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Thread: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

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    Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    This is our first year with this pool and on the memory weekend in May we had a new liner put on our pool. Since then, there has been at least one spot where the liner has popped out at least 2-3" wide, and currently we have 6-7 pop outs one being over a foot long. The installer has been back 3-4 times to pop them in and there hasn't really been a 24 hour period without a pop out, as everytime they pop one in at least one spot pops out.

    I messaged him again a few days ago that we have 2-3 spots, one being one he just repaired. It's been 2 days and now we are up to 6-7 spots. I was told by someone else they should have put liner lock on the liner and when I asked them about it, they said some people do that but kids pull on it and once they start.

    He just messaged back they are coming on Monday and will "lock it in place on all suspect areas and every few feet throughout the pool". Is there good reason there isn't liner lock around the entire pool? (It's 21' x 43' pool, so it isn't something small nor standard).

    There is also holes in the bottom of the cement, they look like bear prints. One is a good size (6"x5" by 2-3" deep) and there is at least 2-3 others. Also a rock that is about 1" around. They are not leaking and the pool has an excellent seal, I haven't had to add any water in two months of using it daily. I am concerned it may be problems down the road. They said they would do an hour of floor work if it needed any before installing the liner. When I asked about this I was told it will be fine and it is because there was a lot of ground water when they were doing the liner. My gut feels they rushed since they were 2+ weeks late on doing the liner and it put them in the busiest weekends (couple days before memorial weekend).

    I asked about this before here, but I didn't get any good answers at the time, and as this goes on I feel less and less trusting of them. I went with these guys as my friend who does pools was booked well into late June at the time (this was in early April we put a deposit down) and these guys did the maintenance and work for the previous owners and we needed some help as we never owned a pool before and had no idea how everything worked. Even that was a pain, as they put tablets in the pool and said it was ok until they come back but they kept rescheduling it was well over 2 weeks before they came back and the pool was getting slimy and the chlorine was still below 0.5. At the time I knew nothing and they were going to guide me through everything. It was shortly after this I found out about TFP and have been maintaining it myself.
    Christopher

    21' x 43' IG 40K Gallon vinyl and concrete pool; liner: 2016; Hayward DE7220 filter; Maytronics M400; TFT-100; Speed-Stir

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    borjis's Avatar
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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    I don't understand why any vinyl installer wouldn't put liner lock in the track to secure it....just seems like a no brainer common sense wise.

    My new liner install was a tight fit and while I do have gaps from a few inches to 6 inches between pieces...all
    of the tight areas have liner lock with no gaps between them...no problems so far (almost a year old)

    Not sure about your other issue.
    16x32 IG Vinyl, 13,000 Gals. Hayward S-244T sand filter, SP2810X15 pump
    (1.5 HP motor) Raypak PR266AEN (266k btu) gas heater. TF-100 Test Kit.
    Dolphin E10 Cleaning Robot.

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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    It is common to install liner lock in small sections. It is intended to go around the entire pool, but it is a real pain and most installers don't want to go through the trouble. It sounds like, for your pool, it would make sense to do the entire perimeter though.

    As for your floor--if the stone is 1"x1"x1" tall then it needs to be taken care of. If you wait too long, the vinyl will get stiff and you won't be able to fix it. The liner will probably need to be reinstalled, but sometimes they can push the stone into the floor of the pool if it isn't too big. If they need to reinstall the liner, you can ask them to fix the impressions in the floor too.

    Hopefully that answered your questions. Good luck!
    Making Liners Since 1997
    Pool Liner Factory Outlet

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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    Quote Originally Posted by LinerMfgr View Post
    It is common to install liner lock in small sections. It is intended to go around the entire pool, but it is a real pain and most installers don't want to go through the trouble. It sounds like, for your pool, it would make sense to do the entire perimeter though.

    As for your floor--if the stone is 1"x1"x1" tall then it needs to be taken care of. If you wait too long, the vinyl will get stiff and you won't be able to fix it. The liner will probably need to be reinstalled, but sometimes they can push the stone into the floor of the pool if it isn't too big. If they need to reinstall the liner, you can ask them to fix the impressions in the floor too.

    Hopefully that answered your questions. Good luck!
    How likely is the rock going to cause a problem? I have at least 1 or 2 rocks. The likelihood of them fixing it I think is slim to none though. It's been a pain just getting them to fix the liner drooping down (they had to come back 7 times).
    Christopher

    21' x 43' IG 40K Gallon vinyl and concrete pool; liner: 2016; Hayward DE7220 filter; Maytronics M400; TFT-100; Speed-Stir

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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    It depends on the size/shape of the rock. If it is big and pointy you will have a problem. If it is small and smooth you won't have a problem. Anything in between will be some varying level of "a problem" Just keep in mind that you will be rubbing over this stone many times every time you vacuum the pool and the liner will wear out over time. Many installers will actually take a shop vac to remove all of the debris from the floor of the pool before installing the liner for this very reason. At the very least, the floor should have been swept. Having debris under the liner is a common reason to reinstall it. If you are on city water, it really isn't a big deal. If you need to have water trucked in, then it does become costly.
    Making Liners Since 1997
    Pool Liner Factory Outlet

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    borjis's Avatar
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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    Good grief they left debris (rocks) when the installed it? I would have called them on it immediately and demanded they fix that.
    16x32 IG Vinyl, 13,000 Gals. Hayward S-244T sand filter, SP2810X15 pump
    (1.5 HP motor) Raypak PR266AEN (266k btu) gas heater. TF-100 Test Kit.
    Dolphin E10 Cleaning Robot.

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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    Quote Originally Posted by LinerMfgr View Post
    It depends on the size/shape of the rock. If it is big and pointy you will have a problem. If it is small and smooth you won't have a problem. Anything in between will be some varying level of "a problem" Just keep in mind that you will be rubbing over this stone many times every time you vacuum the pool and the liner will wear out over time. Many installers will actually take a shop vac to remove all of the debris from the floor of the pool before installing the liner for this very reason. At the very least, the floor should have been swept. Having debris under the liner is a common reason to reinstall it. If you are on city water, it really isn't a big deal. If you need to have water trucked in, then it does become costly.
    I had to pay $1,000 to have the pool filled because we are on a well, and still had to use a good amount from the well.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I told them, and they said it was fine. I made a post here and on Reddit, but I never got a clear answer if it was a problem.
    Christopher

    21' x 43' IG 40K Gallon vinyl and concrete pool; liner: 2016; Hayward DE7220 filter; Maytronics M400; TFT-100; Speed-Stir

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    borjis's Avatar
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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    Right, they said it's fine because they probably don't want to deal with it....missing liner lock and rocks under the vinyl is not fine in my book.
    16x32 IG Vinyl, 13,000 Gals. Hayward S-244T sand filter, SP2810X15 pump
    (1.5 HP motor) Raypak PR266AEN (266k btu) gas heater. TF-100 Test Kit.
    Dolphin E10 Cleaning Robot.

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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    Quote Originally Posted by borjis View Post
    Right, they said it's fine because they probably don't want to deal with it....missing liner lock and rocks under the vinyl is not fine in my book.
    Thank you, I had that feeling as well. I'm seriously considering taking them to small claims. I spent the entire summer waiting on them to fix a droop in the liner due to it popping 1-4 hours after they left. I have asked them about the rocks and holes and was told it was "fine" and waited 3 months for them to finally fix the cover they were suppose to fix during the install. They were 2.5 weeks late on the install, said it would been done beginning of May and it wasn't done until near the end of May right before memorial weekend which is the busiest time for pool installers. When I contact them, it takes 2-4 days for a response, and that's usually cause I texted him a 2nd time at that point.
    Christopher

    21' x 43' IG 40K Gallon vinyl and concrete pool; liner: 2016; Hayward DE7220 filter; Maytronics M400; TFT-100; Speed-Stir

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    borjis's Avatar
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    Re: Is it common for new liners to keep falling off and holes in cement floor?

    sorry for your difficulties, hopefully you will prevail.

    The company that did my install was great (they're the best pool co in my area, I've tried all 4 and they were the most reliable)
    and communicating with them I'd get a response within a day.
    16x32 IG Vinyl, 13,000 Gals. Hayward S-244T sand filter, SP2810X15 pump
    (1.5 HP motor) Raypak PR266AEN (266k btu) gas heater. TF-100 Test Kit.
    Dolphin E10 Cleaning Robot.

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