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Thread: Heater shutting down SWG

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    Aquatica's Avatar
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    Heater shutting down SWG

    This is a strange one. Everytime I cut on gas powered heater, after a while, the cell current goes above 8.0 and SWG shuts off and shows "Hi Salt".

    I'm thinking there is a short somewhere and it is somehow connected with the gas heater.

    System was down all week while guests were in the pool and heater was on. Prior to guests visit SWG was ok. after guests left heater was shut off and I noticed the SWG was working again and "Hi Salt" was gone.

    So this morning I turned on the heater and waited like 15 minutes but SWG was still working so left and came back late afternoon and SWG was off and showing "Hi Salt" again.

    Anyone got any idea whats going on?

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Who is the maker of SWG???

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by Keven
    Who is the maker of SWG???
    Hayward Aqua Rite with T15 cell and V1.40

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    When the pool water is warmer it conducts electricity better, just as it would if there was more salt in the water. Combinations of somewhat high water temperature and somewhat high salt levels will be seen as the same by the SWG as too much salt.

    There are a couple of aspects to this. One possibility is that the heater is raising the water temperature coming out of the heater by more than it should be, perhaps because the flow rate is too low. Another is that the salt level might be almost too high, so it only takes a little warmth to go over the limit. Another possibility is that the cell is not properly calibrated and is turning off even when the actual current is acceptable, though this is less likely than the other two.
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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Sequentially press the diagnostic button and post the following
    1. Water temp
    2. Cell voltage
    3. Cell current
    4. output %
    5. salinity
    6 produt name
    7. Software revision level

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Do you have salt test strips or a salt test kit to verify the salinity of the water?
    poolschoolgrad

    20x40 free-form IG vinyl, 1hp Hayward superpump, Hayward pro grid DE filter, Raypak heatpump, Goldline Aquarite SWCG, Polaris 280 with booster, and tested using a Taylor K2006.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    what is the temperature of water coming out of heater and how far away is the cell down the pipe?

    Jason is right, high temperature increases conductivity significantly, and if the water comes into the cell at 50 C that might be too high.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by JasonLion
    When the pool water is warmer it conducts electricity better, just as it would if there was more salt in the water. Combinations of somewhat high water temperature and somewhat high salt levels will be seen as the same by the SWG as too much salt.

    There are a couple of aspects to this. One possibility is that the heater is raising the water temperature coming out of the heater by more than it should be, perhaps because the flow rate is too low. Another is that the salt level might be almost too high, so it only takes a little warmth to go over the limit. Another possibility is that the cell is not properly calibrated and is turning off even when the actual current is acceptable, though this is less likely than the other two.

    Might be a comination of the two..heat and salt. I know if heat is above 102F and salt above 4,000 this Hi Salt error can occur.

    I will test the salt with a taylor salt kit. The heater is set at 88F. I will get all the read outs. thanks.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    SWG is reading 3,500ppm of salt.

    of course this could be higher. I will check with a test kit.

    cell amps rise above 8.0 and then shuts off and goes to 0. then Hi Salt comes on.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    went back there today and SWG is off still after cutting the heater off yesterday.

    I tested salt with taylor kit and it read 3,000 which is what i expected as swg's seem to read higher.

    cell is 5 ft away from heater.

    I cut off swg then turned back on and these readings are what I observed...

    1. Water temp..82f
    2. Cell voltage ...26.6
    3. Cell current...went up to 7.99 and then dropped to 0.
    4. output %....76p
    5. salinity...3,600
    6 produt name...AL-O
    7. Software revision level...r1.40

    then displayed Hi after cell current dropped to 0
    and...hi salt was illuminated and these readings...
    1. Water temp..82f
    2. Cell voltage ...35.24
    3. Cell current...0.00
    4. output %....76p
    5. salinity... -0
    6 produt name...AL-O
    7. Software revision level...r1.40

    I tried a new T15 cell and same thing..

    maybe the new T15 couldn't "talk" with the old software? maybe it is the cell and I need a compatible cell that works with r1.40?

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    it looks like it just cuts off because of overload.
    you either need to bring the salt down or the temperature of water.
    i'd actually install SWG in parallel to the heater if the pump can handle it, that's the recommended way.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    another thing you can try - reduce the output from 76% until the level where it doesn't switch off.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    I think, when the salinity exceeds 3600 ppm on the older software revision, the AquaRites will shut down and display Hi Salt.
    I believe the newer software revision will allow for higher salinity before shut down, but not sure of the exact concentration.

    Reduce the salinity (drain and replace water) to no more than 3400 ppm or ideal to 3200 to correct the problem.

    Good luck
    poolschoolgrad

    20x40 free-form IG vinyl, 1hp Hayward superpump, Hayward pro grid DE filter, Raypak heatpump, Goldline Aquarite SWCG, Polaris 280 with booster, and tested using a Taylor K2006.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Goldline units are time based so 76% just means it is on 76% of the time. Reducing the % will not reduce the current so it will still shut off due to high water temp.

    Under the right conditions, I will sometimes see this same issue but with solar. If solar turns on after the panels have been in the hot sun, the water can reach very high temperatures which in turn creates high current. According to Goldline, their SWG units will shut off when the current exceeds 8 amps and will also display a high salt warning. It isn't the salt level that is triggering the alarm but the high amps although high salt can also cause high amps. For the most part, the solution for me was to run the salt level at the low end of the range so when hot water hits the cell it will not go above 8 amps.

    Aquatica, are the following numbers with the heater on?

    1. Water temp..82f
    2. Cell voltage ...26.6
    3. Cell current...went up to 7.99 and then dropped to 0.
    4. output %....76p
    5. salinity...3,600
    6 produt name...AL-O
    7. Software revision level...r1.40
    82f is not very hot unless that is the temp sensor before the heater. There should also be a temp sensor in the cell which will read hotter with the heater on. I would expect around 92F for the volts, amps and salt reading you posted.

    I assume the SWG is plumbed post-heater, correct?

    What is the water temp pre-heater (water temp) and post-heater (SWG temp).

    Please post numbers with the heater off and SWG on.
    Mark
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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Thanks Guys for the replies.

    Mark those numbers are with heater off.

    I did think 82F was a little high as other pools without heaters are currently 79F

    but I did have the heater on the day before.

    I will turn heater on today and get some more numbers. cell is post heater.

    Thanks.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by Poolschoolgrad
    I think, when the salinity exceeds 3600 ppm on the older software revision, the AquaRites will shut down and display Hi Salt.
    I believe the newer software revision will allow for higher salinity before shut down, but not sure of the exact concentration.

    Reduce the salinity (drain and replace water) to no more than 3400 ppm or ideal to 3200 to correct the problem.

    Good luck

    you might be onto something. We have just installed a new system in another pool with cell 3ft from the same type gas heater and its running ok even at higher temp.

    I will backwash some salt out and see what happens. But unit stays off even after heater has been off for sometime. Mind you maybe it takes a while until the system comes back on. or maybe I have to disconnect cell and reconnect and turn back on. I'll check all that today. I might meet the SWG working again! lol

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Have you inspected the cell to see if it is dirty? A dirty cell can some times increase conductivity and result in high amps.
    Mark
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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985
    Have you inspected the cell to see if it is dirty? A dirty cell can some times increase conductivity and result in high amps.

    actually I inspected the cell the other day and there was a little bit of green scale on the sensor which I heard indicates the cell might be on its way out.

    I kept the heater off and this morning the swg was working.

    I turn it off and then back to auto and noticed the cell amps start very slowly increase. Heater is still off.

    I observed the cell current go from: 7.21 -7.26-7.31-7.41-7.45-7.50 over a period of time.

    Now I do believe the sun is slowly heating the pool water and gradually increasing conductivity of cell which is increasing an already high starting point of cell current. as the day goes on the cell current will hit 7.99 and 8.0 and then system will shut down. when it gets cooler in the evening the system will come back on as cell current drops below 8.0.

    If this was the summer the cell would not be working at all as water temp is much higher in the summer.

    also noticed another one of my swg pools is running a new T15 cell with r1.40 swg so the new cell is compatible. so I will try installing a new T15 again. I think I should have turn off the swg for a few minutes to reset and back on auto for swg to see new cell. will try that.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    I would try to clean the cell. It may have some calcium scale mixed with salt which can be conductive and making the amps higher than what it would be if the cell were clean. Technically, you should not have such high amps with the salt level at 3000 ppm (Taylor) and with a temperature of only 82F. My cell will read about 6.8 amps under the same conditions. Also, my SWG matches the taylor test kit fairly closely (+-100ppm) so that is another reason why I think something is making the current draw higher than normal.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985
    I would try to clean the cell. It may have some calcium scale mixed with salt which can be conductive and making the amps higher than what it would be if the cell were clean. Technically, you should not have such high amps with the salt level at 3000 ppm (Taylor) and with a temperature of only 82F. My cell will read about 6.8 amps under the same conditions. Also, my SWG matches the taylor test kit fairly closely (+-100ppm) so that is another reason why I think something is making the current draw higher than normal.
    I just cleaned this cell a month or two ago. I checked and nothing on the plates. just a little green scale on the sensor plug area. I've seen this once before and the cell was bad. replaced the cell and everything worked. so going to install a test cell and will see. I really do believe it is the cell. when I took over the pool the pH was 6.8 and the other pool company kept putting 8 tablets in every week. so water must have been acidic for some time. plus cell was full of scale. I gave the cell a mild acid wash and the system was back up running but I think due to poor maintenance the cell has had it.

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    Re: Heater shutting down SWG

    a dirty cell actually decreases conductivity and if anything would show 'low salt'

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