Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 36

Thread: Filter & Pump Upgrade

  1. Back To Top    #1

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Filter & Pump Upgrade

    I've noticed I can get a Hayward 21" Sandfilter with 1.5HP Powerflo Matrix pump new for less than $200 right now.

    Next season's plans are to upgrade, but I was planning to get a 1HP pump. I wanted to get a pump big enough to run 140 SQ FT or so of solar panels on top of a 1 story garage, but not break the bank to run 8+ hours a day when the panels are in the sun. I do plan to eventually upgrade the pool to a hard walled 21' or 24' round AGP, but realisticly not for another 2-3 seasons, or until the Intex fails.

    I was trying to avoid a 2-speed or VS right now, I wanted to keep this simple and inexpensive.

    How much more energy would the 1.5HP use over the 1HP? 1-1/2 times? 3 times? I barely notice the Intex 3/4HP on the utility bill.

    Would the additional 0.5HP be really worth the added operational cost? I'm just starting to research pump curve, head, etc, is the 1.5HP pump's power over the 1HP really noticeable (or needed) when vacuuming, or running solar like I describe?

    Thanks in advance!
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  2. Back To Top    #2

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    FWIW-
    I ended up going with the 1.5HP. Amazon has the filter pump combo for $146. Couldn't pass it up at that price.

    I figure that even if I don't use that pump in the long run (most likely will), the 21" sandfilter alone is worth the $146.

    Right now they are under $145

    https://www.amazon.com/Hayward-S210T...%2Bfilter&th=1
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  3. Back To Top    #3

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Yup, I had posted about this deal a few days ago, and ended up buying one also. We usually have the pool packed up for the winter by now, but I'm keeping it up a bit longer to test the new pump/filter when it arrives (day after tomorrow). Reading a few of the negative reviews on the listing persuaded me that I'd want to see if the equipment works correctly now, rather than letting warranty run out during the winter.

    Are you planning to hook yours up when it arrives?

    I bought 200 lbs of filter sand yesterday... Quite a change from the previous small Intex cartridge filter plus pump unit, that I could carry easily under one arm
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  4. Back To Top    #4

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    I was planning to close this weekend now that the pool is down to 60F, but now I think I'll wait until after I can try this new pump & filter. I doubt I'll put sand in in tho, I just want to make sure water flows without any leaks.
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    I'm just concerned that blasting water through without filter medium may not be a good idea... I'll probably put sand in, and then deal with draining the filter and getting it ready for winter a few days later.
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  6. Back To Top    #6

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Here's one aspect of that concern... from a 2012 post by Bama Rambler:

    QUOTE
    Centrifugal pumps are funny things. They draw the most current under the lowest head moving the most water. Raising the amount of head (pressure) causes it to work less and therefore draw less current.
    END QUOTE

    I think we're already close to the limit on the circuit the pump will be connected to (that's looking at the amp rating for the new pump) -- don't want to draw any additional current by reducing head on the output side. Also, I will hook up with hoses for testing purposes (no hard plumbing) and I'd like to reduce the risk of an amusing and/or dramatic plumbing failure, LOL.

    Not sure if you might have any similar concerns in your setup...
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  7. Back To Top    #7

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Quote Originally Posted by singingpond View Post
    Here's one aspect of that concern... from a 2012 post by Bama Rambler:

    QUOTE
    Centrifugal pumps are funny things. They draw the most current under the lowest head moving the most water. Raising the amount of head (pressure) causes it to work less and therefore draw less current.
    END QUOTE

    I think we're already close to the limit on the circuit the pump will be connected to (that's looking at the amp rating for the new pump) -- don't want to draw any additional current by reducing head on the output side. Also, I will hook up with hoses for testing purposes (no hard plumbing) and I'd like to reduce the risk of an amusing and/or dramatic plumbing failure, LOL.

    Not sure if you might have any similar concerns in your setup...
    That's good info, thanks. My current pump is on a dedicated 20A circuit, so I think I'm ok for a short-run test.

    My current filter/pump sits on a couple of patio blocks, I planned to pour a proper concrete pad in the spring to put the new filter on, as well as store the new filter in the house over this winter, hence my reluctance to add 200lbs of sand.

    I guess I could close off the return valves to create some back pressure to simulate the resistance of the sand.

    I just plan to run the system 15-30 minutes, and check that all multi port positions work properly.

    I saw some of the reviews that mentioned cracking in the seams of the filter, but 85% of the reviews are 4-star or better (70% 5-star) so I'm confident in the purchase, my main concern is that the system is not DOA.
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Yeah, I have that same reluctance to leave the brand new filter outdoors; however, I'm pretty sure I won't be hauling it indoors next winter, so I tell myself it may as well get used to its outdoor existence right away. I do plan to bring the pump indoors in the winter... that may actually be a problem if it's bolted to the same base as the filter, hadn't thought of that complication... Let's hope we both get non-DOA units
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  9. Back To Top    #9

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Dom, I have another question -- hope you don't mind...

    In another thread I saw that you bring your multiport (from your current smaller sand filter) inside during the winter. I've been reading quite a bit on the forum in the last few days about winterizing sand filters, since this is all new to me -- some people bring the multiport inside, others just put it in that in-between winter position and leave it outdoors. I haven't gotten a clear read on why one would choose one or the other option. Could you explain the advantages of disconnecting and bringing the multiport inside, as you understand them?
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  10. Back To Top    #10

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Since I've already removed the multi port valve to deep clean the filter, I figure keeping the valve out of the freezing temps & weather exposure will only increase its operational life. My biggest fear is trapped water in the valve body, freezing and damaging the valve (especially since Intex does not sell the spider gasket).

    I also plan to bring in the digital timer & solar controller.
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  11. Back To Top    #11

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Well, my Hayward pump/filter showed up yesterday evening. The filter tank, and the pump, both look laughably huge compared to the current equipment . Will try to work on hooking stuff up today.

    Should I start another thread, or would it make more sense to update here? I'm not sure, since this is not my thread, but we are talking about identical equipment, so perhaps other readers would find it more useful in the same spot ?

    Thanks for the comments on the multiport and winterizing! That (the multiport) is the one box I haven't opened yet; filter tank, standpipe and laterals, and pump all looked fine on initial inspection. There were a number of large plastic shavings down in the tank, which I didn't see until lifting the standpipe and (folded) laterals up and out of the way.
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  12. Back To Top    #12

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Please go right ahead and update here, I'll do the same.

    Unless you planned to do an in-depth unboxing/review, that should go in a new thread.
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  13. Back To Top    #13

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Quote Originally Posted by singingpond View Post
    Well, my Hayward pump/filter showed up yesterday evening. The filter tank, and the pump, both look laughably huge compared to the current equipment . Will try to work on hooking stuff up today.

    Should I start another thread, or would it make more sense to update here? I'm not sure, since this is not my thread, but we are talking about identical equipment, so perhaps other readers would find it more useful in the same spot ?

    Thanks for the comments on the multiport and winterizing! That (the multiport) is the one box I haven't opened yet; filter tank, standpipe and laterals, and pump all looked fine on initial inspection. There were a number of large plastic shavings down in the tank, which I didn't see until lifting the standpipe and (folded) laterals up and out of the way.
    Did you get a chance to try the new pump & filter?

    My tracking has said "billing info received" for the past 3 days, guess I won't see mine till next week sometime.
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  14. Back To Top    #14

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Still trying to find time to make progress on it. Assorted kid activities interfered yesterday; still working on getting things set up today. I'll definitely update, once we have everything hooked up, and hit the switch . I have to say, the 'instructions' packed with the system are fairly useless -- there are separate 'manuals' (and I use the term very lightly, as befits the amount of information contained therein) for each of the components (pump, filter, multiport). The first two pages of each manual are filled with all the different ways the object in question is prepared to kill you -- i.e. warnings about all sorts of stuff, plausible and implausible. Then there's a little bit of technical information. Not much at all about the nitty gritty details of hooking up the separate components into a 'system'. The big package does come with all necessary hoses to hook up to the pool, as well as a pump-to-filter hose, and with clamps, and even a cute little roll of teflon tape. For anyone who is unfamiliar with pool equipment, or with DIY assembly in general, the lack of good instructions and pictures might be daunting.
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  15. Back To Top    #15

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    OK, it is running! Pump is not too loud, considering how big it looks to me. The pool now looks like quite a whirlpool - bits of debris on the surface cruise around at an impressive rate.
    Not too many leaks, I think, although it was hard to tell, since I finished hooking up the last hose in the dark, in the rain.

    I let it run for about 20 minutes; then turned it off. I don't trust it enough yet to leave it running unsupervised overnight.

    I'll update tomorrow with a few more details, and hopefully a picture or two.

    So far so good!
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  16. Back To Top    #16

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Quote Originally Posted by singingpond View Post
    OK, it is running! Pump is not too loud, considering how big it looks to me. The pool now looks like quite a whirlpool - bits of debris on the surface cruise around at an impressive rate.
    Not too many leaks, I think, although it was hard to tell, since I finished hooking up the last hose in the dark, in the rain.

    I let it run for about 20 minutes; then turned it off. I don't trust it enough yet to leave it running unsupervised overnight.

    I'll update tomorrow with a few more details, and hopefully a picture or two.

    So far so good!
    Great to hear!

    I feel like a kid waiting on Christmas morning to come while I wait on mine to arrive.

    Looking forward to some pics.
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  17. Back To Top    #17

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    I agree with the Christmas theme

    Here I am feeling like Christmas morning - it's light enough outside to go play with the new pool equipment! Since it's a cold gray October morning in Connecticut, the pool enthusiasm does feel a bit odd, but who cares
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  18. Back To Top    #18

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Argghhh, cold, gray, and raining. I did stand by the pool for a few minutes, under my umbrella, admiring the circling leaves and floating bugs. If the weather clears later, I'll try vacuuming.

    There looks to be a bit of sand in the pool (not a lot). Since I have no previous experience with sand filters, and since initial backwash was done after dark yesterday, also in the rain, I probably didn't let it run long enough.

    Incidentally, one of many warnings in the manuals is that this equipment is NOT to be used with storable pools; I guess we are both breaking the rules with this upgrade.
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

  19. Back To Top    #19

    TFP Guide
    domct203's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,354

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Quote Originally Posted by singingpond View Post
    Argghhh, cold, gray, and raining. I did stand by the pool for a few minutes, under my umbrella, admiring the circling leaves and floating bugs. If the weather clears later, I'll try vacuuming.

    There looks to be some sand in the pool (not a lot). Since I have no previous experience with sand filters, and since initial backwash was done after dark yesterday, also in the rain, I probably didn't let it run long enough.

    Incidentally, one of many warnings in the manuals is that this equipment is NOT to be used with storable pools; I guess we are both breaking the rules with this upgrade.
    Yeah, nasty here in New Haven as well.

    Hmm, sand in the pool..... Did you backwash, rinse, backwash, rinse? Could be insufficient initial backwashing, that is a lot of sand. Once you initially clean the sand, there really shouldn't be sand getting back to the pool with regular backwashing.

    Here's to a dry afternoon and maybe some pics. Right now I'm still staring at this one

    IMG_8769.jpg
    Dom - TFP Guide
    Intex 18' X 48" Ultra Frame AGP 6700 gallons | Hayward Pro Series 21" Sandfilter | Hayward 1.5HP Power Flo Matrix pump | Hayward Thru-wall Skimmer | Wanda the Whale | 72 sq ft of Sungrabber Solar Panels | Taylor K2006 Test Kit, Sample Sizer & Speed Stir | Click Here To Become a TFP Supporter!

  20. Back To Top    #20

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    728

    Re: Filter & Pump Upgrade

    Almost certainly insufficient backwash - I didn't time it, just guestimated while watching sight glass by flashlight; also there was still lots of air in pump basket during the first part of backwash time. I didn't do second backwash/rinse cycle; I hadn't come across that idea before.

    There doesn't appear to be any additional sand coming out of the return today, so that's good.

    I hope you see some progress on your tracking info soon!
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •