Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 35

Thread: The claims may be correct

  1. Back To Top    #1
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    The claims may be correct

    I switched from DE to Fiber Clear last weekend. What I read on the manufacturer's website said it filters about 3X finer than DE, and expect rapid pressure rise after switching. The claims may be correct...

    Other posts I searched mentioned that as well. Well, in 5 days my pressure has risen 2 psi. In the past, I gained about 1 psi/month. After all the rains and runoff, I had quite a lot of fine silt in the pool. But nothing extraordinary; no drifts forming. I stirred it up and brushed stuff towards the main drain yesterday. This morning the pool is as clear as it's ever been. I vacuumed up the big stuff today, mostly shingle grit. Still, not as bad as other times I've vacuumed.

    If I remember, I'll go out tonight after dark and turn on the pool light and see how many floaters I see.

    I will keep posting my observations on Fiber Clear here.

    Now, to make it easier for others to search this later, when the board gets busy:
    "fibre clear" fibreclear fiberclear cellulose
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  2. Back To Top    #2

    In the Industry

    duraleigh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Sebring, Florida
    Posts
    30,077

    Re: The claims may be correct

    great post, Richard. Lots of us will follow this one and be interested in your opinions/results.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

  3. Back To Top    #3
    Ohm_Boy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Orlando, FL
    Posts
    1,344

    Re: The claims may be correct

    ...mostly shingle grit.
    Wow. I had to be really careful articulating that particular phrase.
    [center:1kpalu48]Helpful Links: Pool School | CYA/Chlorine Chart | Pool Calculator[/center:1kpalu48]

  4. Back To Top    #4
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Well, so far so good. The water looks extremely clear after a little over a week with the fiber clear. I can make out that the screws in the drain cover are phillips head, standing on the deck. As I was out staring into the water one evening to see how many floaters I could see, my wife followed me out and said the water looks like glass.

    Purely subjectively, there does appear to be fewer floaters visble by pool light. I had to stop and focus to see any, there wasn't the usual cloud in front of the light. And this after a day of gusty winds.

    I think Saturday I will get a chance to brush and vacuum (and drain a bit), and move the valves around to see exactly what sort of pressure increase I have. I will report again then.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  5. Back To Top    #5

    In the Industry

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    London and France
    Posts
    574

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Richard, how deep is your pool that you can see the philips screws that you presumably couldn't with DE?
    It increases the pressure by almost 100% so will use more electricity to run and what apart from losing some floaters are you gaining?
    Cloud in front of the light? with DE? working properly?

  6. Back To Top    #6
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Quote Originally Posted by teapot
    Richard, how deep is your pool that you can see the philips screws that you presumably couldn't with DE?
    It increases the pressure by almost 100% so will use more electricity to run and what apart from losing some floaters are you gaining?
    Cloud in front of the light? with DE? working properly?
    I've never measured, but it's at least 8' deep. I could see the screws before just fine, but couldn't tell if they were phillips or slotted or torx or what while standing on the deck before. I haven't seen the pressure rise that much yet, still experimenting.

    What I'm gaining is not having to deal with diatomaceous earth. How do I get rid of it? Backflush it to the street and let it run into the storm drain? Is that legal? I don't know. Neither did my old pool service, which didn't stop him from doing it and leaving a tattletale trail of white crust from the nearest storm drain right to my driveway... At least when I backflushed it was right before a huge storm which washed away any traces and diluted things hugely.

    Around here, there are often warnings painted above storm drains that it flows to the ocean. And ultimately, it does - into the nearby concrete-lined creek, to the San Gabriel river, and on out to sea, untreated. Government agencies can get really nasty about stuff like that. Plus, when DE dries, it's classed as an inhalation hazard. Fiber clear is wood fiber - high grade sawdust - and I don't think there's much they can do about that. I can backflush that onto my front lawn if I want.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  7. Back To Top    #7

    In the Industry

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    London and France
    Posts
    574

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Don't get me wrong Richard, I am in total agreement re health issues with DE (why I don't use it) I read the companies info and really it seems to filter about the same as DE but I was surprised with your comments on your pool when using DE, clarity etc and I wondered if there was a pathway through the grids somewhere that the fibre clear has plugged. Obviously something has changed as you have noticed the pressure rise.
    Anyway keep posting as you go along it is interesting.
    Happy New Year to all

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Georgia
    Posts
    317

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Richard

    I have great interest in your results. I have a DE filter and pump of comparable size and will consider switching to the cellulose product this Spring. Pool dealers in this area are PUSHING the sale of cellulose products to replace DE.

    Here are some questions which I hope your test can provide:
    Does it provide better filtration? Will the normal operating pressure on the filter using the cellulose increase substantially? Will it clog the filter and need to be backwashed more often? Will you be able to backwash most of the cellulose out of the filter without having to break the filter down?

    Initially the price difference was drastic, but recently the price of the cellulose has declined. Ecological concerns especially in arid climates make the replacement of DE with cellulose much more attractive; but in an area with much more rainfall, my primary concern is with the service life of the product and its effect on equipment that was originally designed for a different product.

    Please keep us updated on your results.
    poolschoolgrad

    20x40 free-form IG vinyl, 1hp Hayward superpump, Hayward pro grid DE filter, Raypak heatpump, Goldline Aquarite SWCG, Polaris 280 with booster, and tested using a Taylor K2006.

  9. Back To Top    #9
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Quote Originally Posted by Poolschoolgrad
    Richard

    I have great interest in your results. I have a DE filter and pump of comparable size and will consider switching to the cellulose product this Spring. Pool dealers in this area are PUSHING the sale of cellulose products to replace DE.

    Here are some questions which I hope your test can provide:
    Does it provide better filtration?
    It seems to, but looking at the amount of floaters visible in the light is subjective, and also the pool isn't being used right now.
    Will the normal operating pressure on the filter using the cellulose increase substantially?
    It went up about 2 psi, but now it's back to normal, and hasn't changed in a week. I'm thinking the claims may be correct. On the manufacturer's website it shows all the fibreclear settling to the bottom of the filter when off then recoating when on. If true, the denser stuff would tend to settle to the bottom of the tank, not be glued to the grids by clumped DE. I won't know if my theory is correct until I tear it down again
    Will it clog the filter and need to be backwashed more often? Will you be able to backwash most of the cellulose out of the filter without having to break the filter down?
    It will be a few months until we know that one.

    Initially the price difference was drastic, but recently the price of the cellulose has declined. Ecological concerns especially in arid climates make the replacement of DE with cellulose much more attractive; but in an area with much more rainfall, my primary concern is with the service life of the product and its effect on equipment that was originally designed for a different product.

    Please keep us updated on your results.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  10. Back To Top    #10
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Update:

    The water is crystal clear, pressure has been 18 for weeks, from a starting pressure in December of 16. And this after subjecting the filter to a lot of silt from catching rainwater. So I'm still waiting for that sudden pressure rise. Then I'll have an excuse to open the filter up and see if it does truly backwash 100% unlike DE.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  11. Back To Top    #11

    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    49

    Re: The claims may be correct

    I just ran across this product in an ad from Leslie's and quickly turned to TFP for answers, thanks Richard. Can you also tell us about price differences? Would you have backwashed DE by this time of year? Apparently Fiber Clear can be wasted anywhere?

    Thanks again, Kelly
    10K IG, Gunite with Wet Edge "Midnight Ocean" pebble surface, with spa, tanning shelf, and fountain. Pentair Intellibrite LED pool and spa lights. Rola-Chem chlorine pump (and tank), Pentair DE "Quad 80" cartridge filter, 400K BTU gas heater, VF Whisperflo, and Legend Pressure Side Cleaner with Pentair booster pump. Using TFTestKit.

  12. Back To Top    #12
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Quote Originally Posted by kellyj
    I just ran across this product in an ad from Leslie's and quickly turned to TFP for answers, thanks Richard. Can you also tell us about price differences? Would you have backwashed DE by this time of year? Apparently Fiber Clear can be wasted anywhere?

    Thanks again, Kelly
    I don't even remember what I paid for the fibreclear. I know it's more than DE, but price wasn't why I switched. I doubt I'd need backwashing if I used DE. The pool service I fired told me at some point that it was pretty much just an annual thing here. No trees near the pool.

    And you know as much as I do about the technicalities of disposing used fibreclear. I'm just the volunteer guinea pig to try the stuff and post my results for general benefit.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  13. Back To Top    #13
    Mod Squad zea3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    9,198

    Re: The claims may be correct

    I have used fibre clear and I liked the results. I think the big bag was around $14 at Leslie's last year. It does rinse off the grids easier and it will run the pressure a point or 2 higher. Once your pool is clean it is great for keeping it that way. You could use it to clear a swamp but since you are cleaning the filter dailey the cost would be too much for my taste. I do like that it breaks down into the soil in a couple of days. DE seams to take forever to go away.
    TFP Moderator
    Helpful links: TF Test Kits,TFP Pool School, PoolMath
    Vogue 21' round AG, Pentair 1 hp 2 speed pump, 36 sq ft DE filter, Hayward S180T 150# sand filter, Houston, Texas
    Love TFP? Become a
    TFP Supporter!

  14. Back To Top    #14
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: The claims may be correct

    An update:

    Pressure has been up almost 10 psi, so backflushing has been on my mind. It rained today - perfect! The pool needed to be drained down after the rain anyway.

    After backflushing for the manufacturer's recommended 2 minutes, I let the tank drain, then opened it up. It isn't as clean as they claim, but there was much less stuck to the grids than there was with DE. I know, I should have taken pictures, but I was dealing with other problems - a backflush hose that decided to split. For what it's worth, what did come out was absolutely black. Not grey like DE; black. And it got all over my shoes and pant legs....

    I still had over half a bag of fibreclear, so it's recoated with it again. I'll continue to report whenever there's anything to report.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  15. Back To Top    #15

    In the Industry

    duraleigh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Sebring, Florida
    Posts
    30,077

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Interesting post, Richard. Thanks!
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

  16. Back To Top    #16

    Re: The claims may be correct

    I am looking into the switch and would really be interested in an update!!!
    Brent and Lisa
    23,000 gal IG plaster pool with 750gal attached hot tub
    60 sqFt DE filter Hayward EcoStar VS pump Hayward PS-4 Automation T-15 Turbo Cell.

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Orange County, CA
    Posts
    696

    Re: The claims may be correct

    I've been using a cellulose replacement ever since I fired my pool guy and the water looks great. I don't add as much as listed on the bag, and so the filter pressure is about where it was with DE. It really does a better job polishing and you use much less of it than DE. I find cleaning filter grids is much easier as well. But, once pressure starts to build, it's time for a cleaning. Simple backwashing doesn't seem to work as well as with actual DE for an occasional cleanout. I think this stuff is a bit stickier than DE, so that might explain while backwashing is often not enough. But, this stuff is great in every other respect. BTW, this stuff is not good to breath, probably not as bad as DE (which can cause silicosis if inhaled frequently), but still not good to breath.
    38K in ground pool with attached spa. Current equipment: Easytouch 8 (521150) with IC-60 SWCG with web control by Autelis, 1x Pentair IntelliFlo 011018 pump (for filter), 1x Pentair 2HP WhisperFlo pump (for waterfall), 2X Pentair IntelliBrite 5G 12V lights, Pentair MiniMax400 NG Heater, Pentair SMBW2060 DE filter. Zodiac Barracuda MX8 cleaner on dedicated cleaner line. Lighting/home automation controlled by Insteon/ISY-99i.

  18. Back To Top    #18
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: The claims may be correct

    Quote Originally Posted by BHall235
    I am looking into the switch and would really be interested in an update!!!
    Nothing to update yet. The pressure's not high enough.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  19. Back To Top    #19
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Update, May 29, 2012

    Pressure has been steady for several weeks, but the flow seemed to be getting slow. So I backwashed. This is what the grids looked like after 2 minutes of backwashing:
    [attachment=0:bqkby3wq]Dsc03390.jpg[/attachment:bqkby3wq]

    As you can see, it does rinse off better than DE. But it also turns black. A couple minutes with a hose nozzle got the rest of this stuff off, didn't need to break things down any more. Pressure didn't increase at all when I added the fresh stuff, running pressure is 5 psi lower than it was, and the flow is noticeably better.

    I soaked my front lawn with the backwash flow. We'll see if it looks or smells funny tomorrow....
    Attached Images Attached Images
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  20. Back To Top    #20
    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    SouthWest Alabama
    Posts
    22,337

    Re: The claims may be correct

    You're making a good case for it. Thanks for going to the trouble of keeping this thread updated.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •