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Thread: Pool turned cloudy overnight

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    Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Anyone have experience with Sam’s Poolbrand Trichlor causing cloudy water?

    Test results at 8 pm last night:
    FC 1.5
    CC 0
    pH 7.6
    TA 70
    CYA 30

    CH 130- test ran 6/9
    Borates ~50

    I opened a new container of Sam’s Poolbrand trichlor last night and at 8pm put 4 pucks in the (empty) floating chlorinator. I also added 96oz 6% Walmart bleach at the same time. Water was very clear and has been the entire season.

    At 1 pm today I noticed the water was cloudy. Still could see the bottom of the shallow end easily, and could see the main drain- including the screws- in the 8’ deep end, but it was noticeably more cloudy than is typical.

    Test results at 1pm today:
    FC 5.0 repeated test 4.5
    CC 0
    pH 7.6
    TA 70

    My initial thought was a nascent algae bloom as it had dropped to 1.5 last night, although 1.5 really isn’t that low for a cya of 30. However, fc has held since 8 pm last night. According to Pool Calc 96 oz bumps me 2.5, plus my starting 1.5 = 4.0 and at 1:30 this afternoon I had a reading of 4.5- 5.0 (ran test twice). I would've thought an algae bloom would've taken out the chlorine.

    No swimmers since Saturday afternoon. No dead critters in pool or skimmer. Rain night before last, but none last night. Lots of heat, lots of sun.

    The only thing different I’ve done is the new container of trichlor. Anyone experience trichlor clouding their pool? A bad batch maybe? Any other thoughts?

    Label indicates 99% Trichlor, 1% other ingredients, 90% available chlorine. No mention of any additives.

    Thanks in advance!
    20k white plaster with blue quartz, IntelliFlo VS, Quad DE 100
    1000 gal spa with natural stone waterfall
    Beach entry with 2 bubblers. Pool built Spring 2013

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Hi, Terry,

    I'm stumped. You have a good idea of what's going on in your pool. I don't see anything that would've contributed that cloudiness.

    It's hard to blame tri-chlor as I don't believe I have ever seen that posted on this forum. Is it still cloudy?
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Yep, still cloudy. More so actually, but now I have introduced swimmers to the mix- kids have been in and out since 2:00. Still can see the main drain, but not as well as before.

    Searching the forum, I couldn't find anything on the trichlor, either. Only suspect trichlor because it's the variable I changed- and it was a new bucket. I'm open to consider any other causes though!
    20k white plaster with blue quartz, IntelliFlo VS, Quad DE 100
    1000 gal spa with natural stone waterfall
    Beach entry with 2 bubblers. Pool built Spring 2013

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    The Sams club trichlor is known to be high in CYA...is it possible that it is a chemical reaaction (or lack of dissolving CYA?)

    I'm not a big fan of using trichlor AND stabilized tablets in conjunction with each other. What method is being used to test CYA? I would think that the CYA would test higher on a pool using tablets and trichlor unless this pool has recently been filled.

    I'm not sure what the site recomends as target TA but I keep mine between 100 and 150.

    Where do you get your borates?
    BTW I think it is awesome that you are using borates! awesome stuffs!
    http://www.californiapoolsdirect.com serving Dallas pools since 1953!

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Ed
    The Sams club trichlor is known to be high in CYA...is it possible that it is a chemical reaaction (or lack of dissolving CYA?)

    I'm not a big fan of using trichlor AND stabilized tablets in conjunction with each other. What method is being used to test CYA? I would think that the CYA would test higher on a pool using tablets and trichlor unless this pool has recently been filled.

    I'm not sure what the site recomends as target TA but I keep mine between 100 and 150.

    Where do you get your borates?
    BTW I think it is awesome that you are using borates! awesome stuffs!
    ALL Trichlor is identical in terms of the relative amount of chlorine and CYA content because Trichlor is a specific chemical compound with chlorine attached to the CYA core ring. The following are rules that are independent of product concentration and of pool size:

    For every 10 ppm Free Chlorine (FC) added by Trichlor, it also increases Cyanuric Acid (CYA) by 6 ppm.
    For every 10 ppm FC added by Dichlor, it also increases CYA by 9 ppm.
    For every 10 ppm FC added by Cal-Hypo, it also increases Calcium Hardness (CH) by at least 7 ppm.

    Trichlor and stabilized tablets are the same thing. I think you meant not combining Trichlor (stabilized) tablets/pucks with Cal-Hypo which should NEVER be combined together in the same unit -- if an inline chlorinator uses one, you should never add the other type or an explosion can result.

    Now some Trichlor pucks/tabs have copper in them (some HTH brand Trichlor, for example) and that can cause metal staining.

    As for recommendations of TA and other water parameters, please look at the Pool School for more info.

    It is possible that this particular brand of Trichlor is not very pure (normally it's around 99% Trichlor) so could have fillers in it and they could cause cloudiness.
    16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
    12 Fafco solar panels; Purex Triton PowerMax 250 natural gas heater (200,000 BTU/hr output); automatic electric pool safety cover; 4-wheel pressure-side "The Pool Cleaner"

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Since you have no CC and your FC held overnight, it doesn't sound organic so I don't see a reason to shock really. What I would do though is run your filter 24/7 for a few days and see if it clears on its own. If it doesn't, we can go with a clarifier. I suspect that it will clear on it's own with filtration.

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    [quote=chem geek]
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr. Ed":1txrjwzq
    The Sams club trichlor is known to be high in CYA...is it possible that it is a chemical reaaction (or lack of dissolving CYA?)

    I'm not a big fan of using trichlor AND stabilized tablets in conjunction with each other. What method is being used to test CYA? I would think that the CYA would test higher on a pool using tablets and trichlor unless this pool has recently been filled.

    I'm not sure what the site recomends as target TA but I keep mine between 100 and 150.

    Where do you get your borates?
    BTW I think it is awesome that you are using borates! awesome stuffs!
    ALL Trichlor is identical in terms of the relative amount of chlorine and CYA content because Trichlor is a specific chemical compound with chlorine attached to the CYA core ring. The following are rules that are independent of product concentration and of pool size:

    For every 10 ppm Free Chlorine (FC) added by Trichlor, it also increases Cyanuric Acid (CYA) by 6 ppm.
    For every 10 ppm FC added by Dichlor, it also increases CYA by 9 ppm.
    For every 10 ppm FC added by Cal-Hypo, it also increases Calcium Hardness (CH) by at least 7 ppm.

    Trichlor and stabilized tablets are the same thing. I think you meant not combining Trichlor (stabilized) tablets/pucks with Cal-Hypo which should NEVER be combined together in the same unit -- if an inline chlorinator uses one, you should never add the other type or an explosion can result.

    Now some Trichlor pucks/tabs have copper in them (some HTH brand Trichlor, for example) and that can cause metal staining.

    As for recommendations of TA and other water parameters, please look at the Pool School for more info.

    It is possible that this particular brand of Trichlor is not very pure (normally it's around 99% Trichlor) so could have fillers in it and they could cause cloudiness.[/quote:1txrjwzq]

    exactly what I meant... I have a bad habit of using less/wrong words though. fillers that the Sam's club materials are known for having.

    You make great points however I think I may have mislead folks.... due to both dichlor and trichlor containing cya, I don't personally feel they should be used together. In my experience this leads to cya levels rising rapidly causing clouded pools and chlorine lock only resolved by adding large amounts of fresh water to the pool.

    Yes cal hypo added DIRECTLY to trichlor or dichlor can do exactly as you state...however adding it to the body of water treated with trichlor will have no ill effect. I prefer using non chlorine monoposulfate shock whenever possible anyway.

    Copper tablets are definitely proving to be a bad idea...I have already seen two pools this year using the HTC tabs that have copper levels in excess of 3 ppm. Unfortunately I have not had constant contact with these pools and the only known variable is the hth tabs. Theoretically the pools may have been overdosed with a high concentrate copper base algacide.

    Op...what are the calcium levels?
    http://www.californiapoolsdirect.com serving Dallas pools since 1953!

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    How long are you running your pump during the day/night? Maybe you should add a couple hours to the run time.
    11,872 Gallon IG Shotcrete play pool
    Blue Granite Pebble Sheen finish
    Hayward SwimClear c4025, Navigator & Tristar 1.75hp pump
    2' Powerfall

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Thanks for all the replies.

    Pool still cloudy, actually I think it's worse. See pics below.

    Results from 9pm last night:
    FC 3.0, 3.5, 3.0 (ran 3 times)
    CC 0
    pH 7.6

    Results from 1pm today:
    FC 2.5, 3.0, 3.0
    CC 0
    pH 7.6
    TA 70
    CYA 30

    Ran another cya for confirmation. Floating chlorinator appears to be keeping up with fc loss; pH and TA don't seem to be affected. Numbers all look good, water doesn't.

    Filter currently on, normally runs 6pm to midnight. No swimmers since last night at 8pm.

    Poolbrand trichlor claims 99% purity, see label below.

    Aside from algae, any other reasons for a cloudy pool?
    Attached Images Attached Images
    20k white plaster with blue quartz, IntelliFlo VS, Quad DE 100
    1000 gal spa with natural stone waterfall
    Beach entry with 2 bubblers. Pool built Spring 2013

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    First pic taken on Mon, second this morning. Both were taken from same location, and both are cropped to the drain.

    EDIT: They loaded different than I expected. Obviously the first pic is the cloudy water, second is clear.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    20k white plaster with blue quartz, IntelliFlo VS, Quad DE 100
    1000 gal spa with natural stone waterfall
    Beach entry with 2 bubblers. Pool built Spring 2013

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Is everything working ok as far as the pump and filter are concerned? Returns flowing, gauges reading what they normally do?
    How long have you owned the pool?
    Maybe you could switch to bleach for a few days to eliminate the pucks from the equation.
    11,872 Gallon IG Shotcrete play pool
    Blue Granite Pebble Sheen finish
    Hayward SwimClear c4025, Navigator & Tristar 1.75hp pump
    2' Powerfall

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Just checked the returns, all are flowing, pressure is fine. I've owned the pool for 16 years.

    Barring any better advice I will probably remove the trichlor, clear the pool, then reintroduce the trichlor again to see if it is the culprit. I am trying to see if I can make any progress with the trichlor IN the pool since no one seems to have had this problem with it.
    20k white plaster with blue quartz, IntelliFlo VS, Quad DE 100
    1000 gal spa with natural stone waterfall
    Beach entry with 2 bubblers. Pool built Spring 2013

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    Re: Pool turned cloudy overnight

    Pool clearning! Not completely back to normal yet, but I'd say close to 90% of the way there.

    FC has been holding at 3.0 last night and at noon today. I never removed the trichlor, but have been running the filter.

    Wondering now if maybe I had a bad bottle of bleach. I will probably need to bump the fc with some bleach with the weekend swimmer load so we'll see what happens then...
    20k white plaster with blue quartz, IntelliFlo VS, Quad DE 100
    1000 gal spa with natural stone waterfall
    Beach entry with 2 bubblers. Pool built Spring 2013

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