Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

  1. Back To Top    #1
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    OK!My pool was basically a swamp this spring.I knew it was going to be a bear to get straighten out,but this is turning out to be a GRIZZLY!The pool is and has been milky(6 inches visibility) , has suds on surface and has not held chlorine in weeks.

    As a last ditch effort I ......went to the pool store The guy said it was probably nitrates,that nitrates would cause a pool not to hold chlorine.He tested and it had 5 on nitrates.They said I needed to SHOCK the **** out of it and sold me $60 worth of cal-hypo.
    Now,Im reading that you cannot shock out nitrates.That the only way to get rid of nitrates is to drain,ion resins,ozone or uv..ALSO,Im reading that 5 is not all that high of a number for nitrates.So,are nitrates my problem?If so,can they be "shocked out." Another ? I have is after all this shocking,why am I still showing Combined Chlorine?
    Day before yesterday I added 12lbs of 73% cal-hypo and 4 182oz jugs of 6% bleach.Yesterday I added 4 182oz jugs of 6% bleach.
    The #'s as of this morning
    FC-15
    CC-1
    PH-7.4
    CH-130
    CYA-25
    TA-100
    bout 25000gal vinyl

    In the past month I've added 25lbs of dichlor,at least 50gal bleach and 12lbs %73 cal-hypo
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  2. Back To Top    #2
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Nitrates are not a problem. It doesn't matter what the nitrate level is. CC at 1 is a small problem, so you should be shocking, but I doubt you will need to shock for very much longer.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  3. Back To Top    #3
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    ok!I just added 4 more big bottles of %6 and will test and add 4 more this evening
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  4. Back To Top    #4
    Mod Squad JohnT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    SW Indiana
    Posts
    9,089

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Quote Originally Posted by buzzbait00
    ok!I just added 4 more big bottles of %6 and will test and add 4 more this evening
    Don't wait that long to test if you don't have to. Sometimes you will use it up in an hour or two. If you show it any mercy it will just keep growing. You want to knock it down and keep kicking it!
    TFP Moderator
    20K Gallon 20X36 Vinyl Inground
    Hayward S244T Sand Filter with 1HP Whisperflo Pump. Liquidator C-201 and Solar Heat

  5. Back To Top    #5
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Added 4 big bottles and waited 2 hours then tested.Its at 20 with a cc of .5
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  6. Back To Top    #6

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Posts
    4,052

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Sounds like you are about ready to start doing your overnight FC loss tests! What is the water looking like now?
    Built in 1957 44,000 gallon in-ground, Wet Edge Primera Stone in Sky Blue, Intelliflo VF Pump, 600 lb. Pentair Triton II TR-100 Sand Filter, CircuPool RG 60 Plus SWG, TF-100 test kit
    If TFP has helped you, please click to SUPPORT TFP!

  7. Back To Top    #7
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    The same-milky,about 6in of visibility
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    San Rafael, CA USA
    Posts
    12,082

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Quote Originally Posted by buzzbait00
    They said I needed to SHOCK the **** out of it and sold me $60 worth of cal-hypo.
    Now,Im reading that you cannot shock out nitrates.That the only way to get rid of nitrates is to drain,ion resins,ozone or uv..
    Just to set the record straight, nitrates can only be removed by water dilution with water lower in nitrates. There are specizlized ion exchange resins that remove nitrates (and sulfates) exchanging them with chloride. However, ozone and UV will not do anything to nitrates since that is already the most oxidized form of nitrogen. You don't need to worry about nitrates for the same reason you don't need to worry about phosphates. Chlorine will prevent algae growth regardless of such algae nutrient levels if your FC is appropriate for your CYA level.
    16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
    12 Fafco solar panels; Purex Triton PowerMax 250 natural gas heater (200,000 BTU/hr output); automatic electric pool safety cover; 4-wheel pressure-side "The Pool Cleaner"

  9. Back To Top    #9
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Added 4 more big bottles of 6% yesterday evening.Total chlorine went from 22 to 17 over night with a CC of 1.
    This has been going on for some time now,It just won't stop using chlorine
    I still don't understand the cc of 1.As high and as long as I've held the FC shouldn't the CC be gone?
    The water still looks the same.
    Is their something Im missing?
    Could it have something to do with my low CH?Thats the only parameter i know of thats way off.
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  10. Back To Top    #10
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    No, it has nothing to do with CH.

    CC is constantly being both created and destroyed. Somewhere there is a reservoir of organic debris that is using up chlorine and constantly recreating CC.

    Have you been brushing the pool? Now would be a good time to do a really through brushing, and to look in obscure places where algae might be hiding out.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  11. Back To Top    #11
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    I've been brushing but its hard to get everywhere when i can't see the bottom.Seems to be white powder on the bottom or something.Last time i vaccumed the pressure went up but I was watching the cap, nothing green came through the line it just got real cloudy.Is it possible i have massive amounts of dead algae in the pool(thus the milky water) and my filter is not taking it out so the chlorine is working hard to try to break it down?Should I try clarifier or sink and sweep?
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  12. Back To Top    #12

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Denton, TX
    Posts
    5,061

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Cloudy water can indicate dead algae in suspension. If it is in fact, dead algae, more filter time is what is needed since dead algae cannot be made more dead by high FC levels. Filter time is what is needed but that determination can only be made once we are certain that the organics in the water have been killed. It is the overnight FC loss test that allows one to confirm this.

  13. Back To Top    #13
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Quote Originally Posted by 257WbyMag
    Cloudy water can indicate dead algae in suspension. If it is in fact, dead algae, more filter time is what is needed since dead algae cannot be made more dead by high FC levels. Filter time is what is needed but that determination can only be made once we are certain that the organics in the water have been killed. It is the overnight FC loss test that allows one to confirm this.
    but Im thinking something other that organics that is not letting me hold FC givin the MASSIVE amounts i've put in
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  14. Back To Top    #14
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Well, it depends on just how much stuff is in the water. A normal amount of after algae bloom debris wouldn't be enough to use 4 ppm of chlorine overnight. But you are cleaning up from a major green swamp, so perhaps there is enough more than usual to cause that. I suspect debris on the bottom of the pool is more likely than stuff in suspension causing problems.

    If I am reading correctly, you haven't been at this all that long yet, three or four days. Give the filter some time to do it's job, and get everything solid you possibly can out of the pool. Brushing is very important and scooping out anything you can catch with a leaf rake will also help significantly.

    From what you have said, this isn't what we would call a massive cleanup. I reserve that for people who have piles of bleach bottles larger than the average SUV Cleaning up a green swamp takes some time.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  15. Back To Top    #15
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    22 yesterday eve at dark,17 at sunrise and now at 3:00 its at 10
    This has been going on for at least a week.
    I don't think it's debris or algae sucking up all the FC.Im not getting anything in the leaf net.
    Maybe its like Chemgeek's ammonia problem?
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  16. Back To Top    #16

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    If you have debris in the pool, the chlorine is trying to break that stuff into nothingness. You've got to, got to, got to get all the debris out of the pool.
    23,000 gallon in ground pool with rock waterfall and spillover spa, Aqualink control system, Polaris 380 cleaner, Purex Triton Clean&Clear Plus cartridge filter. Located in The Woodlands, Texas.

    Pool owner since Nov 2008, Trouble Free since April 2009. Happy to help when I can.

  17. Back To Top    #17
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Ammonia reacts with FC extremely quickly. If you had ammonia, FC would be zero.

    It seems like you are making definite progress, a loss of only 4 overnight isn't that bad. Hopefully you won't lose anything tonight, or at least lose less tonight.

    Meanwhile, how is your filter doing? Have you needed to clean the filter recently?
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  18. Back To Top    #18
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    I brushed yesterday and the filter is up from 21 psi to 29 psi but im not going to backwash yet.Fixin to add 8gal 6% bleach.
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  19. Back To Top    #19
    buzzbait00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    North Alabama
    Posts
    75

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    oh!I tested with my aquarium ammonia kit and it read 0
    36x18,MAYBE 27000gal?,VINYL.3/4 HP,PAC-FAB SUPER FLO SAND FILTER

  20. Back To Top    #20

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    San Rafael, CA USA
    Posts
    12,082

    Re: To drain or not to drain for Nitrates

    Quote Originally Posted by buzzbait00
    oh!I tested with my aquarium ammonia kit and it read 0
    Just so you know, ammonia test kits actually test the sum of ammonia AND monochloramine. They work by adding some Dichlor to the sample which converts any ammonia to monochloramine and then the test dye indicator actually measures the resulting monochloramine, though reports as ppm N for ammonia. 5 ppm CC as monochloramine would show up as 1 ppm N ammonia.
    16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
    12 Fafco solar panels; Purex Triton PowerMax 250 natural gas heater (200,000 BTU/hr output); automatic electric pool safety cover; 4-wheel pressure-side "The Pool Cleaner"

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •