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Thread: Oversized pump?

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    esim13's Avatar
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    Oversized pump?

    I purchased my system 2 years ago. Within the first 6 months the pump stopped. Upon returning it to the store they did not have a 1.5 hp replacement so they gave me the 2 hp. After reading a few posts on here, I'm now wondering if it's too big?? The pump is a Pentair Turbo King and the filter is an Artesian. My pipes are 1.5 in. If you need more info please let me know.
    Thanks!
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Unless you have a cartridge filter, the maximum flow rate of the pump should equal the maximum flow rate of the filter. Horsepower ratings can be deceptive and a 1 1/2 hp full rated pump could be the same as a 2hp uprated pump.

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    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    I'm also thinking of moving the pump further from the pool. Would the hp make a difference?
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    The only real problem with an oversized pump is that it uses more electricity than a smaller pump would to do the same job. Unless you have a spa or waterfall or some other water feature, a 2 HP pump is larger than what you really need and costs more to run than a smaller pump would cost.

    You can move the equipment pad further away but you should use larger pipes than you have now if you do that. The longer the pipe run, the more important it is to have appropriately sized pipes.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Oversized pump?

    You should have a flow rate of 15 - 20 gpm per sq ft to properly operate a sand filter. Anything larger can channel the sand and anything smaller won't properly backwash the filter.

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    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Quote Originally Posted by renovxpt
    You should have a flow rate of 15 - 20 gpm per sq ft to properly operate a sand filter. Anything larger can channel the sand and anything smaller won't properly backwash the filter.
    How do I calculate my flow rate?
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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    Re: Oversized pump?

    1st, Pentair doesn't make a pump called a Turbo King. Are you sure it isn't an Artesian?

    Most 2 HP pool pumps, given a normal amount of head loss will move about 80-100 GPM. Most will be starved and will cavitate if the impeller isn't reduced or slowed down when fed using 1.5" plumbing. This will reduce you to about 55-70 GPM.

    This is because the friction in the pipe won't let enough water pass given the amount of suction/pushing power available.

    I have never seen a 2 HP pool pump with less than 2" ports because, unmodified, the plumbing can't accommodate the needed volume of water.

    Scott
    Owner of - PoolGuyNJ LLC
    Expert Pool and Spa Repairs, Renovations, and Augmentation. Helping people decide what is the right gear for meeting their needs. Expectations Set, Expectations Met, No Surprises.

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    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Quote Originally Posted by PoolGuyNJ
    1st, Pentair doesn't make a pump called a Turbo King. Are you sure it isn't an Artesian?
    I know the sand filter is Artesian. If I remember correctly the only thing brand wise on the pump says Pentair Products. I guess that's where I got confused. It was bought and installed together as a system tho. Anyway, I'll double check tomorrow and make corrections.

    Thanks!
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    AG pool pumps tend to be low or medium head pumps and don't move as much water as an in ground pump. Also, because the runs tend to be short, head loss is not that bad with 1 1/2" plumbing. My guess is that it is probably a uprated 2 HP and on a typical AG plumbing system would produce about 77 GPM at 40' of head.

    BTW, what is the filter pressure? I get about 13 PSI.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    I get around 13 PSI too and when I backwash it might drop to 11. I have never gotten close to the 20 range prior to backwashing. I've tried to let it go but I usually have to backwash because I've lost pressure in the return.

    It started raining last night so I haven't been able to get the exact specs off the pump itself. When it calms down I'll try to get more info on the pump and check my psi.

    Thanks!
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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    Brentr's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985
    AG pool pumps tend to be low or medium head pumps and don't move as much water as an in ground pump. Also, because the runs tend to be short, head loss is not that bad with 1 1/2" plumbing. My guess is that it is probably a uprated 2 HP and on a typical AG plumbing system would produce about 77 GPM at 40' of head.

    BTW, what is the filter pressure? I get about 13 PSI.
    Please excuse the OP. I hope that I have not bent any rules. mas985 I wish I could get that low of a pressure. Before my solar install I was at 18psi now I am at 23- 24 psi when I am running solar. Without the solar running it jumped up to 20psi because of 2 more added 90 degree elbows and a one way valve. I don't suppose I am hurting anything
    6,000 gal, IG free form,Beach Series Antigua by Marbletite Pebble finish,Sheer Descent, IG Fountain, Dolphin / Mermaid Statues,Dura- Glas 1.5hp pump,Hayward Pro-grid DE4820, Aqua Rite SWG with T-Cell 15,Heat Siphon Heat Pump DX 5.0 109,000 btu, Pool Cage, 1800sq ft Tremron Estate Pavers,Aquatherm Ecosun Solar Panels 192 sq ft with GL-235 Controller,Pentair IntelliBrite, Apollo Magnetic Stirrer Our New Poolbuild, Jacksonville, FL yr 2009 Solar install Outdoor kitchen upgrade

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear. When I wrote "I get about 13 PSI" what I meant was that I estimate that esim13's filter pressure should be about 13 PSI. Given that it is 11 PSI means there is less head loss in the plumbing then I estimated which is a good thing.

    Brent, with your pump on your plumbing, 18 PSI is reasonable and a 6 PSI rise with solar is also reasonable. Those are not outside the norm for a 1.5 HP pump.

    I use to have 19 PSI of pressure with a 1 HP full rated pump and then it would jump to about 26 PSI with solar. I replaced the impeller with a 1/2 HP and swapped the motor to a 2 speed. Now I get about 11 PSI and 16 PSI with solar. The pump size can make a big difference in addition to the plumbing.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    PoolGuyNJ,
    It is an Artesian but it has a Pentair Pool Products sticker on it too so there's where I got confused. Thanks for bringing that to my attention.

    Mas985,
    Right now my psi is at 12.

    So what I'm hearing is that if I move the pump 40' away, I need to change lines to 2 inch instead of 1.5 inch? Still a bit confused.....
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Yes if you move the pump 40' away, it would be a good idea to go to 2" lines.

    Also, Turbo King is a part of Pentair but I believe it came over from PacFab. These pumps are listed in some of the Pentair manuals:

    http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/Addendu ... orseOM.pdf
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Do you have the manuals that came with your pump and filter? Do you have pics?

    I got my AGP used and it came with a Pentair TurboKing pump with a label that says Artesan on it.

    I THINK it came as a package originally, the pump and filter. But I called Pentair and gave the CSR all the numbers I could find on both the pump and filter and she couldn't find any information on them at all and said it wasn't in her system.

    My original post is at:

    new-to-me-pentair-pump-how-does-it-work-help-t12254.html

    Toward the bottom is pics of my pump/filter (it's a lot cleaner now , this was right after the installer installed it... ground was real muddy, it took him almost 3 weeks to get everything up because it rained almost every day and delayed things.

    I'd love to find more information on my pump and hopefully you have the same one so maybe we can help each other
    24' x 52" AGP = 13.5k gallons
    Dynamo 2.0 HP pump,Sand Dollar sand filter
    Polaris 65 vacuum (good when there are a ton of leaves on bottom), Pool Rover Jr. (LOVE it, but power box dead right now), AquaCritter (an excellent suction side cleaner)

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    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Rastoma,
    It sounds like I have the exact same pump, looks like it too! I wrote down some numbers a while back and just found them - 340114. I know I have the book some where in the file cabinet. I'll try to find it and get some pics tomorrow in the daylight.
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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    Re: Oversized pump?

    340114 is on mine too. Also it says model 227T
    24' x 52" AGP = 13.5k gallons
    Dynamo 2.0 HP pump,Sand Dollar sand filter
    Polaris 65 vacuum (good when there are a ton of leaves on bottom), Pool Rover Jr. (LOVE it, but power box dead right now), AquaCritter (an excellent suction side cleaner)

  18. Back To Top    #18
    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Here are the pics of my pump and filter. I couldn't get to the side of the motor housing bc of the sand filter but I can read the numbers if you need them. I'm still trying to locate the manual. I know I have them bc I remember reading them over and over... now if I could just find them.......







    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    Rastoma,
    Didn't mean to leave you hanging but I still can not find my papers. I know they're in this house somewhere I am a VERY organized person and it's driving me crazy that I can't find them. When I do, I'll let you know.
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

  20. Back To Top    #20
    esim13's Avatar
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    Re: Oversized pump?

    After much searching it seems like my pump/motor look quite similar to the Dynamo or PacFab. I still cannot find my manuals. I've downloaded the manual for these from the Pentair website since it's as close as I can get.

    Another question: If I were to change my pump/motor, can I just change the motor part? If so, what do you recommend? As stated earlier I am running a 2hp, 24/7. I like running it 24/7 but I know there has to be something better out there.

    Thanks!
    10,408 gallon, 21' round, 52 in' deep AG, half in ground
    Artesian Clear Master Plus Sand Filter, Artesian Turbo King 2 hp pump, installed June 08
    Denham Springs, Louisiana
    GEAUX TIGERS!
    Pics taken 2012
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0606.jpg
    http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad25 ... CN0607.jpg

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