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Thread: New To TFP Method - First Test

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    New To TFP Method - First Test

    Since my pool was built I have had a pool service perform weekly "full service". I'm new to TFP and the TFP method; this afternoon I performed my first test with the TF-100. The results are:

    Daily Tests:
    Chlorine: 10
    pH: 8

    Weekly Tests:
    FC: 13
    CC: 0
    TC:13
    CH: 600
    * TA: 130
    * CYA: 115

    TA clarification: step 3 in the TA instructions says to add "until the color changes to red"... 13 drops and it was pinkish/redish while at 16 is was more clearly red - I stopped there. If had I continued would the color have become "more red"?? How do I know what "until the color changes to red" means? To me, that is somewhat vague and absolutely relative. Maybe the degree of red doesn't matter. Maybe the pinkish/redish color I got at 13 was sufficient for the test. Could somebody please clarify?

    CYA clarifiction: step 2 in the CYA instructions indicates to use the graduation closest to the fill level. Well, my fill level was lower (higher number) than the 100 graduation - I estimate it to be about 115. The graduations are in increments of 10 so if the graduations went further down the tube the next would have been 110 - which is closer to my estimate of 115. So for the purposes of PoolMath do I still use 100?

    Because this is new to me I am going to re-test tomorrow to compare results. However, based on the current numbers PoolMath says to:

    * add 29 oz of 31.45% muriatic acid.
    * (CH) replace 50% of the water with new water.
    * (CYA) replace 60% of the water with new water.

    These recommendations are based on the goals of the TFP method, using bleach, for a plaster pool. Additionally, all goal values were set at the mid-point of the range. For example, if a goal has the range 30-50, I set my goal to 40. So, assuming I tested correctly and can rely on the recommendations, I assume the water needs replaced and then start testing again to stabilize the environment as opposed to honoring the current recommendation to add acid. How much water to drain - 50 or 60%?

    I am shocked at the recommendation to replace so much water (though I think I had read somewhere that this has to do with TDS or some such??). All the while, my pool has never visually had a problem - it always looks fantastic. Even friends with their own pools comment how great mine looks compared to theirs'... they want to use my pool service!

    Your feedback is greatly appreciated. Thank you very much for your patience.

    -Mickey
    26K gal, in-ground, spa, Wet Edge Satin pebble, Pentair Intelliflo VS-3050, Whisperflo 1.5HP, Clean and Clear Plus 520 cartridge, MasterTemp 400, EasyTouch PS-4 and ScreenLogic 2, GloBrite LEDs, DeltaUV D-20, Paramount Clear O3 and PV3, completed July 2014, TF-100, full sun, city water

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    Re: New To TFP Method - First Test

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickey Moose View Post
    Since my pool was built I have had a pool service perform weekly "full service". I'm new to TFP and the TFP method; this afternoon I performed my first test with the TF-100. The results are:

    Daily Tests:
    Chlorine: 10
    pH: 8

    Weekly Tests:
    FC: 13
    CC: 0
    TC:13
    CH: 600
    * TA: 130
    * CYA: 115

    TA clarification: step 3 in the TA instructions says to add "until the color changes to red"... 13 drops and it was pinkish/redish while at 16 is was more clearly red - I stopped there. If had I continued would the color have become "more red"?? How do I know what "until the color changes to red" means? To me, that is somewhat vague and absolutely relative. Maybe the degree of red doesn't matter. Maybe the pinkish/redish color I got at 13 was sufficient for the test. Could somebody please clarify? Regardless of color continue to add drops until there is NO further color change. That marks the endpoint of the test.

    CYA clarifiction: step 2 in the CYA instructions indicates to use the graduation closest to the fill level. Well, my fill level was lower (higher number) than the 100 graduation - I estimate it to be about 115. The graduations are in increments of 10 so if the graduations went further down the tube the next would have been 110 - which is closer to my estimate of 115. So for the purposes of PoolMath do I still use 100? Yeah, that'll work. You know it is too high and has to come down.....that's the most important takeaway. If you really need to know your CYA, dilute the pool sample 50% with tap water then test and muliply X 2

    Because this is new to me I am going to re-test tomorrow to compare results. However, based on the current numbers PoolMath says to:

    * add 29 oz of 31.45% muriatic acid.
    * (CH) replace 50% of the water with new water.
    * (CYA) replace 60% of the water with new water.

    These recommendations are based on the goals of the TFP method, using bleach, for a plaster pool. Additionally, all goal values were set at the mid-point of the range. For example, if a goal has the range 30-50, I set my goal to 40. So, assuming I tested correctly and can rely on the recommendations, I assume the water needs replaced and then start testing again to stabilize the environment as opposed to honoring the current recommendation to add acid. How much water to drain - 50 or 60%?

    I am shocked at the recommendation to replace so much water (though I think I had read somewhere that this has to do with TDS or some such??). All the while, my pool has never visually had a problem - it always looks fantastic. Even friends with their own pools comment how great mine looks compared to theirs'... they want to use my pool service!

    Your feedback is greatly appreciated. Thank you very much for your patience.

    -Mickey
    You don't have to do a thing to your pool if you choose not to. PoolMath doesn't tell you how to fix your pool.....it suggests ranges we have found to be viable. It's really up to you to know when it makes sense to change your parameters.

    read "The ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry" up in Pool School......it'll give you some more insight.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    txnole's Avatar
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    Re: New To TFP Method - First Test

    Congrats on your TF100. Your results are typical of a pool coming off of a pool service, as most (not all) have more regard for your money than your investment in your pool.

    My advice is to sleep on it and retest tomorrow. Your TA was probably good at 13 but go watch here to confirm your process: https://www.youtube.com/user/tf100te...e=results_main

    That said, if your CYA comes back so high again, focus first on water replacement. Knowing the test numbers of your fill water (CH, especially) is helpful so check that as well before doing a fill.
    COMPLETED BUILD THREAD - 15'x29' rectangular offset shotcrete pool; 14,100 gal; 5'x7' raised spa with 400k btu fire feature; 7' spillover; 25' leuder stone raised bond wall w/waterfall; Pentair SWG; Pentair VS (pool); Pentair 3/4hp feature pump; 1hp spa blower; Pentair Cartridge filter; Pentair “Easy Touch 8” wireless; Dolphin Oasis Z5 robot; Solar Hydronics iSwim solar panels; Mansard Screen Enclosure; walnut travertine deck; 1 very happy kiddo.

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    Re: New To TFP Method - First Test

    Dave, thank you for the comments. I've read the ABCs and other info on the site, as well as through others' posts. In the beginning it was a lot to take in but I've read, re-read, and read some more. Some is sinking in and undoubtedly more will as I get hands-on.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by txnole View Post
    Congrats on your TF100. Your results are typical of a pool coming off of a pool service, as most (not all) have more regard for your money than your investment in your pool.

    My advice is to sleep on it and retest tomorrow. Your TA was probably good at 13 but go watch here to confirm your process: https://www.youtube.com/user/tf100te...e=results_main

    That said, if your CYA comes back so high again, focus first on water replacement. Knowing the test numbers of your fill water (CH, especially) is helpful so check that as well before doing a fill.
    Regarding the TA comment, I watched the video again and decided that 16 looks pretty much like what the video showed.

    Testing fill water - should have been obvious but I had not thought about it.

    Soaking all up that I can. I am looking forward to giving my service company the boot... thanks to this site. As you noted, they appreciate my money. Unfortunately for them, I appreciate it more.
    26K gal, in-ground, spa, Wet Edge Satin pebble, Pentair Intelliflo VS-3050, Whisperflo 1.5HP, Clean and Clear Plus 520 cartridge, MasterTemp 400, EasyTouch PS-4 and ScreenLogic 2, GloBrite LEDs, DeltaUV D-20, Paramount Clear O3 and PV3, completed July 2014, TF-100, full sun, city water

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    Re: New To TFP Method - First Test

    I can't wait to hear how you think the water looks once you get it balanced to TFP levels. It will sparkle like a jewel

    Let us know what your tests show this morning. Your CYA may be even higher than you thought.

    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: New To TFP Method - First Test

    Here is an article about the CYA test. There are some extended instructions you should look at, especially step 9.
    Pool School - CYA
    Bob - Palm Beach by San Juan Pools. approx 5000 gals., Pentair 320 cartridge filter (all new guts installed by me), Goldline SWG, 'New to me' Kreepy Krauly Sand Shark, Intermec 104 Timer Test kit: TF-100 w/Speed Stir

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    Re: New To TFP Method - First Test

    So I performed daily and weekly tests again this afternoon and got very comparable results to what I posted from, my first test ever, yesterday. Instills confidence.

    - - - Updated - - -

    So if I'm going to drain water, for example 50%, are there any concerns with doing it all at once? Or maybe it needs to be done in stages... drain 25% (or whatever number), fill, drain another percentage... until I done a total of 50%?
    26K gal, in-ground, spa, Wet Edge Satin pebble, Pentair Intelliflo VS-3050, Whisperflo 1.5HP, Clean and Clear Plus 520 cartridge, MasterTemp 400, EasyTouch PS-4 and ScreenLogic 2, GloBrite LEDs, DeltaUV D-20, Paramount Clear O3 and PV3, completed July 2014, TF-100, full sun, city water

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: New To TFP Method - First Test

    Leave about a foot in the shallow end just to be on the safe side. We don't want any "popped" pools due to water table issues. IF you think it will take a long while to refill you can do several small drains and refills. The concern about long fills is the sun and plaster.

    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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