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Thread: Talk about stupid!

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    DONNIE's Avatar
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    Talk about stupid!

    We had a power outage the other night around 9:15 pm. I expected as usual for it to be restored within the hour and didn't really give any thought to the pool. Temps dropped well below freezing that night. 12 hours below freezing with no power and no preventative maintainence. Everything froze! Nothing "looks" broke and I've "opened" every fitting and drain plug and am letting nature thaw it at its own speed. Temps are good for the next week. The point of my question? Can this stuff freeze and be okay? I'm thinking its going to be a couple of more days before I can even try it. Stupid? Yes. Lesson learned? Yes. Embarassed? Extreemly!

    Donnie
    8500 Gallon Fiberglass IG / Sta-Rite pump,cartridge filter & heater / PoolPilot Dig 220-36 SWG / Testing w/K2006

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Donnie, I'm sorry this happened

    I think you'll probably survive this with little/ no problems

    Any issues you encounter can be dealt with, with the help from the pros here

    Keep us informed as to your progress and we'll advise.
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Donnie,

    There aren't many visuals to tell if water is actaully freezing in the plumbing so I was curious as to how you know that "Everything froze"? Pool water? Pump basket?
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Quote Originally Posted by DONNIE
    We had a power outage the other night around 9:15 pm. I expected as usual for it to be restored within the hour and didn't really give any thought to the pool. Temps dropped well below freezing that night. 12 hours below freezing with no power and no preventative maintainence.
    This is the biggest issue with not winterizing. What-if! What if the power goes out, what if the pump quits, what if the plumbing springs a leak... We (yes, I include myself) that don't winterize should have a solid backup plan (or two) in case the worst happens.


    Back to the question at hand!
    Quote Originally Posted by Donnie
    Can this stuff freeze and be okay?
    Yes it's possible for it to freeze and still be okay. It all depends on how, where and how long it freezes as to how much damage it does if any at all. For instance, a lot of peoples water to their homes have frozen around here and if they catch it quick enough and call me (I'm the one that has a torpedo heater) it can usually be thawed out and there'll be no leaks.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    It got up to 54 today. Upper 40's the rest of the week and next weekend. My filter froze solid. It's $250 just for the cartridge so I'm not "forcing" it to thaw. All the lines has some freezing in them. I don't think the pump froze. There was about 2" if ice in the very top of the pump basket but water underneath. I had thawed spots on the pool surface at the skimmer and one of the closest pressure eyeballs, I take that as a good sign that there is warm air in the pipes. SWG "looks" good. No visible damage to the cell anyway. The heater "looks" good but who knows. I think if I have a problem it may be there. We just keep praying for warm weather and reminding ourselves that it's a small thing compared to others in our nation ans around the world.

    Donnie
    8500 Gallon Fiberglass IG / Sta-Rite pump,cartridge filter & heater / PoolPilot Dig 220-36 SWG / Testing w/K2006

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Donnie,

    As previously stated, I don't think much damage could have occurred

    A lot of 'old school pool dudes' leave all the lines open and didn't drain anything. I read an article a number of years ago about freeze damage in such situations, the bottom line of that article was that: as long as the ice can expand through the system (pipes perhaps), there isn't a problem, there's only a problem, if it partially thaws and the ends are still 'capped' by ice to prevent the expansion. Given this info, I'd say that a 1 time freeze shouldn't result in any damage (However, I can't say that the ends of the pipes didn't freeze first and cause said ice blockage )

    If anything was damaged by the freeze, we'll be here to help fix the problem
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Thanks Ted. It's really looking good today. All valves are turning and ice is melting rapidly. 55 degrees tomorrow!!!! Fortunatley or not, I have to work each day and don't get home until after dark. That keeps me from "rushing" it. I'm all ready to flip the switch Saturday and hope for the best. I know for a fact that ice did not form at the pipe ends, it froze at the equiptment and moved away. More later!

    Donnie
    8500 Gallon Fiberglass IG / Sta-Rite pump,cartridge filter & heater / PoolPilot Dig 220-36 SWG / Testing w/K2006

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Good morning all! Well......got everything thawed, got a new filter housing lock ring and pressure guage ($126.00 from poolcenter.com). I cant believe my filter froze so solid that it exploded and blew the lock ring into 20 pieces. Checked and double checked every fitting, said a prayer and threw the breaker. It worked!!! Everything "seems" fine. Had 1 drip at a screw-on pvc fitting which only needed tightening. I have a 1" hairline crack in the heater manifold that was dripping slightly but has now stopped. When warmer weather comes I will take it off and see if I can "weld" it with a soldering gun (it's plastic). If that dosent work it will cost $295.00 for a new assembly. Thats better than a $1700.00 heater. Water temp is 49 degrees so I wont know how the SWG faired until it warms up and starts producing chlorine but it "seems" fine. Added water, adjusted chlorine and Ph, thanked the Lord and finally......smiled! I have already made an emergency check list of what to do next time we have a power failure during freezing conditions and went over it with my wife. In less than 2 minutes I could have prevented this nightmare. Lesson learned! Just wanted to update you all and thank you for the support.

    Donnie
    8500 Gallon Fiberglass IG / Sta-Rite pump,cartridge filter & heater / PoolPilot Dig 220-36 SWG / Testing w/K2006

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Glad the news is good!

    If you do find any additional damage from the power outage/ freeze, let us know and we'll help as best we can
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    It's 52 degrees and I'm so happy.....I'm going out right now and clean the pool!!!

    Donnie
    8500 Gallon Fiberglass IG / Sta-Rite pump,cartridge filter & heater / PoolPilot Dig 220-36 SWG / Testing w/K2006

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Quote Originally Posted by DONNIE
    Good morning all! Well......got everything thawed, got a new filter housing lock ring and pressure guage ($126.00 from poolcenter.com). I cant believe my filter froze so solid that it exploded and blew the lock ring into 20 pieces.
    .
    .
    .
    I have already made an emergency check list of what to do next time we have a power failure during freezing conditions and went over it with my wife. In less than 2 minutes I could have prevented this nightmare. Lesson learned! Just wanted to update you all and thank you for the support.
    How about sharing your emergency check list (since you're in a good mood and all...? ) Could help out a lot of folks who don't fully winterize but go through what you did.
    14,555 gal in-ground 16'x29' white plaster Pool w/spa (2007); Goldline Aqua Logic AQL-PS-8 control w/Aqua Cell 15 Salt Water Chlorination (SWCG); Hayward TriStar 1HP (1.85 SF) main / 1.5HP (1.60 SF) spa pumps; Hayward Swimclear cart filter C4025, ColorLogic LED lights; Tankless SP-18-4 electric heater; Polaris 280 cleaner.
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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Some of the simple instructions are for the wife. She dosen't get around the equiptment much.

    Loss of power in freezing conditions

    #1 Don’t panic ! You have plenty of time !

    #2 Throw pump motor breaker (breaker box on wall)

    #3 Turn timer to “OFF”

    #4 Open faucet knob to release air (turn to the left)

    #5 Open release valve on top of filter housing (turn to the left)

    #6 Remove drain plug from bottom left of filter housing
    (insert screwdriver and lift up to loosen, remove by hand)

    #7 Remove drain plug from bottom left of heater housing

    #8 Remove pump cover and basket (turn to the left)

    #9 Bail excess water from pump housing

    #10 Relax ! It’s all good !
    8500 Gallon Fiberglass IG / Sta-Rite pump,cartridge filter & heater / PoolPilot Dig 220-36 SWG / Testing w/K2006

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    I like it.

    Guess your pad is above pool elevation and is like mine: no ball valve on the suction side before the pump, so water just flows back into the pool. (Gee, I wish I had one of those so my pump wouldn't have to prime every time I clean out the basket!)

    Thanks for posting!
    14,555 gal in-ground 16'x29' white plaster Pool w/spa (2007); Goldline Aqua Logic AQL-PS-8 control w/Aqua Cell 15 Salt Water Chlorination (SWCG); Hayward TriStar 1HP (1.85 SF) main / 1.5HP (1.60 SF) spa pumps; Hayward Swimclear cart filter C4025, ColorLogic LED lights; Tankless SP-18-4 electric heater; Polaris 280 cleaner.
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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Donnie, sounds like a good way to get through a power outage in freezing weather

    I posted here on 'quick winterizing' and think that what you advise would do well in most situations - though I'd still like to see the lines blown and plugged

    Polyvue posted whilst I was, but I don't think I need to change, nor edit, my response
    Luv& Luk
    -Ted

    Having done construction and service for 4 pool companies in 4 states starting in 1988, what I know about pools could fill a couple of books - what I don't know could fill a couple of libraries :-D

    POOL SCHOOL, TF Testkits, Jason's Pool Calculator, CYA vs. cl chart, (Just a few DARNED handy links!)

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    DONNIE's Avatar
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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    All my plumbing is at least 18" below ground and my equiptment pad is aprox 12" higher than water level so everything drains back to the pool once all the air and pressure is released from the system. Now if I had only had those thoughts Christmas Eve!

    Donnie
    8500 Gallon Fiberglass IG / Sta-Rite pump,cartridge filter & heater / PoolPilot Dig 220-36 SWG / Testing w/K2006

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Quote Originally Posted by DONNIE
    Some of the simple instructions are for the wife. She dosen't get around the equiptment much.

    Loss of power in freezing conditions

    #1 Don’t panic ! You have plenty of time !

    #2 Throw pump motor breaker (breaker box on wall)

    #3 Turn timer to “OFF”

    #4 Open faucet knob to release air (turn to the left)

    #5 Open release valve on top of filter housing (turn to the left)

    #6 Remove drain plug from bottom left of filter housing
    (insert screwdriver and lift up to loosen, remove by hand)

    #7 Remove drain plug from bottom left of heater housing

    #8 Remove pump cover and basket (turn to the left)

    #9 Bail excess water from pump housing

    #10 Relax ! It’s all good !
    Or simply turn on backup generator We in Florida have hurricanes and some of us have backup generators because you can loose electric power for days. I am not sure if this would be an alternative for you in OK Just a thought
    6,000 gal, IG free form,Beach Series Antigua by Marbletite Pebble finish,Sheer Descent, IG Fountain, Dolphin / Mermaid Statues,Dura- Glas 1.5hp pump,Hayward Pro-grid DE4820, Aqua Rite SWG with T-Cell 15,Heat Siphon Heat Pump DX 5.0 109,000 btu, Pool Cage, 1800sq ft Tremron Estate Pavers,Aquatherm Ecosun Solar Panels 192 sq ft with GL-235 Controller,Pentair IntelliBrite, Apollo Magnetic Stirrer Our New Poolbuild, Jacksonville, FL yr 2009 Solar install Outdoor kitchen upgrade

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    DONNIE's Avatar
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    Update

    Well it's been 4 months since the BIG FREEZE! I finally got around to replacing the cracked heater manifold and all's well!!!!! After TOTALLY FREEZING my pool equiptment I'm back to normal. Well...normal less about $450.00. Lesson learned big time! SWG is working properly, pump is normal, heater dosen't leak at all (haven't fired it up but don't see that being an issue), filter is normal and at normal pressure. Water today is 73 and crystal clear. My advise? Know your equiptment. Know where your drain plugs are and be prepared to remove them during a power loss when you have freezing conditions. Our check list now has "visual aids" so anyone could "winterize" the pool in an emergency. Man...I've learned so much about pools in the last 3 years due to this board. Thanks for the advice and thanks for listening. C'mon 80 degrees!!!

    Donnie
    8500 Gallon Fiberglass IG / Sta-Rite pump,cartridge filter & heater / PoolPilot Dig 220-36 SWG / Testing w/K2006

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    Re: Talk about stupid!

    Thanks for the update Donnie!
    Helpful links: Pool School; CYA/Chlorine Chart
    24' round AG pool, 52" high, Raypak heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
    150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
    http://www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com

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