:IT which is recommended for manual cleaners, and this monster

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

    It looks fancy, motorized, and, based on the description, awesome.
    Is it overkill? Does anyone else have it?
    Or do I just have cheap hoses that dont bend much?
    What can I do to "avoid" the main drain? Can I cover it with something since I dont use it much?

    I thank
    16,900 gallon inground pool (16x30 with spa bench)
    Sta-rite cartridge filter
    Diamondbrite surface, redone in 2017.
    1.5hp Hayward Super Pump
    Hayward Navigator Pro suction cleaner with V-flex kit

  2. Back To Top    #2

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    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    There are snap on covers that divert pool cleaners. The look like a skimmer vac plate upside down. Dunno if there's one made for your drain since you don't mention the make.
    You should set up that navigator with the proper first hose. None of those hoses should tangle period. If they are it means you are probably coiling up the hose when the unit is not in the pool. That..is a no no. Those hose sections need to be straight to work. A slight curve and it's time to replace it. You can try to avoid that by laying the entire hose out straight in the sun for a few days but in my experience, it doesn't work very often. When not in use, either unhook the hose sections and store flat or if you have the room, lay it out intact in a straight line beside the pool. One thing you should check frequently is the screen at the rear of the unit. That's the intake for the turbine that causes the head to swivel. If it's even partially blocked with debris, it can cause the Nav to behave strangely. Check it's feet too. Those pads wear and need replacement every few years. If what I described about the hose sections being curved doesn't apply to you and you've investigated my other suggestions..then of the two options you linked to in your post...that back up valve will do the trick. That one seems to be a generic one. Kreepy Krauly makes one I'd be more comfortable with quality wise and I know works well.
    15' x 42" Intex Easy Set Blue Blob AGP, 3100gal, Intex SWCG Titanium
    Hayward EC-30 DE/40GPM

  3. Back To Top    #3

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    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    excellent reply. Thank you. By your comments I assume then that it's bad practice to leave the cleaner and hoses in the pool everyday. Since the pump runs and cleans everyday, I just leave it in the pool, sometimes coiled or bent. Bad idea?

    I will look for the drain cover. Thanks a lot.
    16,900 gallon inground pool (16x30 with spa bench)
    Sta-rite cartridge filter
    Diamondbrite surface, redone in 2017.
    1.5hp Hayward Super Pump
    Hayward Navigator Pro suction cleaner with V-flex kit

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    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    Quote Originally Posted by nabril15
    excellent reply. Thank you. By your comments I assume then that it's bad practice to leave the cleaner and hoses in the pool everyday. Since the pump runs and cleans everyday, I just leave it in the pool, sometimes coiled or bent. Bad idea?

    I will look for the drain cover. Thanks a lot.
    No, you can leave it in 24/7 if you want but the minute you have a hose section that has curled and stays that way when you unhook it from the rest of the hose....it's time to replace it. The same goes for Kreepys ,Barracudas and Polaris suction line cleaners. Curves in a hose section don't let the cleaner do it's job properly. Many people DON'T read the section in their manuals regarding hose section care. If you pull it outta the pool...DON'T coil it up. Either disassemble it or lay it it straight. When it's out of the pool, that hose gets heat from the sun. Whatever way you store it...that plastic will retain the memory of that shape. Store it coiled..it'll be coiled. Store it straight, it'll stay straight. In the pool you don't get that warming. Before you do anything else, take apart your hose and check for curved sections. Replace those that are and you'll probably find the Nav works much better and probably won't even get stuck on your main drain.
    15' x 42" Intex Easy Set Blue Blob AGP, 3100gal, Intex SWCG Titanium
    Hayward EC-30 DE/40GPM

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    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    subapoolguy---i had my son go down to look at the drain cover, and both he and I can see an H on it. He said there are some numbers, but he couldnt make them out. Probably Hayward, right?

    I searched for hayward drain covers, and I get this:
    http://www.amazon.com/Hayward-WGX1048E- ... B003HTWZSQ

    I dont know if this replaces what I have, or if it goes over it.
    If you happen to know what I should get, kindly send me a link.

    thank you
    16,900 gallon inground pool (16x30 with spa bench)
    Sta-rite cartridge filter
    Diamondbrite surface, redone in 2017.
    1.5hp Hayward Super Pump
    Hayward Navigator Pro suction cleaner with V-flex kit

  6. Back To Top    #6

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    I found a company that sells an inexpensive easy to install "clip" that snaps onto your existing main drain cover. There is no need to remove the drain cover. You can install the clip by hand (swim down and install it), or you can use a "installation tool" that fits onto your pool utility pole. If you use the installation tool, you can install the clip from the side of the pool without getting into the water.

    If the clip is kicked off the drain cover, it floats and is easily retrieved (probably from the skimmer).

    The name of the company is "Main Drain Clip-On". website is http://www.maindrainclipon.com

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    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    Quote Originally Posted by hmalbaugh
    I found a company that sells an inexpensive easy to install "clip" that snaps onto your existing main drain cover. There is no need to remove the drain cover. You can install the clip by hand (swim down and install it), or you can use a "installation tool" that fits onto your pool utility pole. If you use the installation tool, you can install the clip from the side of the pool without getting into the water.
    If the clip is kicked off the drain cover, it floats and is easily retrieved (probably from the skimmer).
    The name of the company is "Main Drain Clip-On". website is http://www.maindrainclipon.com
    thank you hm.
    I see that this clips on to the cover along the middle (center radius) of the cover. If my Navigator comes at the cover from the side, it will hit this clip. Ok, but won't it just get stuck against the clip still suctioning over the holes?
    Do you have it installed? Does it work? What drain cover type do you have?
    16,900 gallon inground pool (16x30 with spa bench)
    Sta-rite cartridge filter
    Diamondbrite surface, redone in 2017.
    1.5hp Hayward Super Pump
    Hayward Navigator Pro suction cleaner with V-flex kit

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    I have a Style A cover in my pool. The Navigator does not get stuck on the cover after I installed the clip. When the navigator approaches from the side (90-degrees to the clip), it will sit there for a few minutes and then will redirect itself. The Navigator has a gear box inside and the normal sequencing of the gears redirects the cleaner off the cover.

    I have not had any problems since I installed the clip.

  9. Back To Top    #9

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    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    thanks hm. I just checked out the clip--wow, $32. Being the innovator that I try to be, and since I just bought this house and cash is very low, I am going to try a home remedy. I came across these plastic domes that are used as door stops. They feel fairly solid, look easy to screw to the drain cover, and cost $4 for a pair. I figure that if I screw on 4 of them in a + pattern, that will keep the navigator out, and if someone steps on them, they will not get cut.

    [attachment=0:16ycpmz6]dome.jpg[/attachment:16ycpmz6]
    16,900 gallon inground pool (16x30 with spa bench)
    Sta-rite cartridge filter
    Diamondbrite surface, redone in 2017.
    1.5hp Hayward Super Pump
    Hayward Navigator Pro suction cleaner with V-flex kit

  10. Back To Top    #10

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    Miami, FL
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    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    I followed the instructions above and those on the Hayward FAQ:
    Checked all hose segments---mostly straight.
    Replaced feet, and wont climb walls like before. Maybe they have to get broken in.
    Held cleaner by the neck, and it spins to one side. A few minutes later, it spins to the other side. I took it appart and all parts are in good shape and not too worn out.
    I ordered a header hose and some other segments to give it a little more length. Those arrive soon.

    It still spins in circles.
    What else can I try? Before spending $300 or more on a new one, I guess I can have the cleaner checked out at my local pool store. But when I took it apart it looked fine.
    16,900 gallon inground pool (16x30 with spa bench)
    Sta-rite cartridge filter
    Diamondbrite surface, redone in 2017.
    1.5hp Hayward Super Pump
    Hayward Navigator Pro suction cleaner with V-flex kit

  11. Back To Top    #11

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    Location
    North Port, FL.
    Posts
    5

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    I know this is an old post but figured id chime in on the circles. I had a navigator that did the same thing. nothing but circles. I figured what the heck do I have to loose by taking it apart. Just a few screws. and Youtube is your best friend for stuff.

    Well one of the wheels on the A-Arm had a flat spot.



    Now when his happens it will not rotate the feet like it should.

    I lucked out and found a navigator for parts on clist for $10 swapped out complete a arms and back up and running.

    anyways just figured id help out for anyone else in the future who searches for similar problems.
    12x27 pebble tec , Hayward 1hp pump / Hayward Star Cleaner +(MD# C900) / Pentair MD#320 auto inline CF

  12. Back To Top    #12

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    Quote Originally Posted by nabril15
    thanks hm. I just checked out the clip--wow, $32. Being the innovator that I try to be, and since I just bought this house and cash is very low, I am going to try a home remedy. I came across these plastic domes that are used as door stops. They feel fairly solid, look easy to screw to the drain cover, and cost $4 for a pair. I figure that if I screw on 4 of them in a + pattern, that will keep the navigator out, and if someone steps on them, they will not get cut.

    [attachment=0:yj7lz7hz]dome.jpg[/attachment:yj7lz7hz]

    Having same issue that I'm sure everyone has with auto cleaners getting stuck on bottom drains. Just wondering how this worked for you and how you attached them to the drains to ensure that whatever you attach them with doesn't eventually corrode and wide up in my pump or lodged in a line. Will stainless bolts/nuts be a long term good fastener to use?
    Pool: 30,000 gal concrete with 600 gal Spa, 1.5 HP Pump (2.0 max), Citadel III 400,000 BTU gas heater, Apollo 52 SF DE Filter. (All equipment OEM Anthony Pools circa 1980 from Pentair), Aquabot.
    Pond: 2500 gal, 3/4 HP Hayward Max Flow, Hayward Star Clear 750 Prefilter, Emperor Aquatics BioPro Filter, Tetra UV Light.

  13. Back To Top    #13

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    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    Quote Originally Posted by lhowerton
    Quote Originally Posted by nabril15
    thanks hm. I just checked out the clip--wow, $32. Being the innovator that I try to be, and since I just bought this house and cash is very low, I am going to try a home remedy. I came across these plastic domes that are used as door stops. They feel fairly solid, look easy to screw to the drain cover, and cost $4 for a pair. I figure that if I screw on 4 of them in a + pattern, that will keep the navigator out, and if someone steps on them, they will not get cut.

    [attachment=0:3gshni9t]dome.jpg[/attachment:3gshni9t]

    Having same issue that I'm sure everyone has with auto cleaners getting stuck on bottom drains. Just wondering how this worked for you and how you attached them to the drains to ensure that whatever you attach them with doesn't eventually corrode and wide up in my pump or lodged in a line. Will stainless bolts/nuts be a long term good fastener to use?
    I used stainless steels screws to attach them to the drain cover, and I aligned them in a cross pattern. However, after a few weeks I noticed that if the navigator came straight at one of them, or in between 2 of them, it got stuck forever. Yes, it's supposed to turn after a few minutes, but if it catches these domes at a certain angle, it just stays there for a long time. I removed them, and now it gets caught on the cover, but it eventyally rolls over the cover. They sell other covers that are more expensive. I think that letting it roll over the cover is your safest bet.
    16,900 gallon inground pool (16x30 with spa bench)
    Sta-rite cartridge filter
    Diamondbrite surface, redone in 2017.
    1.5hp Hayward Super Pump
    Hayward Navigator Pro suction cleaner with V-flex kit

  14. Back To Top    #14

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    Thanks for the reply. My cleaner is a Dolphin track machine, and when it gets stuck it will sit there forever so gotta do something. May have to opt for dual clips on each drain. I have dual main drains.
    Pool: 30,000 gal concrete with 600 gal Spa, 1.5 HP Pump (2.0 max), Citadel III 400,000 BTU gas heater, Apollo 52 SF DE Filter. (All equipment OEM Anthony Pools circa 1980 from Pentair), Aquabot.
    Pond: 2500 gal, 3/4 HP Hayward Max Flow, Hayward Star Clear 750 Prefilter, Emperor Aquatics BioPro Filter, Tetra UV Light.

  15. Back To Top    #15

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Miami, FL
    Posts
    256

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    I am not familiar with your cleaner, but maybe attaching 8 of these domes will work better. I did a + pattern with my 4, but perhaps you can do a + pattern, turn 45 degrees, and then another +. That would ensure that your cleaner will not get caught/wedged between 2 of them, like it did with mine.
    16,900 gallon inground pool (16x30 with spa bench)
    Sta-rite cartridge filter
    Diamondbrite surface, redone in 2017.
    1.5hp Hayward Super Pump
    Hayward Navigator Pro suction cleaner with V-flex kit

  16. Back To Top    #16

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    Ohhh, good idea. Will do!

    Thanks!
    Pool: 30,000 gal concrete with 600 gal Spa, 1.5 HP Pump (2.0 max), Citadel III 400,000 BTU gas heater, Apollo 52 SF DE Filter. (All equipment OEM Anthony Pools circa 1980 from Pentair), Aquabot.
    Pond: 2500 gal, 3/4 HP Hayward Max Flow, Hayward Star Clear 750 Prefilter, Emperor Aquatics BioPro Filter, Tetra UV Light.

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    My navigator started doing circles awhile back. Turns out one of the a-frames snapped in half. I would check the a frames out very carefully. And for not climbing the walls, the flaps may need an ajustment.
    Pool Type: Intex 16' Ultra Frame 48" Deep
    Mods: Upgraded Filter, Modified inlet/outlet (Soon to be hard plumbed and in wall skimmer)
    Filter: 18" ClearWater Sand Filter
    Pump: 1HP Waterway 1 Speed, About 80 GPM
    Years in Use: 2

  18. Back To Top    #18

    Re: Hayward Navigator doing some circles

    I have found that the screws that attach the foot pods to the A frame axles need to be kept tight. These are the screws under the snap on covers on the sides of the pods. If one side is slightly loose, an imbalance in drive force will result. Your Navi will drive in circles even if it passes all the other tests: check for curved hoses, A frames & internal bearings good, spin left/right when held by the inlet neck, drive feet in good shape etc. I have found it is best just to check the tightness of the screws on both sides and not try to judge if they are okay by moving/ rocking the pods. I have left off the snap covers/plugs to facilitate checking the snugness of these fasteners. Good luck!

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