Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: Ethics

  1. Back To Top    #1
    meatloaf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Gilbert AZ
    Posts
    373

    Ethics

    I work for Sears as an hourly plus commission sales associate. Last year during the Christmas season (an 8 week period) we had our effective commission rate lowed ( from 1.75% to 1.5% ). I asked them about this and of course they would not admit to it. This year we have a new store manager and he admitted that Sears does this. We are about to enter this same time period again. Is this legal and is it standard practice for companies with hourly plus commissioned sales associates to do this? Last year I lost approx $700 due to the rate reduction. I'd like to hear your feeback on this matter.
    Thanks
    My pool is a 10,500 gallon (420 Sq Ft ) kidney shape. A hand made sheer decent waterfeature. STA-RITE HRPB30, Sand filter 30" 98 GPM,
    1 HP Maxi-Glas 2 pump, BBB Method, Taylor K-2005 test kit, 50 Watt 12V low-voltage pond light illuminates the pool at night for a nice soft glow.
    250 gallon stand-alone hot tub. Got it FREE!

  2. Back To Top    #2
    dmanb2b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    3,728

    Re: Ethics

    I hate it for you, but unless there is a stated minimum commision % you are required to be paid in your employment contract, they are free to do as they wish. In this environment, companies are rarley paying anything more than the minimum they have to to retain employees given the pool of resources available on the unemployment lines.

    Not letting you know of the decrease is not right, but mind you even when they do, you really have to read in between the lines.

    I'm holding my breath right now to see what our health benefit costs will be for 2011 They have consistently gone up 5-15% per year, but now we received the "...in addition to overall rising healthcare costs, we continue to analyze how the healthcare reform bill will impact premiums and continue to work toward providing you viable healthcare coverage options..."...said the way I would...forget steaks and stock up on chicken breast when it's on sale...it's better for you anyway

    Sad days, when you are an above average employee, lucky enough to receive a raise yet you're net pay is decreasing
    24'x52" AGP (13,500 Gallons), Intex SWG, (2)Solar Bear 4x20 panels, Hayward S220T Filter, 1/2hp Pentair Superflo

    Pool School, TFTestKits, Pool Calculator

  3. Back To Top    #3
    meatloaf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Gilbert AZ
    Posts
    373

    Re: Ethics

    Thanks for the feedback. It just doesn't seem fair that they take the busy time of the year to up their profits and reduce ours. We put up with the cr*p all year waiting for this time to come so we can make some money and then get screwed out of it. You have no idea what we will have to endure during the next 8 weeks, and we will receive less in return for all of our hard work.
    My pool is a 10,500 gallon (420 Sq Ft ) kidney shape. A hand made sheer decent waterfeature. STA-RITE HRPB30, Sand filter 30" 98 GPM,
    1 HP Maxi-Glas 2 pump, BBB Method, Taylor K-2005 test kit, 50 Watt 12V low-voltage pond light illuminates the pool at night for a nice soft glow.
    250 gallon stand-alone hot tub. Got it FREE!

  4. Back To Top    #4
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: Ethics

    It's probably legal, if they notify you of a change in rate. I'd call it unethical, though. You share the low periods with them, why can't they share the windfall with you?

    I hurt my back at work last week. Pulled a muscle rather severely. The company was good about sending me to the clinic and all that. I was put on restricted duties, which essentially means sitting on my butt doing nothing. They said if I stay home, it's a lost time injury, which jacks up their rates, so it works better for them if I'm there doing nothing. I can accept that. However, they brought around a form with change in pay plan. While I'm hourly instead of "flagging" my rate has dropped from $18.50 to $10.00. I'm not happy about it, but at least there will be no surprises on payday. Actually, the money is the least of it. I'm bored to insanity. Despite some very reasonable restrictions (no lifting heavy weights like tires) they'd rather play it safe and have me lift nothing.

    About once a year they examine the various pay scales. We have salary, hourly, "flag", base plus commission, and some 100% commission, depending on job duties. If they need to motivate some people, they alter the plan, so that if you are already productive, you won't lose any, if you're above- average, you'll still do well, and if you're an underperformer you lose. They print it out and distribute it. Then you return a slip that says you understand and accept the terms and sign it. If you don't like it, time to start job hunting. Business is business after all, but at least they are open and honest about it.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Pensacola FL
    Posts
    40

    Re: Ethics

    Your preaching to the choir, every time I turn around the govt cuts more payments to me while health insurance, benifits and salaries go up. If the 30% medicare cuts go through I'll probably have to drop medicare as it will drop below my break even point. or will have to borrow money to pay our employe salaries on top of the second job.
    14.5 K inground vinyl
    1hp pump
    sand filter
    Taylor K-2006
    Aquarite SWG
    P'cola FL

  6. Back To Top    #6
    dmanb2b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    3,728

    Re: Ethics

    Quote Originally Posted by meatloaf
    You have no idea what we will have to endure during the next 8 weeks, and we will receive less in return for all of our hard work.
    Trust me the grass is always greener on the other side ...I certainly do not envy the tought of having to deal with shoppers for eight weeks straight, but I can relate as you can imagine having no days off (incl sat/sun) from the day after new years until 4/15 (working with clients 12-15hr days...you guessed it...accountant ), yet receive the same salary. I also hear you on the unethical part, and notification, but come to think of it, it's no different than most co's bonus plans being cut significantly YTY...I'll certainly agree a 16% commission plan reduction is not pleasant news , but if it helps Sears stay profitable and enable you to stay employed...from that perspective, it could be worse.

    Anyone here miss the late 90's - 2007?
    24'x52" AGP (13,500 Gallons), Intex SWG, (2)Solar Bear 4x20 panels, Hayward S220T Filter, 1/2hp Pentair Superflo

    Pool School, TFTestKits, Pool Calculator

  7. Back To Top    #7

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Central Massachusetts
    Posts
    2,690

    Re: Ethics

    Quote Originally Posted by dmanb2b


    Anyone here miss the late 90's - 2007?
    No, I was poor in the late 90's.
    I just hope they patch the AMT before December 31st or I'm nailed big time.
    14,000 gallon IG, Vinyl. Hayward 3/4 hp superpump, Penatair IC40 SWCG, Pentair automation, Hayward sand filter, Aqua Comfort heat pump, Hayward 400k Lo-Nox LP heater.

  8. Back To Top    #8
    dmanb2b's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    3,728

    Re: Ethics

    Quote Originally Posted by bk406
    Quote Originally Posted by dmanb2b


    Anyone here miss the late 90's - 2007?
    No, I was poor in the late 90's.
    I just hope they patch the AMT before December 31st or I'm nailed big time.
    oops..anyway, I doubt AMT will get patched and if they do, they'll figure out another way to fund the debit card

    We should enjoy a cold one some day , I'm sure there plenty of folks interested, but I always love to hear a great comeback story
    24'x52" AGP (13,500 Gallons), Intex SWG, (2)Solar Bear 4x20 panels, Hayward S220T Filter, 1/2hp Pentair Superflo

    Pool School, TFTestKits, Pool Calculator

  9. Back To Top    #9

    In the Industry

    X-PertPool's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Exeter, PA
    Posts
    1,385

    Re: Ethics

    If i ran sears I'd have the normal rate at 1.5% and raise to 1.75% if you sell a certain amount as an incentive during the holiday period.
    -Kevin
    X-Pert Pool Service
    x-pertpool.com
    X-Pert Pool on Facebook and @XPertPoolServic on Twitter
    22,000 gal / 16' x 32' / Vinyl / Hayward s244t /Pentair SuperFlo 1 hp

  10. Back To Top    #10

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Dallas, TX
    Posts
    781

    Re: Ethics

    I'll tell you how I would spin it if I were in Sears management: Your year round compensation should be 1.5%, but during the slow periods we bump it up to 1.75% to help you out.

    BTW, I do not endorse this mindset. I'm with you OP, that some sleazy tactics...
    20K gal IG plaster pool, Manually chlorinated with 6% bleach, 1.5 HP Sta-Rite Dura-Glas II pump, Pentair FNS Plus 48 DE filter, Polaris 280

  11. Back To Top    #11

    Re: Ethics

    think of it this way you should feel good to make sears more money then the CEO and board of directors can give themsevles mutlimillon $ bonuses.... cause they need it
    thanks
    gary

    24ft x 54" aquasphere mission agp, cartridge filter, 1.5 hp hayward, TF-100, BBB method, pool install July 2010

  12. Back To Top    #12

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    444

    Re: Ethics

    I say to sears, that is chicken **** way of doing buisness
    27' Round AG, 17,200 gallons, sand filter

  13. Back To Top    #13
    meatloaf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Gilbert AZ
    Posts
    373

    Re: Ethics

    Talk about getting the shaft! I just found out today that the appliance sales people, who are on straight commission are getting their commission rates cut by 50% to 60%. Just where is their incentive to sell any products? These people aren't making any money now. Sears has a slogan on tv, Sears - life well spent They should change that to Sears - life well wasted.
    My pool is a 10,500 gallon (420 Sq Ft ) kidney shape. A hand made sheer decent waterfeature. STA-RITE HRPB30, Sand filter 30" 98 GPM,
    1 HP Maxi-Glas 2 pump, BBB Method, Taylor K-2005 test kit, 50 Watt 12V low-voltage pond light illuminates the pool at night for a nice soft glow.
    250 gallon stand-alone hot tub. Got it FREE!

  14. Back To Top    #14

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Central Massachusetts
    Posts
    2,690

    Re: Ethics

    They're free to find another job. Nobody said they have to work for Sears.
    14,000 gallon IG, Vinyl. Hayward 3/4 hp superpump, Penatair IC40 SWCG, Pentair automation, Hayward sand filter, Aqua Comfort heat pump, Hayward 400k Lo-Nox LP heater.

  15. Back To Top    #15

    Re: Ethics

    Quote Originally Posted by meatloaf
    I work for Sears as an hourly plus commission sales associate. Last year during the Christmas season (an 8 week period) we had our effective commission rate lowed ( from 1.75% to 1.5% ). I asked them about this and of course they would not admit to it. This year we have a new store manager and he admitted that Sears does this. We are about to enter this same time period again. Is this legal and is it standard practice for companies with hourly plus commissioned sales associates to do this? Last year I lost approx $700 due to the rate reduction. I'd like to hear your feeback on this matter.
    Thanks
    How long have you worked in sales?

    Without an explicit doc that spells out what if any "rate" is paid out then there is none and they can alter it at will.

    Dont ask anyone to "tell you" anything - tell them to put the policy in writing,and then live with it or ratchet your complaint up Get it in writing - if not bail and go somewhere that will.

    Im not saying youll get an employment contract, but you should ALWAYS have a comp plan that spell everything out.

    Dont you have a comp plan you signed? Ive never had any sales job without a "plan".

    Ive been in sales for 2 decades as a retail floor guy, one of a two man team, bag carrying rep for a reseller, a factory rep, sales manager, a sales VP, and a business owners and partners. There was ALWAY something that spelled out the deal.

    If not- its complete and utter amateur hour and I'd run fast and run far from that kind of douchebaggery.

    Uncle Dave
    20K Gallon Gunnite pool/900 Gallon in ground Spa/2HP WhisperflowSpa
    Pentair Master temp 400/Hayward Sand WZeobrite/Jandy RS-8 Aqualink/Jandy 2HP Epump
    12 - 4x10 Panels/Zodiac G3-T5 / BBB

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •