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Thread: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

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    Mod Squad woodyp's Avatar
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    Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    Ok, who here is the resident MythBuster! First trip into the pool store for my new pool just to get some muriatic acid to drop the ph. The inevitable chlorine question comes up and i tell them I've already added CYA and liquid clorox to my vinyl lined AGP. WHOA! Did the earth shake? I'm told you cannot use liquid clorox on pools with vinyl liners because it will eat them up, break them down, make them brittle, turn the moon to blood and so forth.

    Can someone totally blow this one out of the water for me and put my mind at rest? I wanna be a BBB guy!
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    http://www.lenntech.com/processes/disin ... lorite.htm

    Take a bottle of your bleach (buy generic, don't buy name brand Clorox unless that's all you can find. Where do you think Clorox got their name? Sodium HypoCHLORITE = CHLOrine), and show them the ingredients on the bottle. Typically most brands and generic bottles of bleach have one or two lines for ingredients. One will show sodium hypochlorite. See if the pool store sells any liquid shock or liquid chlorine. Look at the ingredients. It will be the SAME THING.

    Note this is comparing liquid shock and liquid chlorine. Powdered shock products are calcium hypchlorite and other varieties. Same base but has calcium and other additives which we don't want or need (unless you have a plaster pool and know that you need it). The reason we tout the BBB method is we want to add ONLY the single individual items that need to be adjusted. Pool store chemicals are full of everything under the sun because they don't want to encourage people to learn how to maintain their water properly. They say 'stick this strip in the water and guess at the color and throw these tablets in full of 'catchall' ingredients and you're done'. That's why after the end of the first season and later when so much CYA, calcium and other things get to be too high, people get frustrated because they can't keep a clear pool.

    Tell them sodium hypochlorite you buy in the store is typically 6% concentration. If a pool store sells liquid shock it's usually 10-12% concentration. So if their 10-12% concentration won't hurt liners then how does 6% of the EXACT SAME CHEMICAL hurt it?

    I'd be upfront.... print that article out or one of hundreds of others online, and tell that person they really shouldn't spread grossly inaccurate information just for the sake of trying to sale high priced chemicals.

    Also, you probably paid a lot more for muriatic acid there than you would have at Home Depot or Lowe's.

    CYA is usually the only thing a pool store has that we need. Of course there are exceptions, but we're talking basics right now.

    As far as convincing you... look how many people and how many YEARS these people have been using bleach in their pools. Again, bleach is nothing more than a common name and in lower concentration than what you buy when the bottle says chlorine or liquid shock. Nothing more.

    I'm definitely not a veteran around here or expert so I may get corrected on some minor points but this should cover the issue for the most part.

    I would absolutely print that page out and take it back and just lay down on the counter and politely say "you really should read this and understand what bleach actually is before giving out incorrect information".... or better yet give it to the manager and tell him/her you wanted to support the local pool store but find it hard when you're told information that's basically a lie. That way you won't offend the cashier to their face.
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    Except the part about the blood and the moon (which I'm pretty sure is true ) rastoma has pretty well definitively dispelled their information.

    I'm not quite as sure you'll have much luck proving yourself correct........it's amazing how strong the urge is to believe only what you want to.
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    Clorox provides directions for using bleach with swimming pools. See for example this document, the part you want is a little more than 1/3 of the way through, search for "SWIMMING POOL DISINFECTION". That does apply to the "commercial" version, but the retail version is essentially the same stuff.

    Sodium hypochlorite, which is what bleach is, is very commonly used in commercial pools.
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    There is one legitimate word of caution regarding adding certain concentrated chemicals, especially in a vinyl pool. If you add bleach or chlorinating liquid quickly in one place without good circulation, the chlorine can settle to the bottom of the pool since it is more dense until it is mixed. If you add it slowly over a return flow (preferably at the deep end) with the pump running and then lightly brush the side and bottom of the pool after adding it, then you will ensure thorough mixing and there will be no problem. Once mixed, all forms of chlorine produce the IDENTICAL chlorine in the water. The only differences are in what else they add and their effect on pH.

    Adding Cal-Hypo can be just as bad since it doesn't dissolve well so could settle to the bottom as well. Again, the solution is to ensure thorough mixing, usually by pre-dissolving in a bucket of water. Having a Trichlor puck settle to the bottom is far worse as low pH is much more harmful to a vinyl liner than chlorine. So adding Muriatic Acid or dry acid to a vinyl pool takes particular care.
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    Quote Originally Posted by JasonLion
    Clorox provides directions for using bleach with swimming pools. See for example this document, the part you want is a little more than 1/3 of the way through, search for "SWIMMING POOL DISINFECTION". That does apply to the "commercial" version, but the retail version is essentially the same stuff.

    Sodium hypochlorite, which is what bleach is, is very commonly used in commercial pools.
    it is on pg 19 of the publication to which you are referring. just looked it up. It would give the pool store good reason to stock it.
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    there is no profit in competing with wal mart for bleach sales.
    coloeb,
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    true dat
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    A pool store does not have to compete directly. They can stock chlorinating liquid at 10% or 12.5% concentration so is less weight to carry and they can reuse the bottles which is better than recycling. That's what my local pool store does and is why I buy from them rather than buying bleach from a store. Their price is reasonable at $3.00 per gallon which is equivalent to $1.11 for a 96-ounce jug of bleach.
    16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    Quote Originally Posted by chem geek
    A pool store does not have to compete directly. They can stock chlorinating liquid at 10% or 12.5% concentration so is less weight to carry and they can reuse the bottles which is better than recycling. That's what my local pool store does and is why I buy from them rather than buying bleach from a store. Their price is reasonable at $3.00 per gallon which is equivalent to $1.11 for a 96-ounce jug of bleach.
    Yep, I gave up on Walmart soon after getting our Liquidator. Its slightly more expensive at the pool store for the 5 gallon 12.5% carboy (+ deposit), but I pour 5 gallons into the LQ at once and forget about it for 10-14 days. When its low again I top off with another 5 gallons. Ill probably never have the full 8 gallon capacity in my LQ, but if I can go almost 2 weeks without having to refill, good enough for me!!

    The pool store I started buying from just started a rewards card type thing, spend 300.00 and get a 25.00 gift cert. So I get the points on that card for every 5 gallon I buy, brings total cost down a little (took almost 3 seasons to get to the 300.00!!)

    My garbage men appreciate it too.....I used to have one recycling bin JUST for empty bleach bottles.
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    Re: Disspell this myth for me someone please?

    Be advised that trying to "prove the pool store wrong" is largely akin to trying to teach a pig to sing. It will just frustrate you and annoy the pig.

    They believe what they know.
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