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Thread: Constant high PH levels

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    Constant high PH levels

    My pool is 16 months old now. I work with my pool store very closely that constructed my pool. I have always had a terrible time getting my pool chemicals balanced. Not once in 16 months have I tested my water and had good levels. I test twice a day pool side and take in a water sample weekly to the pool store. We use all Bioguard chemicals and my pool store uses their Alex system to test water. Pool store wants me to keep my PH at 7.4-7.6 and Adj. Total Alkalinity 125-150. This has been an impossible task for me. Everytime I test my PH is around 8.0+ and I add several pints of muratic acid in daily to lower the PH. Then my total alkalinity drops and I have to add Balance Pack 100 to raise the alkalinity. This is a back and forth battle that I have never been able to maintain. This is the second pool I have owned and never remember having this problem before. I realize that high PH is normal until my plaster cures in new construction but even my pool store seems baffled by how much acid I have to add. I was going through 4 gallons of muratic acid every week. It is slowed down now to about 4 gallons every two weeks. If anyone can help I would appreciate it. My costs on chemicals is outrageous. My latest testing Sat. idx. 0.4, TDS 1800, CYA 80, Total Chlorine 2.1, Free Chlorine 2.1, PH 7.7, Tot. Alkalinity 114, Adj. Total Alkalinity 90, Tot. Hardness 277, Borates 30.
    18,300 Gallons IG white plaster, chlorine pool, water fall, slide, tanning ledge with bubbler. Pentair Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter 160332 Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump Pentair Booster Pump Model LA01N Pentair Racer Cleaner Install May 2015 Pentair Rainbow Pool and Spa Test Kit

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Low ph and high ta does not work. The acid and bicarb that you're adding are neutralizing each other. It's a complete waste of time and money. Keep the ph at 7.8 and stop adding bicarb regardless of the ta. You should find that the ph stops rising when the ta hits about 60.

    If you have ever mixed vinegar and baking soda, then you have seen what happens when you mix acid and bicarb. You get salt, water and carbon dioxide. Your tds is so high from all of the salt added by this reaction.

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    The pool store tells me that these low ta levels will cause corrosion.
    18,300 Gallons IG white plaster, chlorine pool, water fall, slide, tanning ledge with bubbler. Pentair Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter 160332 Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump Pentair Booster Pump Model LA01N Pentair Racer Cleaner Install May 2015 Pentair Rainbow Pool and Spa Test Kit

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Quote Originally Posted by Clteacher View Post
    The pool store tells me that these low ta levels will cause corrosion.
    Not true at all. Low ph or excessive chlorine levels cause metal corrosion. Low CSI (Calcite Saturation Index) causes plaster corrosion. Low CSI is a CSI that is below -0.3 for long periods of time or very low (below -0.6) for medium amounts of time.

    When you run the waterfall or bubbler, this increases the rate of carbon dioxide loss and accelerates the reaction of the bicarb and acid. Just like shaking a soda causes carbon dioxide to be lost.

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    My saturation index is 0.4 right now. They are saying this is high.

    - - - Updated - - -

    My regular maintenance is:
    1 Qt. Scale inhibitor once a month
    3" silk guard chlorine tabs in chlorinator
    2 bags of Burn Out 73 weekly (shock)
    3oz. of Algae All 60 weekly
    18,300 Gallons IG white plaster, chlorine pool, water fall, slide, tanning ledge with bubbler. Pentair Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter 160332 Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump Pentair Booster Pump Model LA01N Pentair Racer Cleaner Install May 2015 Pentair Rainbow Pool and Spa Test Kit

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    0.4 is a bit high. Get the TA down and your CSI will also come down. You will also see your ph level out.

    Forget the burnout, tabs and algaecide. Your CYA is already at the upper limit. Once you get the CSI down, you can probably stop using the scale inhibitor as well.

    Get the TF100 test kit and read pool school and you will see your chemical costs drop by 90% and your aggravation drop by the same amount.

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    That CSI is going to lead to calcium scale. Keep it between -0.3 and 0 to prevent scale since your TA tends high it will make your pH rise so you want to keep it on the negative side. More here, Pool School - Calcium Scaling
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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    What are the TA and calcium hardness of your fill water?

    Note: I don't think that the TA tends high. It's just been high because that's where the target was.

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Maybe not, water in Dallas is fairly high TA, 100 if it is raining and up to 140 in drought. They are close to Dallas but I think on different lakes for water supply.
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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    I know they have tested my fill water but I don't have those numbers. I will get them from the pool store. This pool has been a nightmare. We are doing everything our builder/store has told us to for chemicals and at 8 months old we started getting blue staining on the tanning ledge over several months it started covering almost the entire pool. Bioguard reps were sent out to my house and they didn't have answers for it. When they tested the water it showed zero copper but it looked like copper stains. Bioguard took fill water samples back to Atlanta and results showed fill water to have 0.2 copper in our source water. They drained our pool did an acid wash to remove the stains and now changed up the shock and algaecide we use and told us to put pool magnet in once a month.
    18,300 Gallons IG white plaster, chlorine pool, water fall, slide, tanning ledge with bubbler. Pentair Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter 160332 Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump Pentair Booster Pump Model LA01N Pentair Racer Cleaner Install May 2015 Pentair Rainbow Pool and Spa Test Kit

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Unfortunately, many PBs do not know a whole lot about managing water chemistry. And many pool stores are not much better. Many algaecides contain copper.

    +1 to buying a TF-100 from TFTestkits.net and taking control of your pool. We can definitely help you get your pool under control.
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    2012 build and pics, 20k gal gunite, black onyx pebblesheen, OK flagstone, IntellifoVS, cart filter w/Pleatco, IC40 SWG, Solartouch, 5 12'x4' solar panels, HP50HA heat pump, 8mil solar cover, borates, TF-100 test kit, SONOS, Doheny's Discovery Robot, hot tub on bleach

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    I told them I suspected the algaecide we were using was causing the blue stains because it contains copper but Bioguard swore it could not be that because it was sequestered copper but after all their testing they had us change from the algaecide we were using to Algae All 60.
    18,300 Gallons IG white plaster, chlorine pool, water fall, slide, tanning ledge with bubbler. Pentair Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter 160332 Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump Pentair Booster Pump Model LA01N Pentair Racer Cleaner Install May 2015 Pentair Rainbow Pool and Spa Test Kit

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Copper tests don't always show when there is copper in the water, especially when most of the copper is not in the water but in the form of stains. It sounds like they originally had you using copper algaecide, which you can see is not good. Copper algaecide can definitely cause copper staining.

    You can go online and usually find a water quality report filed by your water supplier. Most water sources have to file periodic water quality reports and make them available to users. It should include levels of copper, TA and calcium.

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    My PB is my pool store too.
    18,300 Gallons IG white plaster, chlorine pool, water fall, slide, tanning ledge with bubbler. Pentair Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter 160332 Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump Pentair Booster Pump Model LA01N Pentair Racer Cleaner Install May 2015 Pentair Rainbow Pool and Spa Test Kit

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Water Report
    Current-CCR
    18,300 Gallons IG white plaster, chlorine pool, water fall, slide, tanning ledge with bubbler. Pentair Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter 160332 Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump Pentair Booster Pump Model LA01N Pentair Racer Cleaner Install May 2015 Pentair Rainbow Pool and Spa Test Kit

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Your fill water looks ok. In any case, it's known that bicarb and copper have been added when they were not needed.

    You can save a lot of money by just not buying most of what you have been buying as most of it is actually counterproductive.

    Get a good test kit and read pool school. You'll be glad you did.

    Keep posting questions as needed and we will help you get to where you know exactly what to do and not do.

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Exactly what test kit do you recommend?
    18,300 Gallons IG white plaster, chlorine pool, water fall, slide, tanning ledge with bubbler. Pentair Clean and Clear Cartridge Filter 160332 Pentair Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump Pentair Booster Pump Model LA01N Pentair Racer Cleaner Install May 2015 Pentair Rainbow Pool and Spa Test Kit

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Re: Constant high PH levels

    Quote Originally Posted by Clteacher View Post
    Exactly what test kit do you recommend?
    TFTestkits.net

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    Re: Constant high PH levels

    You are getting good advice here, I just wanted to jump in and wish you luck at getting off the pool store treadmill
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
    I use and endorse TFtestKits TF-100 from http://tftestkits.net
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